Should the media be showing this guys "manifesto"?

You may think me rightous, I contend I am simply right.

You may be implying you have the objectivity to make decisions for all of us. I contend you are wrong. Not that a contention like that holds water for either party.

Based on those examples your claim to an inviolate "right to collect information" is null and void.

(I assume you are still directing your comments to me since you are quoting me.) I don't recall giving examples. Please feel free to point those examples out.

I believe you object to the method of dissemination. I would not disagree, as previously stated. The concept of censorship runs counter to what most hold dear. You may feel free to trust our leaders. I will question every time as there is rot and puss in their rank and file. Power corrupts... and information is power.

I am content to agree to disagree at this point. Have a nice day.
 
I believe you object to the method of dissemination. I would not disagree, as previously stated. The concept of censorship runs counter to what most hold dear. You may feel free to trust our leaders. I will question every time as there is rot and puss in their rank and file. Power corrupts... and information is power.

I am content to agree to disagree at this point. Have a nice day.

I would agree with you on this... I too distrust the government and want as much visibility as possible with regards to governmental actions.

This case though does not have to do with governmental action. It is the action of a madman looking to get his message out via a high body count.

If this were a matter of protecting closed door governmental meetings I would be very concerned but that is in no way what we are talking about.

Thanks for participating.
 
I don't think he took a sane course of action. I can empathize though, and understand that he perceived that he was under intense pressure. That is no way means that I condone what he did.
I disagree. I have spent many years in social services and I have a great deal of compassion for people dealing with adversity. I give people alot of slack too but when people make that decision to go from troubled to being a threat then I loose alot of that compassion.

I grew up in extreme circumstances. I was raised fist by an alcoholic and then by a single mother. We were very poor in a small WV town. Add to this that I was also gay which made me feel like I constantly had to hide who I was for fear of violence and you can't even imagine what it was like unless you were in those circumstances.

I never gave in to the anger and frustration of my situation and harmed another person. Therefore I have little tolerance for people who decide to take out their frustrations in this way. I definately do not empathize with them since I do not feel they were at all justified.

If people want to make him out to be a victim of mental illness I have a hard time swallowing it. I have seen too many people that have no illness besides a blantant lack of restraint or a sense of responsibility labeled as ill simply because they are not capable of making good decisions...not because of illness but because of a lack of self control and an inability to properly catalog their own lives.
 
If people want to make him out to be a victim of mental illness I have a hard time swallowing it. I have seen too many people that have no illness besides a blantant lack of restraint or a sense of responsibility labeled as ill simply because they are not capable of making good decisions...not because of illness but because of a lack of self control and an inability to properly catalog their own lives.

Have you watched his videos? Seriously, the kid was two cans short of a six-pack, and missing the little plastic thing that holds it together too. Just four cans rattling around on the floorboards.
 
Have you watched his videos? Seriously, the kid was two cans short of a six-pack, and missing the little plastic thing that holds it together too. Just four cans rattling around on the floorboards.
I have seen the videos and I have not seen anything that suggests to me a disconnect from reality. I just see a guy who has no boundries, who fixates on the unimportant, and who chose to imitate a behavior prevelant in movies, TV, video games, etc without the self awarness or consideration for his fellow man needed to not be a danger. I am not saying he was not sociopathic, I am saying I do not feel he was insane. He more likely just had poor character and poor coping skills. Lots of sociopaths function fine in society...just look at Bolton.
 
When i started this thread, i never said that the media should not have the RIGHT to air that crap, i just said that they shouldnt have aired it. i am all for freedom of the press, but in certain circumstances, i feel some discretion should be used.

Just imagine if one of those innocent victims was one of your familymembers, would you like to be blasted in the face with that crap? I know damn well i wouldnt.

Now some networks said they will cut back on showing it and some said they wont show it at all, so obviously they are getting some backlash.

There was NOTHING gained by showing the nonsensical rantings of a deranged nutball. Seeing that isnt going to prevent future incidents like it and might even bring out the copycats.

That guy was a gutless pussy, probably couldnt have punched his way out of a wet paper sack. Now hes a celebrity and will live in infamy, just what he wanted.
 
You know, if they didn't show the manifesto, somebody here would be screaming about a coverup. After wall, what are they trying to hide?

