Something that happened today

M

Miss Demeanors

New member
Sorry for all the posts but I figured this story will fit in perfect here. My little girl (5) sometimes sits with me when I am at the computer. The other day I came here and she was asking me what the little target things were (the cross that you see through the scope), I told her that it was used on guns to see your target. Yesterday evening she actually drew in on a piece of paper. LOL Well today she had her swim class. She is old enough to dress herself, so she got ready all be herself and we left for class. We get in the class and she takes off her sweats (her bathing suit underneath). I was talking to a friend when I heard a disruption. I turned around and everyone was looking at my little girl. Well it turns out she decided to draw red targets all over her legs! :) I asked her what is that, why did you draw on yourself? She says (very loudly) those are for your guns mommy!! Ok trying to keep a straight face as the other moms are now staring me down. I take out a babywipe and try to get some of it off. She goes in the pool and the other moms are huddled around talking about me, like I cant hear them they are only 5 feet away. I just chose to ignore them. I am trying to watch my daughter. Well the one instructor gave me a dirty look when my daughter had said that, and it seemed she had an attitude with my daughter also. My girl is having a little bit of trouble going under water, and that instructor was getting annoyed with it. It comes time for all the kids to jump into the water one by one. They get to my girl, and she starts crying. She didnt want to jump. Usually they will just go on to the next kid. Well that one instructor got OUT of the water and picked her up and practically forced her to go in. At this point I stood up, she was using way too much force. As I see my daughter screaming and the lady grabbing her harder I start to jump the little gate. My sister pulled me back because she knew I was mad. So I start yelling at the lady to let her go, she doesnt want to jump, get your hands off my kid NOW! By now the entire community center is looking. The other guy instructor told the lady instructor to stop. Finally she did. I sat down and tried to cool off. The class ends. The lady instructor walks past and mumbles "Kids and guns what a waste". The fumes that were coming out of my head must have been seen down the block. I calmly told the lady if there is a problem then lets take it outside (no, not to fight just didnt want to argue in front of the kids) ;). She ignored me and walked to the locker room. I just got dried my girl off and left. This lady obviously took her anger out on my little girl, and I dont like it at all. She is lucky my sister held me back thats all I can say.(I am not a violent person but if you push me hard enough I get a little 'tempered') My question is, do I contact like an administrator there? Do I contact the owner of the center? I dont want my little girl near that lady again. I really dont care about the other moms and what they think, I just care that my daughter is treated like every other kid there. Im not sure what to do. She really does like the class, I hate to take her out because of this but I dont want that lady to get away with what she did. I cant tell you how.....mad..I am right now. I personally thought the drawings were kind of funny, I dont even own a gun is what made it even funnier, it was just a funny thing. But for an adult to lash out at a kid like that, I dont think thats right. Any suggestions on what kind of action to take? Thanks, sorry for the rant.
 
Miss Demeanors

Your story kind of steamed me up a bit too. Now "assuming" you accurately portrayed the incident (I have no reason to doubt, just carefully think if other impartial witnesses would corroberate your version) I would not let it rest. I would contact the individual that runs the center and report the incident. This has nothing to do with guns or gun rights, rather, it is child abuse. This should never be tolerated in any shape or form.

The woman instructor should not be allowed near children if she allows her emotions towards a parent to affect her treatment of the child.

Do it for all kids. Don't drop the issue.

Just my opinion.

James
 
Yep...I'd contact the admin there and make a formal complaint in writing. Outline the story, point out that you don't own a firearm and that these people immediately jumped to conclusions due to what your daughter said, point out that she is a bit reticent about certain things and that the instructor became frustrated and obviously let her/his bias give validation to use physical force on your daughter. Send a cc (copy) to the superior agency above this person....
The point being to begin an official "file" on the offending instructor. This person is dangerous with kids and obviously allows political beliefs to override common decency to children. Your girl may now have some fears about swimming due to this.
Never give back equal when messed with Miss D...escalate.



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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes" RKBA!
 
So sorry to hear that MissD. Now you are really feeling what it is like to be "demonized" by an ignorant liberal - just because thwey think you even own a gun.

I have to agree with Jimmy. Contact the school administrator and tell your story without any mention of the "gun" comment. It doesn't matter if she said she was from Mars. The woman's behavior is unacceptable no matter what was said.

That is no way to build on a child's confidence. Good luck.

Oh, BTW, I thought your daughter's comment was great.

CMOS


[This message has been edited by CMOS (edited November 18, 1999).]
 
I agree that instructor should not be allowed near your child again. If she can't seperate her anger at you from your child this person has no business around children. Fun is fun and little kids are well you know.. but there is no excuse for this type of behavior from an adult after all you didnt bring a gun to swim class..and even if you had SO WHAT!
 
