Steyr M40!! Back from the range..

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by petej88:
You say the Steyr trigger upgrade is nasty? Are you sure you're not holding a grudge here :)[/quote]

No, petej88 -- one's preferences of how a trigger pull's felt can hardly be called a grudge.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by petej88:
In fact, with the .40 caliber, it's much more reliable and safer to shoot than a typical standard unsupported barrel of a Glock.[/quote]

Safer? Theoretically, may be. More reliable? Don't please -- reliability (and I assume it's the reliability to feed if we're talking about the chamber in particular) is in fact, slightly lower with tight chambers. If you only mean 6 o'clock support, on the other hand, it has nothing to do with reliability directly.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by petej88:
Just look at full power spent brass from a Glock and compare it to a Sig or a Steyr and you'll see what I mean. "Supported" is better, regardless of what Glock says.[/quote]

No, I won't see what you mean, petej88. And the reason is that I, myself, can show you brass from my Glock 23 and brass from all three of my Steyrs -- there is NO difference whatsoever.

petej88, please understand me correctly -- at some point, GSI had even offered me a refund for the pistol. Now, did you think I wouldn't take such opportunity if I was in a position of a person who simply purchased an unknown handgun, became disappointed in how it performed, and now, bashed it to the left and right just out of spite realizing he couldn't get rid of it? My decision to give the Steyr yet another chance and replace the gun second time was solely based on the fact that I really liked it. I still do.

But the problems never go away regardless how much we love something.
 
Emin,

You can't tell the difference in full power shot brass between a Steyr and a Glock? Yeah, right. Did you measure the brass with a set of calipers? Most people can't see a 4/1000" difference with their eyes alone. And that's a hell of a difference, especially if you reload. In fact it's a hell of a difference in factory ammo as well.

In fact I have such faith in the above statement from shooting Glock .40's in every known model for the last several years, that I'll make a bet with you right now, two to one odds. I lose, I pay you $200. You lose, you pay me just $100:

You meet me in Portland, OR with your factory standard Glock barrel (no funny business now; I will check). We will shoot the same full power ammo in your Glock and my Steyr. We will measure the brass. The Glock brass will have a lower diameter of .431 - .433. The Steyr brass will measure .4275 - .430. In other words, the worst Steyr brass measurement is basically better then the best Glock measurement. Each extra 1/000" is very significant for brass life and safety, especially if there may be a brass defect or overcharge, etc.

Like I said Emin, I feel for your problems and realize you like the Steyr at least at the engineering level for now. I'm I'm certainly not saying that I don't believe you. And your feedback is important.

But like I said, I'm not having any of your problems. My Steyr works great. I would be glad to prove it to you. And I can bring my calipers along too.

I suppose we can keep hashing this out on the different forums so people think that hundreds of people are having problems and hundreds of people like 'em.


[This message has been edited by petej88 (edited October 18, 2000).]
 
I seem to feel that history is replaying itself.

I seem to recall when Glocks came on, people were saying "What are you, stupid? Buy a real gun, get a Sig, it's made of metal, the way a gun should be. Don't buy a Tupperware, it won't be reliable when you need it to be."

No gun is 100% reliable. If you believe that, then you haven't taken basic probability. But so far, how can I say that Steyr's are reliable when I've yet to have one jam on me?

Also, I've seen KB! from brass that has a hole at 6 o'clock. So don't tell me all brass comes out of a Glock and Steyr equally.

If it wasn't for that fact, I'd own a Glock instead of a Steyr right now.

Glock owners happy, it's their right. Steyr owners happy, they are on shakey unproven grounds. WHY?

My Steyr is as reliable as anything else I've shot. I've shot Glocks, Sigs, HK's, and Rugers, and none of them have jammed on me either. So when I'm batting 1000, how can I say one is more reliable than another?

As for the Glock endurance test. That means HIS gun is good, that doesn't mean that there isn't a possibility that the Glock I get isn't a lemon.

Search the archives, there are plenty of people who are sending their Glocks back for repair. So does that mean all Glocks are unreliable? Not in the least bit.

Some of you are falling into a "projection" fallacy ...

Albert
 
Speaking of Glock lemons:

I've probably owned over 20 Glocks (trade-ins, and then buying them again) over the last several years. But last year I did have a problem with a brand new Glock 30, a model I really like a lot.

