STORAGE

G

GED

Inactive
Question 2. Once I preload all my cylinders, how long can I leave them before firing?
What I did my first time was load them and then I vacuum sealed them for a week.
Is it the moisture in the air or the corrosiveness that would be the problem for loading in advance? How long would be too long to pre load chambers?

I would like to load them (5 cylinders) at my leisure at home with a loader instead of at the range to save some time.

Question 3. Chain firing. If the ball seals the chambers (lead ring proves that) why do you have to also seal each chamber with a wax/Crisco barrier??

Sorry for the stupid questions, but I've never owned a BP weapon before and don't want to blow myself up or ruin the weapon. :D
 
chain detonation

You will get different opinions on this from people convinced they are right. You will need to decide after you read arguments for both sides. I suggest you search for chainfire, chain detonation and any other variant.....and come to your own conclusion. This is one that you won't forget if you have one. I haven't...yet... but I really try to expect that it could happen each time I pull the trigger.

Another big one is that if your pistol goes poof.... and not KABOOOM......you FREEZE and wait to see if you have a hangfire (delayed), and then after waiting, check to make sure the barrel doesn't have a ball stuck halfway.

Black powder is much more exciting than smokless!!

There are also discussions on loaded storage to search for if you wish. Most think that without moisture, there won't be a chemical reaction to cause corrosion....the old saw..keep your powder dry.
 
You are asking good questions

I am going to steer clear of the how long can they remain loaded question. I think you are safe for a relatively long time but I don't want to commit.

As regards Crisco it is a lube of only average quality. There are plenty of cheap recipes out there and before long you will have two or three posts.

The purpose of the Crisco over the ball is two fold.

It is a lubricant for the ball as to travels down the barrel.

It seals chambers that are adjacent to the one in battery to prevent hot gases from the fired chamber form getting into the powder in other chambers and lighting them off causing a chain fire event.

I personally believe that chain fire as often occur because of loose fitting caps or caps than have been pinched. But I doubt that any scientific studies have been done.

Crisco on a hot day turns a little runny. It is far better than "Bore Butter" but not as good as the hme recipes which will soon appear on this thread.
 
Round balls aren't always round.
A tight fitting one might not be actually sealing the chamber, especially if there's small imperfections in the chamber, too.
I use wads, just to be sure.
The few cross fires I've had were more surprising than damaging.
Not to worry.
There's plenty more where we came from. :)
 
I have wads also and they seem to be the most convenient to use. I bought a can of Crisco after watching a youtube video. Haven't used it yet.

In my starter kit I have felt wads and some waxy yellow looking "wads". Do they do the same thing or are they for different purposes?

It seems to me if you get a complete ring of lead, that the chamber would be sealed. Right/wrong?? Anyway I will still use some kind of seal - just to be better safe then sorry. Electricity and gun powder can bite you if you're not careful.

I'm more interested in the loaded long term question. Good idea or bad? Would vacuum sealing help?
 
Noob Here (Me, Not You)

It sounds like you are on the right track, although I have never done it.

Black powder (as well as smokeless powder) is hygroscopic in that it attracts moisture. In an ideal world, flooding the to-be-sealed package with inert (dry) nitrogen and then vacuum packing the cylinders would obviate any O2/moisture, but unless one has access to small nitrogen cylinders (I did through a medical gas supplier when I worked at a hospital) and regulators, the cost may be prohibitive. One might also entertain the idea of using a small packet of silica gel in the sealed bag.

I have no idea how any lubricant would last/react, but I like the idea of lubed wads under the ball. IMO, any ball of sufficient diameter to leave a complete ring of shaved lead when seated on a lubed wad in the cylinder is sufficient to preclude a chainfire from that end of the cylinder. Caps/nipples may be another story, but I sure as heck would not cap the cylinder until installed on the pistol.

Just my $.02 worth.

Jim
 
Sorry

Awful lot of typos in my previous post.

Anything you don't understand just ask.

I have a coupla home recipes for lube:

1. A mixture of beeswax and mutton tallow. Many people say that the proportions have to be specifically and accurately measured. I am more of the thought that you should mix it so that the consistency meets your needs.

2. I tried a mixture of beeswax and lard. I was not able to tell the difference in performance between that concoction and beeswax and mutton tallow. But there are shooters out there who swear there is a difference and they are probably right.

3. Wax rings from under toilets and Crisco. This was my "go-to" lube until I was shamed into trying mix number 1. I am not a purist and so this lube would work for me if I had nothing else. This is a recipe which goes back to the time when wax rings were really made of wax. That is no longer the case.

I shy away from pure Crisco because it is too runny on hot days.

I won't use Thompson's Bore Butter. It smells like a hospital and won't stay put. The guy who developed this product probably never had to use it. If he did he would either be too embarrassed to sell it or he would make it a better product.

There are other, more exotic recipes which primarily make use of additional ingredients added to mix number 1.

I am not a discriminating shooter so I can't recommend one over another.
 
As far as the ring....

One would certainly think that shaving a complete ring ensures a good seal but there are those who don't believe it. I don't know the truth and so I schmootz the chambers.