Miss D,

I know its difficult but try to calm down. I don't blame you one bit for being mad. If someone tried that kind of crap with my son I would have the same reaction.

I can't give you much advice from experience as my son is only 16 months old. I think I would try contacting an administartive figure at the facility and request a meeting with them and the instructor. It might also help for you to bring a friend for support and to witness the conversation. I may be paranoid but I might go so far as to tape the conversation.

There is no excuse for this type of behavior from someone who works closely with children. That person needs to leave their political ideals at the door and do their damn job!


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I Love My Country, But I Fear My Government!


[This message has been edited by 2tapcm (edited November 18, 1999).]
 
MissDemeanors,

Although you didn't indicate whether you paid for the instruction or opportunity for your daughter to be instructed, it sounds as though you have the basis for a lawsuit. BTW, there are lots of hungry lawyers where you live...
 
It's pretty bad that someone who works with kids could get an attitude with them just because of something they drew. A huge part of a teacher's, or instructor's job is to be patient and understanding (especially when working with kids).

It sounds like this particular so-called instructor needs to work in a prison. I think a formal complaint would be the best route to take.
 
mis deminors, I know a little how you feel.
Some thing somewhat similar happened to me, twice.I know what it feels like to have a flock (as in sheeple) of anti gun liberals all staring at me like I am about to open fire on them or something.It is at times like this that I always launch into a discussion of the right to keep & bear arms and the police dept being not legally responsible for a persons protection.And that victims can not even sue the police for lack of protection. Then I ask them if life is sacred. They answer yes and I ask them ,if life is precious, why would they be willing to deligate their life to a bunch of strangers
(the cops) who take 30 minutes or longer to respond and that when they finally do show up
dont know the good guys from the bad guys and have to waiste another 15 minutes just sorting that out.Then I say "call an ambulance,call a cop and call for pizza. The pizza takes 20 minutes to cook and usually arrives first." By this time ,1/3 of them have moved away,1/3 look embarased and the other 1/3 start asking me questions about guns.I tell them that in states where law abiding citizens have the the right of conceled carry, crime always drops 10 % and in Washington dc where all guns are banned to the law abiding, every criminal has two guns & washington dc is the murder capital of the world ;it is a a safe, gun free working environment for criminals. The criminals know that they have the only guns and that we are at their mercy.The other time I had this happen to me ,I was in the dentists chair to have a root canal and the dentist started in on me when he read in my file that I ran a gun shop for a living. I started with my routine (above)but this dentist just kept starring at me like we would stare at Bill Klinton proclaming gun Konfiscation by executative order; so I shut up and got out of the chair and said to him : I am
sorry but I dont think I can allow you to work on my teeth in light of your deep political convictions and feelings toward me.I am afraid I must look for another
dentist.I will not honor any bill you might send me for this, as you have not actually done any work and I am afraid that you might take out your political convictions on my teeth.Goodbye ,sir.He Never billed me ,so I guess I called it right. Some dentists might be sadists and maybe he thought that if he hurt me working on my root canal, that I would put out a gun and stick it under his chin.I was not carrying at the time. Liberals do not understand good mature adult judgement and tollerance of others and respect for other's rights because many of them have none themselves.If they did , they would probably-in many cases - be republicans
or pro-gun democrats.


In an earlier post on this string some-
one mentioned about if you had brought a gun to the swimming class--SO What__ I assume
that the pool was on school property--- gun free school zones and voilation of unconstitutional federal law is so what.
Just thought I'd point that out, hehe!

I would definately take up that swimming instructor's abuse of your child with the swimming program administrator. Thatinstructer could be dangerious if / when she looses it again with another kid.
She deserves whatever she gets for being so unprofessional as to let her feelings be taken out on a kid. Well, its almost time for me to teach another pistol permit class. More ccw for us!

Do what you CAN.
Conn CAN opperater http://thematrix.acmecity.com/digital/237/cansite/can.html
 
Miss D, I would protest in writing, then, if nothing is done in a week, have a lawyer protest in writing. You'll be surprised how well that works.

It's funny, we're (gun enthusiasts) supposed to be the violent ones, yet this instructor was assaulting a 5 yr old because she was anti-gun. The older I get, weirder I realize people really are.
 
Not much left to be said except, don't feel bad about going to an administrator about this woman BUT--give her one more chance to discuss it with you. Don't threaten her with the administrator or she'll just start mouthing what she thinks you want to hear, just offer to discuss it with her. At the very least, inform her that you are taking the step of informing the administrator.

If you don't do this, the rest of the staff and possibly the administrator will hold it against you. IMHO, they're right. She has the right to know. I don't think you'd knowingly go over her head just to be harsh but many people simply never think of this step.

