Silvertips vs. other Hollowpoints

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Doug.38PR

Moderator
What is the difference between Silvertips and other hollowpoint bullets? I know they are more expensive but are they a more effective round? Why?
 
There are far better hollow points out there today. My dept. ditched the Silvertip after a bank robbery in Columbus, OH some years ago in which the bad guy, taking multiple hits, didn't go down. It seems that Silvertips have a tendency to clog up with clothing and don't expand, making them in essence no better than a FMJ. We went to the Rangers, which are basically the same thing as the Black Talon, without the paint.
 
Years ago ??? Manufactures are constantly changing their bullets .Winchester especially has redesigned the Silvertip. So years ago it was not good now it's very good.Some think that they should have dropped the Silvertip name to get away from the bad reputation.
 
Silvertips, interestingly enough, are no longer recommended by Seecamp for their guns. The whole "which one is more effective" argument is too broad as a round down here in Florida may not work with winter clothes in Chicago. A .32 or .380 owners may be looking for penetration while .45acp drivers want maximum expansion. I say, use what you're comfortable with (availability and affordability), what works well in your gun, and what you're accurate with. For me, the perfect compromise of all factors is Federal Hydro-Shoks. Don't get stuck on one name or another or what one shooter recommends over another. It's what works for YOU.
 
lol.gif
 
Here ya go...

How about these numbers -

CorBon .45ACP, 165g. HP +P: 1250fps, 573ft/lbs
CorBon .45ACP, 185g. HP +P: 1150fps, 543ft/lbs
CorBon .45ACP, 165g. HP +P: 1225fps, 550ft/lbs "Power Ball" load

All three are "gonna leave a mark!!" :D
 
Silvertips are just jacketed soft points with a metal covering. Al, I think. No good against werewolves as it isn't a pure silver bullet fired by somebody who loves the werewolf.
"...they are SUPER reliable..." They're super expensive too.
In any case, no pistol round gives 100% reliable expansion. Not even a .45. Keep shooting with whatever you're loaded with until the threat goes away.
 
silvertips

IMO, Silvertip hp are the best deal in premium ammo. 50 rounds for about $20.00 at Wal-Mart. I've never had a misfeed, and they're accurate. there are more modern, more expensive rounds out there, but STs will work just fine.
 
The 110gr Standard pressure .38's are about one of the best things you can put through an older non +p rated .38 for self defense.
 
check streichers prices for premium ammo.

HST-2 in 45 are 16.00 per fifty. hydrashoks are 19 for 50 and gold dots are also 19 for fifty. in fact the smaller calibers it is almost the same price for fifty as many places charge for those little packs of 20.
 
Silvertips

The Silvertip is the first premium hollowpoint. the 115 grain 9mm Silvertip HP was designed to expand to .54 caliber. It is the most affordable of the high end HPs. It is the only brand still sold in 50 round boxes. The round was used by nearly every police dept. until the infamous "Miami FBI" shoot out of 1989. The 9mm STHP entered the bad guy's liver, destroyed it, penetrated 13 inches and expanded all the way. However, he just decided not to die. For that one reason, the silvertip fell out of favor. It was soon replaced by the "Black talon". Another very effective round, except for the sharp edges that cut medical person's gloves. Buy a box of silvertips, you won't be disappointed.
 
..."Miami FBI" shoot out of 1989. The 9mm STHP entered the bad guy's liver, destroyed it, penetrated 13 inches and expanded all the way.
Click to expand...
The round went through Platt's upper arm, entered his chest, passed between his ribs, completely penetrated his right lung, cut a major artery in the arm and multiple blood vessels in the lung along the way and stopped about an inch short of his heart. It was a fatal wound but he lived long enough to kill some FBI agents. Overall penetration was decent, but due to the non-ideal angle and having to penetrate the arm before entering the chest, it didn't quite make it to the heart.

