So much anger
- Thread starter Judge Blackhawk
- Start date
Steve Smith
New member
Wow, taking a few days off sure changes your perspective. I'll just take a moment here, and leave you alone. I was under the understanding that there BB's were for people to ask questions and get answers from others. When the question comes up about Kimber, I tell my story. Some people don't like my story, and I'm sure some don't even believe me...but that's up to you guys. The bottom line is, when someone gives their opinion, just let it happen. If someone says something that you don't like, don't try to fight them on it, because what they're telling you makes a lot of since to them, and they'll just fight back. That's why we're on this particular thread today. Yes, I'll save up for a gun by Brian Bilby, and I'm sure I'll be pleased, and I've learned a lot from "custom-production" gun , makers. The guns I own now work all the time, but they're not custom, and it'll be a while 'till I have a real one. Please have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!
[This message has been edited by Frontsight! (edited December 24, 1999).]
[This message has been edited by Frontsight! (edited December 24, 1999).]
Frontsight!, I think the mistake you're making is, you assume that if someone disagrees with you, they are "fighting" you. You had a bad experience with Kimber. That's fine, no one is calling you a liar. But when you say "I had a bad experience with Kimber, so Kimber is a bad company" then people will and should disagree with you. I had a bad experience with Para Ordnance, but they are not a bad company for that one bad experience.
It isn't your relating your story that ruffles feathers, it's overgeneralization. And of course the sort of chest-beating for Colt that a certain person who shall remain nameless does so shamelessly...<g>
It isn't your relating your story that ruffles feathers, it's overgeneralization. And of course the sort of chest-beating for Colt that a certain person who shall remain nameless does so shamelessly...<g>
Lowrider is absolutely correct.
Read his response again!
Seems like there are some overly sensitive people out there.
What you've read about Kimber is mostly based on personal experiences. Most guys don't make this stuff up for the fun of it. If a company treats you like crap, they deserve honest reporting of criticism in any public forum.
Read his response again!
Seems like there are some overly sensitive people out there.
What you've read about Kimber is mostly based on personal experiences. Most guys don't make this stuff up for the fun of it. If a company treats you like crap, they deserve honest reporting of criticism in any public forum.
Peter M. Eick
New member
I read this commentary and I have followed the Kimber threads. I too was interested in the Kimber's because they are basically half the costs of my Baer's, so if they were better then the springfields and colts, why not buy them over another custom 1911?
What I got out of all of this discussion and the problems with the Kimbers is that I should buy another Baer and be glad that I can do it.
On a philosphical note, I look to this forum to track trends and comments. (Please follow me on this one). Notice that Glocks always get good reviews other then the 40 KB problem. Notice that the SIG's always get good reviews. Notice that the Interarms Walthers almost always get panned along with recent colts.
Now when you look at Kimber last year the were the super gun, the new "glocks" they could do no wrong, yet over the last 6 months, more and more problems have shown up.
So, from a casual observer standpoint, one can see Kimber may be a company to be cautious with and maybe even consider avoiding while the support of Glock and Sig continues right one.
Just one man's perspective.
ps: I do not own a glock, sig or kimber, so no hidden agendas
What I got out of all of this discussion and the problems with the Kimbers is that I should buy another Baer and be glad that I can do it.
On a philosphical note, I look to this forum to track trends and comments. (Please follow me on this one). Notice that Glocks always get good reviews other then the 40 KB problem. Notice that the SIG's always get good reviews. Notice that the Interarms Walthers almost always get panned along with recent colts.
Now when you look at Kimber last year the were the super gun, the new "glocks" they could do no wrong, yet over the last 6 months, more and more problems have shown up.
So, from a casual observer standpoint, one can see Kimber may be a company to be cautious with and maybe even consider avoiding while the support of Glock and Sig continues right one.
Just one man's perspective.
ps: I do not own a glock, sig or kimber, so no hidden agendas
Steve Smith
New member
I will post this last time on this thread, and that's it. I not only had problems with a PRODUCT, but I had problems with the COMPANY itself, so therefore, I can say that from MY perspective, they are conducting business poorly, period. I am going to drop this now, but if someone asks what I think of Kimber, they're going to hear it. Again, have a Merry Christmas.
One thing I admire about this forum is its diversity. We have rednecks and we have intellectuals. People who are thoughtful and people who spray and pray. Kinda like life.
I get annoyed by Barreta Boy, but I've got to admit it has more to do with his wanting to be a "peace officer" than for what he stirs up here.
