Smith and Wesson Model 27 or 686?

All kinds of good information coming out of this food fight. I didn't know about JM and the model 64. Now I'm all jazzed about my 64-4. My model 19 will shoot long loaded wadcutters! More good news. If it's not too much trouble, could we keep rolling on this, as it's the hottest thread on this blog right now.

Stay Frosty!
 
Wow, information overload!

I guess my little question turned into quite a heated discussion.

I think from much of the information provided here as well as some of my own research, I'm going to look into the Model 27.

Actually, the more I really have read...the more I'm thinking the Model 27 might just be too big for what I want.

I hate to change the subject but with more reading, I think the Model 19 might be quite a bit better for my overall purposes. It seems to be a pretty popular gun.

I'd like to post a thread in the "For Sale" section but I'm not allowed to do so? What should I expect to pay for either a used Model 27 or used Model 19 with a 6 inch barrel? Would $450 be reasonable? The more I look at these guns, the more in love I become with the presentation and history behind them.
 
I'd like to post a thread in the "For Sale" section but I'm not allowed to do so? What should I expect to pay for either a used Model 27 or used Model 19 with a 6 inch barrel? Would $450 be reasonable? The more I look at these guns, the more in love I become with the presentation and history behind them.
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The model 19 is an excellent choice. I buy most of my guns used, and I am an avid gunbroker buyer. I suggest you go there to give you an idea of prices/condition and the going rates. When you do your search, punch in "Smith Wesson 19" without the quotes and another search of "S&W 19". Depending on finish condition, I would guess for a decent model 19 with some cylinder turn line and bluing loss, a good price would be $450-$550. For same condition model 27 you're talking $600-$800. I got the one you see earlier in this thread about 3yrs ago for $700.
One disclaimer regarding the model 19: If an excess usage of hot 125gr 357mag rounds were shot through them, there were some that developed forcing cone cracks and top-strap flame cutting. I and 99.999% of other readers on these forums have NEVER seen this in person and the rumor spreading has blown this out of proportion. To be safe, don't use that combination with the model 19.
 
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If you are recoil sensitive, I would stay away from the K-frame 357s. I like shooting 357 out of my models 686/28, but when I put a few through my model 65 (basically a stainless steel model 19 with fixed sights) my hand is stinging.

If you are set on a k-frame, and I love k-frames, I'd stick with a 38spl version like a model 14 or model 15. You can fire hot 38s from them that are fine for defensive carry purposes, and both are very accurate weapons--basically the same gun as the 19, but chambered in 38spl only.

If you don't mind fixed sights, check out this crazy deal on a model 64 ($249 including shipping), a stainless k-frame 38spl:

http://www.sportsmansoutdoorsuperstore.com/products2.cfm/ID/107981/c/used-firearms

I just got a 3" model 65 from them for under $340.
 
Strafer Gott:

Please be advised those were semi-wadcutters, the long 173 gr, Keith type bullet. Most folks advised me to seat deeply and crimp over the front shoulder, but I don't like to do this as I had a compressed load as it was.

Bob Wright
 
If you are recoil sensitive, I would stay away from the K-frame 357s. I like shooting 357 out of my models 686/28, but when I put a few through my model 65 (basically a stainless steel model 19 with fixed sights) my hand is stinging.

If you are set on a k-frame, and I love k-frames, I'd stick with a 38spl version like a model 14 or model 15. You can fire hot 38s from them that are fine for defensive carry purposes, and both are very accurate weapons--basically the same gun as the 19, but chambered in 38spl only.
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But he doesn't have to shoot .357 magnums out of 19. Now, I will say that if he's going to stick with .38 specials and wants a K-frame, it makes sense to get a .38 special because of price. A good Model 15 (4 inch) or Model 14 (6 inch) will run considerably less than any of the magnums discussed.
 
And.........

QuakertownRich,

You mentioned top strap flame cutting. Several years ago, on another, now defunct forum, I was taken to task for using the term "flame cutting." The poster chided me, saying it was particle abrasion causing the cutting, citing me seveal experiments he had performed to refute the "flame" cutting action. My experience was this:

Years ago I was cleaning my Ruger Blackhawk .357 Magnum when I noticed a deep cut in the underside of the top strap just above the barrel stub. At that time I was using the Remington 125gr. SJHP bullet with, I believe, 9.0 grs. of (then) Hercules Unique powder. Shooting on an indoor range produced a very bright sideways flash, typical of Unique powder. The cut occured after about 2,500 rounds or so of this ammunition had been fired. (Yes, I do keep a count in a log book.) I continued to monitor the cut and it seemed to go just so deep then stop. So, I quit worrying about.

I recently examined my 6" Model 586 and there is the faintest of lines in this area, though this gun has been used mostly with Winchester 296 or Alliant #2400 powders. Also there is about an 11,000 round difference overall in the two guns, the old Ruger standing at about 17,000 rounds fired.

As to the advisor who chided me, his solution was to coat the area with graphite, even using a No.2 lead pencil to prevent the cutting action. His claim is that the cutting is done by powder and primer particles being blown out the barrel/cylinder gap.

I no longer give the problem any consideration.