It was theorized that had it penetrated the heart, he might have expired more rapidly which may have saved some lives. Hard to prove either way given that it only took him about 1.5 minutes to do his killing, but the possibility was enough to make the FBI ditch the 9mm. I don't know that the Silvertip was blamed so much as the caliber was.

Black Talon ammunition was introduced in the early '90s, some 5 or 6 years after the Miami shootout which took place on 11 April, 1986. I don't know if Black Talon ammunition was ever issued to the FBI.
 
Remington, Federal, and Speer still sell 50 round boxes, It is just your retailers not ordering them. It is hard to get retailers to do it because they are getting 15.00 bucks for twenty when you can get 50 rounds for 17. They would rathre take your money than order you the right box of shells.
 
Silvertips are just jacketed soft points with a metal covering. Al, I think.
Click to expand...

I have been told that WIN no longer produces Al jacketing on their Silvertips. In the days when they did, Al jacketing was limited to certain calibres. I know that 7.65mm was one of them and IIRC .45 was another. The significant feature of Al jacketing is that it is invisible on X-rays. Any detached jacketing therefore cannot be seen on the X-rays. On those older versions the Al jacketed Silvertips look like they are all lead on the radiograph.

In 9mm I prefer to use Gold Dots.
 
Aluminum is not nearly as easily visible on X-rays as lead, but it is not invisible. However, you are correct in that there have been some concerns voiced in the medical professions about the difficulty of seeing aluminum bullet jacket fragments on X-rays since aluminum is only faintly radio-opaque.
 
@ JohnKSa

Aluminium jacketing (or as some say 'aluminum') IS invisible on standard X-rays used for medical diagnosis. Even on 'soft' X-rays when exposed directly you cannot see an aluminium jacket. You might see a very thick piece of aluminium on X-ray (such as an aluminium step wedge used for film/developer QA), but then again you'll see a thick piece of anything on X-ray. But unless you have a great big piece of aluminium, you won't see it on X-ray. That is why they make the ports on X-ray tube housings out of aluminium.

Edit: check out this thread where I X-rayed some samples:

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2022111#post2022111
 
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I asked a surgeon AND a radiologist and they both said you need a better machine. Both played golf with me this afternoon and both said they have no trouble spotting Al on film. They find it necessary to find it fairly often as aluminum is a fairly common component of both motorcycles and cars and in collisions, they find it pretty easily.
 
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17413&d=1139350174

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17414&d=1139350174

@ Guntotin Fool

It is not a question of needing a better machine. The X-ray unit itself has less to do with the overall ability of a system to resolve certain densities, than the quality of the intensifying screen and the grain of the film. Have a look at the pictures above. The radiograph is produced from high resolution film/screen combination. It is the same setup for orthopaedic assessments. There is certainly nothing wrong with that quality. Note the complete disappearance of the CCI aluminium cartridge case. Only the primer cup can be seen. Note also the disappearance of the .32 Silvertip jacket (the deformed bullet at six o'clock), even when other smaller copper-based jacket fragments have shown up on the film.

Also you need to ask that radiologist whether he knows what alloys of aluminium are used in motor manufacturing. Alloys will have a different density if the other metal component is not radiolucent. As I said earlier it also depends on the size of the piece of aluminium (if it is not an alloy). A sizeable chunk will be visible on X-ray.
But the bottom line is that when dealing with the sizes and types of aluminium found in ballistics, those pieces of aluminium are radiolucent. They do not show up on X-rays at those penetration ranges found in the hospital. Trust me, I have X-rayed many projectile and cartridge components. I am well-versed in the technical side of that because that is my job. If you are interested I can start a new thread on the radiological appearances of projectiles and projectile fragments. Your radiologist and surgeon friends are welcome to comment.

Edit: I just thought of something. A peeled aluminium jacket may be visible on X-ray if it has retained lead core particles on its undersurface, as a result of impact forces or manufacturing anomalies. But in that case I regard that fragment as a mixed core/jacket density. I don't have any examples of lead particles on aluminium jackets, but I do have examples of that phenomenon on copper-based jackets.
 
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