Spotlighting?!?

If you don't believe that it's unethical to shoot an animal effectively rendered blind by a spotlight, then where do you draw the line?
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Do you believe that the bovine from whence your last cut of beef came from was killed in a fair and ethical manner?

Very little in life is 'fair,' is it fair when the lion kills the gazelle, when the hawk swoops down on the rabbit?

I'll agree that some game animals are killed for trophies in a less than sportsman like manner, but if I switch on a spotlight and kill a wild hog for a cookout, how is that less fair or ethical than the way hogs are killed at the slaughter house?

Oh by the way, I don't care how many online polls they do, ethics and fairness are still highly subjective.
 
Why does spotlighting work? It works because you blind the animal for a second stopping it from running away. Let me see you run away when you are blind. It like shooting fish in a barrel. Nocturnal animals have eyes that collect more light than ours. When you overpower their eyes with a bright light it affects the numerous rods in their eye. This is what you use against them. Fair chase? I have more respect for any animal and myself to shoot something like that. It's true every man has his set of ethics and some are are lower than others. Hunting is about one thing and that is self control. You decide what standard you are going to hold yourself to. And even if it's legal some people could still see it is as unethical. I have hunted rabbits since I could walk. I have shot more rabbits than any one I know, close to a thousand. Every one I shot I ate. Both of my Grandfathers and my Dad had a deep love for small game hunting. They taught me that taking an animal no matter how small required showing the animal respect. Letting them suffer or shooting animals that are not going to be eaten I think is wrong. Spotlighting is right below that.
 
"But i feel better that i know now that i was legal."

Your Warden told you that you can shoot out of a truck??!!
From you previous posts, I got the impression you and your buddy were riding around in a truck and taking turns at shooting and spotting.
Did he tell you that you could shoot while on a state road too??

Somehow, I don't feel like what you have been doing is legal.
 
Don`t think its a good idea to try to confuse the issue`s with the morality factor cause to be quite frank 'the judge you end up in front of could care less whats morally right to any of us'. The fact is the OP was doing this and stated he didn`t care whether it was legal or not. There`s no way you can justify that frame of mind morally or ethically. Again the hunting laws are in place to protect the animals and rights of people. Thats why they`re different from state to state. Just wish the fines for poaching and trespassing in this state would graduate to a felony with mandatory jailtime. IMO,The most sickening thing in this thread is the mindset of the OP. Its that kind of attitude that moral and ethical hunters can`t and should not try to defend. Again, hope OP re-evaluates his immoral and un-ethical thoughts when it comes to hunting legal before he`s sitting in front of a judge.
 
Do you believe that the bovine from whence your last cut of beef came from was killed in a fair and ethical manner?
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Absolutely. I use a local Mennonite butcher that slaughters on site. They've been in a head gate before and think a vet is going to vaccinate them. They don't understand what's coming and never knew what hit them, essentially the same way I would prefer to always take game, in a perfect world.

is it fair when the lion kills the gazelle, when the hawk swoops down on the rabbit?
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I’ll ask that you report all hawks and lions using spot lights, okay? ;) Hawks and lions don't have options or make decisions about what is ethical, and an ethical person doesn't derive standards or dismiss fairness based on what animals do. Our prisons are full of "animals" who didn't know the difference, and not one of them is a lion or a hawk.

Ethics and fairness are subjective. I wouldn’t fault hunters in a culture that only have clubs to hunt with, but I have options and wouldn’t want to drink from their well or beat women the way they do, either. That’s my cultural bias and I don’t think my choice not to do as they do is a bad thing just because it’s a “subjective” decision.

Most of these issues are defined by law. But what matters to many of us isn’t merely a question of what is legal, but what is right.
 
They've been in a head gate before and think a vet is going to vaccinate them.
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OK I see, if you trick animals who are caged and trusting, because you have been feeding and caring for them, then you kill them it is moral and ethical. Gotcha, now I understand, also I'm sure the fact that you don't have to watch it, or do the actual killing helps assuage your 'moral' and 'ethical' sensibilities.


They don't understand what's coming and never knew what hit them
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So an animal who has a spotlight turned on it, knows what is coming?
I bet they are terrorized and say 'oh no, the ruthless hunter is going to shoot us' :rolleyes:

Most of these issues are defined by law. But what matters to many of us isn’t merely a question of what is legal, but what is right.
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You have for some reason justified in your own mind that, feeding, nurturing and providing medical care to animals, then killing them for their meat is 'right', fair and acceptable. I think that it is perfectly fine as well. Man used his superior brain power, ingenuity and technology to provide himself with meat.

That is exactly what man does when he uses a spotlight and a firearm to harvest meat.

Somehow you fail to see the difference.
 