Bob Wright
 
After re-reading the OP, he states he is recoil sensitive, to the point of wanting to shoot 38spl's out of large framed revolver to absorb recoil. Rethinking this a little, but perhaps it would be wiser for the OP to focus on 38spl only. The added weight with either 27 or 686 could contribute to hand stress that has had an injury, IMO. The model 19 is a great weapon, but not necessary if shooting 38spl exclusively. 38spl can be loaded to some serious self defence power levels, and even at it's weakest is deadly.
I reload, and I love the 38spl round. My revolver is a S&W model 64, 4" heavy barrel, former police service. I paid $270 a few yrs ago for it, found it to be carried alot, shot little, so the action was crisp and very nice. When I shoot 148gr wadcutters, it is a powderpuff. Factory ammo is about 50% more than what you can buy 9mm for, this is excellent reason to start reloading. :D
 
It stops.

NOW.

I suggest you all re-read TFL's rules of engagement.

If you don't, there may well be some former members on the outside looking in.
 
I'd probably shoot .38 special ammo due to the recoil of a full .357 round. Is a .38 special round shot in a S&W Model 27 or 686 comparable to the felt recoil of my M9 shooting 9mm?
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I shoot light .357 loads (124 grain cast bullet, 3.0 grains of Bullseye, .357 cases),that are the equivelent of .38 special very light target loads in both my newly aquired M66 and M686, and in a model 27 in the past. Such loads shot in any of those guns do not feel much different to me as far as recoil goes. But all are very much less recoil that a 9MM shot from my Browning HP. Autos have to have enough energy to work the action, revolvers only have to get the bullet out of the barrel. So, you may want to investigate handloading your .38's to get the recoil even lower that purchased .38 target loads.

...As to the advisor who chided me, his solution was to coat the area with graphite, even using a No.2 lead pencil to prevent the cutting action. His claim is that the cutting is done by powder and primer particles being blown out the barrel/cylinder gap.

I no longer give the problem any consideration...
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Just a note: I remember posts from years ago where "flame cutting" (or powder cutting), was found to be self-limiting in that it would, at some point go no further and stop eroding the top strap on its own. So, in the case of using graphite to stop it, it could have stopped on its own and the person putting graphite on the divot would be led to believe that applying graphite actually worked. In any case, "lead" (clay, wax, graphite), from a number two pencil is a whole lot softer than steel, not thick enough to insulate, and logically could not stop the cutting.
 
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Just a note on recoil. Weight reduces felt recoil as the OP stated. But fit and grip construction are also very important.

Another consideration is training. Using the correct grip and stance will help control recoil. Also you shouldn't try to muscle down the barrel for guns with uncomfortable amounts of recoil. Allowing the gun to "roll up" to a certain extent will save you a bit of discomfort.

So if the N-frame is too large for your hand the extra weight won't help as much.
A set of soft rubber grips will be more comfortable than solid grips, especially ones that leave the back strap exposed.
Getting training or even just pointers from a knowledgeable shooter will help a lot.
Don't try to be a he-man.
 
Nevertheless, not all people are mechanically inclined and I understand the frustration of those who have to reley on others to do repairs.
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Frustration? I wasn't frustrated. I just don't pretend to be a gunsmith when I have no training in the field. I am an electrician, and I DO get frustrated when ppl tinker in my field of expertise because they believe themselves to be "mechanically inclined" and FUBAR things, leaving the professionals to undo what they have done. Be it electricity or firearms, when self-proclaimed "mechanically inclined" ppl start screwing with things they are not trained for, more often than not innocent ppl can get hurt or worse.
 
I'd get the 27 if you have the choice because it's a 27. You might like shooting the 686 more than the 27, different handle, more weight on the front of the 686.
I have a 6" 28, have owed a 4" 28. I like to shoot the 4" 586 and 686 guns more than the others. Newest I have is a 45 ACP 625 with JM grips on it and it it great. Liked it so much that my 586 now has JM grips. We need at least one of each model.

Bottom line, look at them, fondle them, buy the one that suits your fancy. Can't really go wrong.
 
M27, M686, M66 all good S&W's. N frames have more mass, seems to carry up to the next locking notch smoother in rapid fire. K frame feels slightly more "snappy" (less smooth), in comparison. On the other hand, K's are lighter for carry. Have had all three, like all three.
 
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At least you got the brand right. So its 686 or 27 but then then OP mentions a 19 and I think a 66 is a better choice than that. Choices choices choices. I think life is too short, so maybe you should buy them all. This way you don't have to pick one and wonder about the other one would be like. Hey, it worked for me ;)

The stand alone Colt is a model 357 magnum from 1954 with the target package.

GEDC0517.jpg
 
no question

For me it would be a M27. There is a "look" to the M27 that the 686 does not capture. The 626, though a good revolver, cannot match the sleek, elegant lines of a M27.
 
Okay, now I'm really embarrassed,,,

I had originally posted that some K-frame grips would not fit my L-frame Model 686.

What model K-Frame, specifically, were the grips from?
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The grips were a set of Pachmayers I purchased at a gun show,,,
But never got around to putting on my Model 67.

I went home Friday and checked the Pachmayer grips,,,
They are in the original packaging which says S&W K-frame,,,
But according to the marking inside the grips they are for a Ruger revolver.

I stand corrected.

Aarond

.
 
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All right, all right, you guy have got to stop this comparing of S&W pistols. Now I have to save my money and get a model 27 to go with my 686, model 19 and 642 and model 60. so many gun so little money.
 
I went home Friday and checked the Pachmayer grips,,,
They are in the original packaging which says S&W K-frame,,,
But according to the marking inside the grips they are for a Ruger revolver
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I had that happen also; Ruger grips in original packaging that was labeled as for S&W. Luckily I recognized what they were really for, and had a college that had a Ruger and sold them to him.
 
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