Let's all take a deep breath. Judge, don't run away. There are plenty of people here who want a good dialog. There are, of course, people who don't. (I haven't heard from Randy Garrett or Peter Pi lately, after they got a little heat!)
We have a great forum, and let's work hard to keep it that way. We can and will police our own.
My thoughts after a wonderful Christmas. Hope ya'll had one too.
Roon
I get annoyed by Barreta Boy, but I've got to admit it has more to do with his wanting to be a "peace officer" than for what he stirs up here.
Let's all take a deep breath. Judge, don't run away. There are plenty of people here who want a good dialog. There are, of course, people who don't. (I haven't heard from Randy Garrett or Peter Pi lately, after they got a little heat!)
We have a great forum, and let's work hard to keep it that way. We can and will police our own.
My thoughts after a wonderful Christmas. Hope ya'll had one too.
Roon
Oh Boy!!! it is always happening. Can we agree and disagree. Intelligent people resorts to argumentation not to a fist fight or take someone personally.
I had experienced a lot being put to shamed on this board but I am still here to air my views and opinions. If someone disagree with my opinions or arguments then I will rebuttal it, if found I am wrong I just accept it. Who knows, you just want to show that I am wrong and when you are alone you realize you are the one that is wrong. Or I am the the one that is wrong also. Accepting one's error is self accomplishment.
In this board, you have lawyers, laymen, engineers, programmers, professors, cops, military and perhaps all walks of life. Thus we don't need to say or tell to someone to leave. We can read betweeen lines who is the person talking. You may be better of in some areas of knowledge but I am better in one way or the other. Like if, you are a good shooter in the range but I am good in the street of all sorts, just like that. We cannot be an expert in all subjects but we do try to learn from each and every one.
In fact, in this board as if I feel I am talking face to face to all of you. Maybe if I feel I am worthless hereon already, I may just banish and no need from someone to tell me I must go. At least, in this board I learned a lot from different banks of intelligent people. I may be absent for long time and be back again facing new bred of intelligent people.
See how the effect of "WORDS" even we don't see each other personally but it hurts someone feeling sometimes. That is how powerful communication is.
Merry Christmas, Ramadan, Holiday to all of you. May the blessings of the creator be with us all.
Thanks
[This message has been edited by stdalire (edited December 27, 1999).]
I had experienced a lot being put to shamed on this board but I am still here to air my views and opinions. If someone disagree with my opinions or arguments then I will rebuttal it, if found I am wrong I just accept it. Who knows, you just want to show that I am wrong and when you are alone you realize you are the one that is wrong. Or I am the the one that is wrong also. Accepting one's error is self accomplishment.
In this board, you have lawyers, laymen, engineers, programmers, professors, cops, military and perhaps all walks of life. Thus we don't need to say or tell to someone to leave. We can read betweeen lines who is the person talking. You may be better of in some areas of knowledge but I am better in one way or the other. Like if, you are a good shooter in the range but I am good in the street of all sorts, just like that. We cannot be an expert in all subjects but we do try to learn from each and every one.
In fact, in this board as if I feel I am talking face to face to all of you. Maybe if I feel I am worthless hereon already, I may just banish and no need from someone to tell me I must go. At least, in this board I learned a lot from different banks of intelligent people. I may be absent for long time and be back again facing new bred of intelligent people.
See how the effect of "WORDS" even we don't see each other personally but it hurts someone feeling sometimes. That is how powerful communication is.
Merry Christmas, Ramadan, Holiday to all of you. May the blessings of the creator be with us all.
Thanks
[This message has been edited by stdalire (edited December 27, 1999).]
George Hill
Staff Alumnus
God Bless US, Each and Every One!
You know - while up in Idaho sitting under a Yamaha V-Max snow machine... I had some time to ponder. I was thinking about a great many things. I was thinking about all my family... all my friends... who all kept going as they didnt see the amazing 360* I did in the air (Note - snow machines should never do that - leave that to the Snow Boarders) about my friends here at TFL... and about the ice cold stream of water running down my back, under my jacket and out my pants...
I came to the conclussion that - even if I dont like PEOPLE... I really do like those that I associate myself with. Membership of TFL is some thing I hold as Rather Important to me personally, as well as NRA, and BSA memberships. I am glad to be here. I am glad to be a part of TFL and to associate with the fine members here. Here we have leaders of business, community, military, and just about every thing you can imagine. We have Law Enforcers, some Breakers (Benders I mean
), and even some Law Makers. We have Teens, we have Grumpy Old Farts (Not you, Dennis) and everything in between.