By the way i am never on public roads we are either in fields or on roads that the farmer/rancher had made and we never shoot towards livestock or buildings, The whole idea of saying "i don't care if its legal or not" was just a statement i was at the time trying to find out if it was legal or not! I don't live like that nor do appreciate that you guys/gals think that just because i said one thing that didn't set right that i am immediately on the chopping block for being a poacher, unethical, A**hole...
I have never been arrested or even pulled over for any reason i am one who follows the laws and i disrespect those who don't.
So please lay off on the ethics of spotlighting or whether you think what i do on my spare time is wrong in your eyes.
Bones
 
If you would have read the previous post you would have seen that i said that i was just saying "I don't care if it was legal or not". I said it being sarcastic like saying "i would be a millionare if i had a dime every time i heard that!" that is also a sarcastic remark. I follow the law just as much as anyone else. And i am getting sick of people taking pot shots at me.
 
Bones, it was your responsibility(as an ethical hunter) to know whether it was legal or not to spotlight BEFORE doing it. According to your #1 post you didn`t know whether spotlighting was legal or not. Just yesterday @9:00 pm, according to your later post, you just got back from DNR finding out if what you are doing is legal. You take these "pot shots" as you will but please consider these "pot shots" as attempts from people here that are trying to help you. Want to give you an example: Two guys that live close to me were busted this year spotlighting deer. It cost them their truck,guns,hunting previliges for 5yrs. and $14,000 in fines. Hope some of these "pot shots" will make you learn your local hunting laws so you know whats legal(or not) beforehand. May be a good idea to review the penalties for breaking those laws too!
 
...also I'm sure the fact that you don't have to watch it, or do the actual killing helps assuage your 'moral' and 'ethical' sensibilities.
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Huh? I lived on a farm during my youth. I live on my own farm now. I've slaughtered livestock and been present when others slaughtered livestock. (Your psychic abilities suck; I'm not calling your 900 number any more.)

So an animal who has a spotlight turned on it, knows what is coming?
I bet they are terrorized and say 'oh no, the ruthless hunter is going to shoot us'
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Seems like a weird extrapolation from context, but if you say so? :confused:

... Man used his superior brain power, ingenuity and technology to provide himself with meat.

That is exactly what man does when he uses a spotlight and a firearm to harvest meat.

Somehow you fail to see the difference.
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Bwaaaaaaaa-hahahaha! I'm the one failing to make a distinction? Trust me; I know the difference between 'Hunting' with an ethical standard, farm production and slaughter, or for that matter, what an exterminator does. Hunting is the context from which Fair Chase emerged, and where I thought the discussion in a 'hunting' forum would go. Sometimes context is everything and most people get that. Some don't. <shrug>

This is about "harvesting meat?" Ooops! My bad.
 
LateNightFlight said:
Hunting is the context from which Fair Chase emerged, and where I thought the discussion in a 'hunting' forum would go. Sometimes context is everything and most people get that. Some don't.
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Well, by all means lets keep the discussion limited to 'hunting' or at least your definition of it.

LateNightFlight said:
Trust me; I know the difference between 'Hunting' with an ethical standard, farm production and slaughter, or for that matter, what an exterminator does. Hunting is the context from which Fair Chase emerged, and where I thought the discussion in a 'hunting' forum would go.
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LateNightFlight said:
The most widely accepted definition of "fair" chase was provided by the Boone and Crocket Club: “Fair chase is the ethical, sportsmanlike and lawful pursuit and taking of free ranging wild game animals in a manner that does not give the hunter an improper or unfair advantage over such animals.”
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Well, according to my new club, the Lewis and Clark club, using high powered rifles and in fact any modern weapon to kill sacred free ranging game animals is highly unfair and unethical. You must use a flint lock muzzle loader or preferably a long bow to meet our definition of fairness and ethics. Furthermore taking sacred game animals as trophies, not just for meat, using a scoring system to rate them and judge them against other peoples kills is beyond repugnant and definitely proves moral and ethical inferiority.

If you don't follow our rules and use the excuse that high powered rifles and other modern weapons are legal where you live and trophy taking is a legitimate 'sport' and/or that you don't feel neither is unfair or unethical, well thats fine. However it clearly demonstrates that you have an inferior sense of morals, fairness, ethics and most of all respect for sacred game animals than we have.

I'm sure you think the above is ridiculous, I'm misconstruing the B&C ethics rule and I just don't understand what real fairness and true ethics are. Well, lets see...

LateNightFlight said:
“Fair chase is the ethical, sportsmanlike and lawful pursuit and taking of free ranging wild game animals in a manner that does not give the hunter an improper or unfair advantage over such animals.”
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According to the Boone and Crocket Club definition of fair chase it says 'lawful' pursuit, so I could argue that spotlighting is legal where I live, you could counter that it says you must not have an improper or unfair advantage, OK fine, then I'll go back to my fictional Lewis and Clark club and say that modern high powered rifles give you an unfair advantage and trophy taking is wrong.

Now we can go on and on like this, but the truth is it is all highly subjective and your rules of fairness and ethics that you follow were written by a club that exists for and promotes trophy hunting. Last time I checked Daniel Boone and Davy Crocket didn't shoot game animals for the size of their rack or how high they scored on a points system.
 
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