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Don

"Its not criminals that go into schools and shoot children"
--Ann Pearston, British Gun Control apologist and moron
 
Beware of escalation: might you lose your child? If taken into court, consider a judge's reaction to: "her daughter drew targets all over herself and said 'they're for mommy's guns'. The horror! What horrible home life leads to a child happily marking herself for getting shot? Surely the mother is unfit!" You'll have a hard time explaining that away.

The lady in question is a jerk. Simply get yourself and your child away from her. If asked by appropriate people (i.e. her bosses), just comment that she was physically abusive, reacted badly to a misunderstanding of a child's comments, and intolerant, and that you can't let your child be in her presence for fear of your child's physical and emotional well-being.
 
And to think, this is the same type person who wants to get rid of guns "for the children."
Definately report this woman. Any person who takes out their personal opinion about a parent on a five year old has absolutely no business working with children. If administration seems uninterested, quietly mention that you may discuss this with a lawyer or the media, then get up and head for the door. You'd be surprised how co-operative they can suddenly become. Child abuse is nothing to mess around with and even rumors can kill a business.

BTW: I think you did pretty good, I'd have probably ended up in handcuffs.
 
I would also add that I would not want my child exposed to political ideas that I do not promote at home. The girl is there to learn how to swim. PERIOD. Anything that the instructor tries to teach outside of that context is an interference in parental rights. I do not want your instructor teaching religion, about abortion, about morals, about sex, about drugs, about courtesy, or her views on guns, she is there to teach swimming and that is all. It is a parents RIGHT to endoctrinate their own child the way they see fit, provided it is not damaging to the child, and guns are still legal, so if the instructor doesn't like them she can keep her opinions and attitude to herself.
 
Miss D-
I agree with the complaint in writing. But I'd stay away from the whole gun/target issue...it puts you on the defensive.

Report the woman's treatment of your little girl factually and non-emotionally. That's what the real complaint is...not the woman's distaste of firearms. Provide witnesses including your sister and the other coach that intervened.

Let the bimbo trip herself up by talking about "targets" on your daughter's legs and revealing her anger at seeing them. They can be explained easily and truthfully. Let her come out the nut job. It's what she is.

Take The High Road!
Rich

[This message has been edited by Rich Lucibella (edited November 19, 1999).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>"Beware of escalation: might you lose your child? If taken into court, consider a judge's reaction to: "her daughter drew targets all over herself and said 'they're for mommy's guns'. The horror! What horrible home life leads to a child happily marking herself for getting shot? Surely the mother is unfit!" You'll have a hard time explaining that away."[/quote]

ctdonath: This is fear-mongering, and just plain wrong. My monther is with Child Protective Services, and if you had any clue how hard it really is to get removals from the real baddies, you wouldn't say it in this case. I know she's in another state, but what does the hypothetical judge have to go on? That a little girl said a silly and slightly embarrassing thing in public? That a girl drew concentric circle designs on her body? That a girl made allusions to guns not even extent?

Others are pushing for completely ignoring the gun issue. Um, guys? Don't you think it'll be raised by the instructor? Further, her remark about "what a waste" after mentioning "Kids and guns..." is very pertanent. Some of you would have Miss D. pretend that it didn't come up, which implies that she does have something to hide, and should be ashamed. Even if Miss D. did own a gun, she'd be in the right, but this simplifies things, some.

Frankly, Miss D., you explained it beautifully to us. No extra elaboration-- you just explained how a little girl could act silly (<gasp!> Like... a little girl!?!). This is to be taken out on the parent and then upon the little girl? We now fall within the category of out-freaking-rageous.

E S C A L A T E ! ! !

(BTW, I think I might omit my needing to be restrained by my sister, if I were you. Everyone here would've needed it, too, but it is again an issue which can complicate things.)

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Will you, too, be one who stands in the gap?

Matt




[This message has been edited by Long Path (edited November 19, 1999).]
 
heh. My brother taught me how to swim. Took my suit off and threw it in the water at a public pool when I was 7. Embarassment can overcome fear.

Miss D, you come a long way! A year ago would you have been one of the group discussing the matter? Again Jeff is giving the best advice. Your family values are for you to decide, not anyone else. The instructor acted like any bully,picking on a weaker person. I would go elsewhere, after telling the owner exactly why I am going elsewhere.



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CCW for Ohio action site.
http://www.ofcc.net
Do what you C.A.N.
http://thematrix.acmecity.com/digital/237/can.html
 
I am glad I wasn't faced with this situation. When it comes to my kids, I have little restraint... I would have been all over those jackasses. Verbally, Legally and if needed Physically.

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"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." - Sigmund Freud
RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE
 
Miss D. My thoughts "Let there be Jehad!!!!"

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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
 
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