Only chainfire I ever had was (I am 99% certain) the result of pinching the cap.

If you are only talking about storing your cylinders for a week, you should not need to make any special accommodations.

The alternative is to get yourself a press and load the cylinders at the range. Unless you will never want to fire more than thirty shots.
 
I do have a cylinder press - the one that most people say isn't any good. :)

So far it works for me even if I have to keep adjusting it.

I think I'll just stick with the wads (felt or wax?) for now since I won't be firing it very often. Maybe 3 or 4 times a year. I have a lot more guns to play around with that aren't as time consuming to clean, but not as much fun to shoot. :)
 
I left an 1851 loaded with T7, .451 balls and capped (five chambers) for over a year. All five fired on the first try. That's not to say that your results will be the same.
 
Like N.E. Redneck I have had a revolver loaded and capped with old DuPont FFF, all 6, for over a year and all fired. I always have one loaded c&b revolver in the house. I "empty" it every couple weeks.
When loading it I use a card wad under a lubed wad to prevent powder contamination.
In a "tight spot" I trust my '51 Navy as much or more than a semiautomatic.
 
I had a 1858 remington loaded for a week because a part on my ramrod broke and I was waiting for the replacement. I went to fire it when I got the part and the powder didn't ignite, so I took the nipples off and put powder down the back and packed it in and the gun fired fine.
So I would suggest not keeping it loaded very long
 
Black powder has been known to last hundreds of years and still work, just don't contaminate it with oil.
When I load for storage I wipe out chambers with a Q-tip and blow out the nipples with air then use an over powder card wad, never had a miss fire except when a cap had fallen off.
 
I have had one charged and propperly sealed for three years. I dropped it in a puddle so I fired in the next day and I had to replace one cap. I have two in my gunlocker right now that have been charged for three years and they will fire no problem.

The trick is in the technique. I use an over powder wad a round ball that shaves a ring and an over ball wad and I put a bead of grease around the outside edges. I use #11 caps and just pinch them a bit and shove then on with a piece of trex so the caps are on snug.

I had a chain fire once. Fortunately only three chambers ignited at the same time but it still was a bit disconcerning having two round balls bouncing along the outside of the barrel of my ASM stainless 1860.
 
Storing loaded/chain fires

I've stored loaded BP pistols for extended periods without problems. I have two right now that are loaded since deer season last year. I do store them with the caps in place to keep moisture out. I don't have any kids here and don't let people handle my loaded firearms.

Unfired BP is not corrosive.

I agree with Doc here in that I believe most chain fires happen from poorly fitting caps. I did not say all.

I use a pre-lubed Wonder Wad over the powder and under the ball. Every shot the barrel is lubed and keeps the fouling soft and extra protection against sparks on the ball end of the cylinder. I don't like any grease etc. over the ball. Too messy and an extra step in the loading process. I also carry one of my BP pistols when deer hunting here in Michigan. They are subject to wide temperature changes and all kinds of weather. If they get warm, I don't want some kind of grease all over the inside of a holster. Never had a misfire or chain-fire when hunting. I have had misfires at the range, from a bad cap. I've never had a chain-fire, ever. (Knock on wood).

I have said this before and I'll say it again. When I get a new/used BP pistol, I install new Treso/AMPCO nipples (#11 cap) in it before I ever fire it. Everything I own takes the same cap. I don't even own any #10 caps. The caps fit very perfectly. I NEVER pinch caps. I believe this is just asking for trouble.

Anyway, I hope this helps, welcome to the forum and to the fun of BP!

All the best,

Birch
 
Question 3. Chain firing. If the ball seals the chambers (lead ring proves that) why do you have to also seal each chamber with a wax/Crisco barrier??
Click to expand...

I personally think that if you shave lead, and especially if you compress the ball into the powder, thus swaging the ball, you've got a pretty good gas-tight seal just from the bullet itself. I only put lube over the ball because it is required for N-SSA competition. Of course, it does help lubricate the bullet but for everything but the first shot most of the lube in the adjacent chamber is blasted away by the previous shot.

Chain fires can happen from loose balls or loose caps. There is a video on YouTube of intentional chain fires being made to happen using under-sized balls.
 
Thanks all. I still would like to know other then one being dry felt and the other being a wax disk, is there any difference between the wads or do they each have a different purpose?
What is more desirable, wad between powder and ball or over the ball - or one of each?
Just don't want to do anything wrong that might hurt me or the gun.

Thanks for the advice on putting the nipples on for storage. I didn't think of that end. Just a little concerned about putting nipples on before being on the range(in case I should drop it, etc.)
If I vacuum seal it then I shouldn't need to cap it.

Going back to the range in a couple weeks. I should be a little less stressed this time. I was a little nervous the first time, but with all the help I received here I should be better prepared.
PS: it is fun seeing all the sparks and smoke after firing. :D :D
 
hartcreek or others

"shove them on with a piece of trex so the caps are snug" ?? What is trex? All I can think of are dinosaurs. :)

Wooden dowel or something? At first I was thinking you were securing the cap with some new material..glue?..but upon more thought I think you were just stating what you were using to push the caps on. Think I misread it the first time.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top