All of us have a common intrest here. We all have our differences - and that makes us stronger - because these difference will not divide us. Think of it rather like Epoxy. Lame - but still. You have differnt parts that has to mix before the Epoxy can hold together. But once it does, the bond is stronger that ever before.
Think about that a moment before you flame some one.
As for the snow machine... Well - all those reps one the Squat Machine paid off. The V-Max is a HEAVY SOB. I got it up and off me, and was able to catch up to every one. They just wondered why I was soaking wet.
2 days later - I am STILL cold!
------------------
"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." - Sigmund Freud
You know - while up in Idaho sitting under a Yamaha V-Max snow machine... I had some time to ponder. I was thinking about a great many things. I was thinking about all my family... all my friends... who all kept going as they didnt see the amazing 360* I did in the air (Note - snow machines should never do that - leave that to the Snow Boarders) about my friends here at TFL... and about the ice cold stream of water running down my back, under my jacket and out my pants...
I came to the conclussion that - even if I dont like PEOPLE... I really do like those that I associate myself with. Membership of TFL is some thing I hold as Rather Important to me personally, as well as NRA, and BSA memberships. I am glad to be here. I am glad to be a part of TFL and to associate with the fine members here. Here we have leaders of business, community, military, and just about every thing you can imagine. We have Law Enforcers, some Breakers (Benders I mean
), and even some Law Makers. We have Teens, we have Grumpy Old Farts (Not you, Dennis) and everything in between. All of us have a common intrest here. We all have our differences - and that makes us stronger - because these difference will not divide us. Think of it rather like Epoxy. Lame - but still. You have differnt parts that has to mix before the Epoxy can hold together. But once it does, the bond is stronger that ever before.
Think about that a moment before you flame some one.
As for the snow machine... Well - all those reps one the Squat Machine paid off. The V-Max is a HEAVY SOB. I got it up and off me, and was able to catch up to every one. They just wondered why I was soaking wet.
2 days later - I am STILL cold!
------------------
"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." - Sigmund Freud
George you have said it all.
I am thinking if I am in my home country I can access this TFL. I bought a 500 Intel pentium and AMD among my 7 personal computers to back up one another in case one will be downed. Once my small Internet Cafe business is running I will introduce this TFL to my Gun Club members to let them learn more from this site. Right now, I am pretty sure, as if I am the lone Filipino ranger hereon. I haven't seen Paltik around for quite sometime, for I come to think he is also Pinoy as described in his data.
ADVANCE HAPPY NEW YEAR ALSO TO EVERY ONE.
Note: I am sorry to say, while I have posted this I saw paltik topic on the queue of posters. So, we are only two Pinoy on TFL.
[This message has been edited by stdalire (edited December 27, 1999).]
I am thinking if I am in my home country I can access this TFL. I bought a 500 Intel pentium and AMD among my 7 personal computers to back up one another in case one will be downed. Once my small Internet Cafe business is running I will introduce this TFL to my Gun Club members to let them learn more from this site. Right now, I am pretty sure, as if I am the lone Filipino ranger hereon. I haven't seen Paltik around for quite sometime, for I come to think he is also Pinoy as described in his data.
ADVANCE HAPPY NEW YEAR ALSO TO EVERY ONE.
Note: I am sorry to say, while I have posted this I saw paltik topic on the queue of posters. So, we are only two Pinoy on TFL.
[This message has been edited by stdalire (edited December 27, 1999).]
stdalire,
I spent two of the most wonderful years of my life in the PI. From Baguio to Olongopo, San Fernando (and those delicious peanuts) to Cavite.
As they say, "hinde malaki bagay ditos PI", or, more poignantly, "giling giling masarap!"
(Please forgive my spelling. I don't have a tagalog dictionary and it has been 33 years.)
Best wishes on to you and all this new year.
Roon
I spent two of the most wonderful years of my life in the PI. From Baguio to Olongopo, San Fernando (and those delicious peanuts) to Cavite.
As they say, "hinde malaki bagay ditos PI", or, more poignantly, "giling giling masarap!"
(Please forgive my spelling. I don't have a tagalog dictionary and it has been 33 years.)
Best wishes on to you and all this new year.
Roon
Joseph: So, you've been in P.I. and see those two places. Olongapo was changed to an Export Processing Zone now and great companies like FED Express, Acer, etc. are all there doing businesses. Unlike before that it is "HAREM" place. Baguio still it's beautiful scenery for its Greeny and cold environment.
If you happen to visit again just inform me and I will escort you. My P.I. mail is "sonbell@pworld.net.ph"
If you happen to visit again just inform me and I will escort you. My P.I. mail is "sonbell@pworld.net.ph"