The slide would not stay locked back when the magazine was empty. I had two Glock armorers and one advance armorer look at it. Nothing could get the slide to lock back. I then sent the gun to Glock. A month later I got it back and guess what? It was slightly better, but still had the same problem. I sent it back again and guess what. Glock replaced the lemon Glock 30 for a brand new one, which worked fine.

Do I think Glock sucks now. Of course not. There have been quite a few Glock Kb's. But then again there are millions of them out there. I believe that more American police departments use Glock than any other brand. That's got to be saying something.

So the bottom line for me is that I don't care if someone doesn't like the Steyr for one reason or another. I might be interested why and I'll try to respect their views. But I bought a Steyr and use it because I trust my life with it. It has never let me down. By the way, a number of police agencies are in line for getting Steyr pistols right now.

And Emin, maybe you might try out a Steyr in a few years to see if it works any better for ya :)
 
I went and looked at, and handled an M40 today, because I should have done the same thing with a Glock in '86, when I was shooting a 1911 Colt Gold Cup. My initial impression, a quality piece, heavier than a Glock, fit and finish about equal, trigger is much shorter and lighter, the weapon points naturally high, and higher is better, but the trapezoidal sights are just impossible for combat as the rear disappears into the front. It all looks like one sight, and you have to have the front sight in focus. Mags are 10, probably 16 for real, as they have the bottom blocker. The chamber indicator device and the extra safety lever lock device I can do without. I hope someone brings an M40 to a match sometime, so I can crank out 150 rounds straight, and see how it feels.
 
petej88,

Your Steyr works for you and hasn't malfunctioned to date -- wonderful, enjoy it. Yours is, in fact, a reliable handgun that has gone through quality control with no problems and found a lucky owner -- you. What else a shooter could possibly want. Honestly (and with no sarcasm whatsoever, please believe me), I say I'm glad for you :)

For me, handguns are merely tools. I don't really adore my screwdrivers or my electric drill. I stick to what's proven by the record of an enormous length, proven in years and years of use.

I don't and, most likely, never will own, say, a Sig 210, a full size HK, or a full size 1911 -- they're not really designed as carry sidearms, and if I can't carry it for its size, there goes its use for me. All my handguns are CCW, with one experimental exception. I bought the Steyr knowing that I wasn't going to carry it. Home defense, may be. However, after realizing the problems aren't going away, "got myself a Glock" for both purposes :) Thus, every single handgun I've acquired for CCW has earned its reputation through very hard labor out there, on the field. I'll accept no less.

No, I don't really mind being a "beta" tester for something that comes out on the market -- it has to earn its reputation somehow too. My point is that even if I had NO malfuctions with my M40 at all even after putting through a couple of thousand rounds, I still would be somewhat hesitant to carry it -- there's always "what if" that none of us can afford.

True, may be my Steyr would be a 200% reliable in that case (like any handgun would prove to be after it's been fired 2,000 times with no misfires -- I mean, come on!), may be even more than my particular Glock 23; nevertheless, it's my Glock I'll have my piece of mind with. It's just after being a Glock...uh-m, disliker for a very long time, I finally came to it. And stayed.

What if it malfunctions too? No gun is 100%. Well, I'll take the risk.

Regards,
Emin

P.S. Do you usually take your caliper to the range :)?

[This message has been edited by Emin (edited October 19, 2000).]
 
emin, I hear you, and those are sound arguements.

For that reason, I think if I were lucky enough in California to get a CCW, I would probably carry a Revolver. You want to up the reliability scale some more? There you go.

Give the Steyr a chance, if for no other reason that how aggressive GSI is trying to listen to what the customers are saying, and doing what they ask.

Also, they have been quick to address any problem(s) and correct them as soon as we have voiced them. That's all you can ask from a company.

I'll let you guys know when my gun gets a new trigger..

Albert
 
9X45,

Actually the LEO version ofthe M40 magazine is 12, as opposed to the civilian 10 round version. This is somewhat similar to the Sigs and the Glock 32, generally.

Emin,

Peace Brother :) I respect your views and am glad you have a tool that you trust and that works for you. And frankly, I'm glad I have a tool that I trust and works for me.

Actually, I separate the fired brass on the range. And then I measure them with calipers when I get home :) Usually, each gun model also has very distinctive, unique primer dents.

As you know, there are occasionally flame threads on Glocks, etc where one side swears by them and the other side.... --- well, you get the picture. Even after all this time, Glock threads are some of the bloodiest on the net :)

cheers,
pete

[This message has been edited by petej88 (edited October 19, 2000).]
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top