They show it and folks complain it is in bad taste, hurtful, etc.

Assuming these opinions reflect a fair proportion of the US population, the media can't win either way, so they do the smart thing and air the way that earns them money.
 
Everyone on this forum will jump to the defence of the 2nd amendment, but there seems to be a willingness to tamper with the 1st. We are all adults and we should be able to view this video material without restriction. We are all shocked by the events in Virginia Tech, but if this material helps us to understand fully what happened then why restrict it? Perhaps we can learn from it and if we come across a person in our own lives that seems similar it will alert us enough to get them to seek help, or speak to social services about our suspicions.

The idea that we will take 'inspiration' from this psycopath and go out to repeat what he did to get our 15 minutes of fame is paternalist in the extreme. It comes from the same socialist mindset that says "I'm normal, well adjusted and able to take an adult approach to this, but you, my friend, need to be protected from it because you are so impressionable"

We have all heard the same arguement used to try to prevent us from playing certain video games, listening to heavy metal music, and watching violent movies.

Don't let them treat you like a moron who needs their enlightened protection.
 
Just imagine if one of those innocent victims was one of your familymembers, would you like to be blasted in the face with that crap? I know damn well i wouldnt.
If one of those victims was a family member I'm pretty sure the last thing I would want to do is sit down in front of the TV and watch the news.
 
I think the best thing for NBC to have done would have been to immediately notify the FBI and turn that express mail over to them and it never sees the light of day for the public.

Correct me if I am wrong...the FBI and Virginia police were notified and I think FBI agents from the New York field office have picked the originals up.
Im pretty sure that NBC had meetings that lasted several hours with lawyers and the whole slew of NBC rpresented before they showed the tapes.
 
Everyone on this forum will jump to the defence of the 2nd amendment, but there seems to be a willingness to tamper with the 1st. We are all adults and we should be able to view this video material without restriction. We are all shocked by the events in Virginia Tech, but if this material helps us to understand fully what happened then why restrict it? Perhaps we can learn from it and if we come across a person in our own lives that seems similar it will alert us enough to get them to seek help, or speak to social services about our suspicions.

The idea that we will take 'inspiration' from this psycopath and go out to repeat what he did to get our 15 minutes of fame is paternalist in the extreme. It comes from the same socialist mindset that says "I'm normal, well adjusted and able to take an adult approach to this, but you, my friend, need to be protected from it because you are so impressionable"

We have all heard the same arguement used to try to prevent us from playing certain video games, listening to heavy metal music, and watching violent movies.

Don't let them treat you like a moron who needs their enlightened protection.

The second is regulated. Rocket launchers are not allowed, felons are barred from ownership and other restrictions that very few would consider extreme are in place.

The first is regulated as well. I have already pointed out numerous places where it is.

If you think 30 seconds of footage from the TV news are going to help you spot and asses someone who is sufferring from deep mental illness then you are misinformed. If you really are concerned about the subject then go read some real information on it. People want to see it on the news because they have a grotesque fascination with it.

I never said "you" would be urged to go out and kill thrity people from watching this. We are talking about a person with deep seated mental illness here. Most here though seem to feel their imaginary right to see a murderrers propeganda at the expense of future victims lives is some how inviolate.

I will buy the arguments of those who see no merit in mine when they actually study more than CNN with regards to rampage killers.
 
Troubled as in "he was the real victim"

If he had offed himself I could buy "troubled"

I might even feel sorry for him

But since he decided to take his psychosis "on the road" I have trouble seeing him as anything other than heavily armed fruitcake

The networks are full of stories now about how he was teased

This loser sent a tape to NBC to make sure he became famous

Sorry...but that defies sympathy

And IMO...it makes it even more imperative to paint him as anything but a "troubled youth"
 
Cho's mental condition

I'm surprised Playboy has decided that Cho was not mentally ill, just evil, pure and simple. Evidently, Cho had a long history of being silent and unresponsive to virtually everyone. His suite mates say he never spoke to any of them, even when they spoke directly to him: he'd just turn away. According to relatives back in Korea, even as a young child, he was uncommunicative and withdrawn. Perhaps some form of autism? Asperger's syndrome? Plus a massive persecution complex and long bottled-up resentment.

From the April 19 edition of the British newspaper the Guardian (online)

"The brooding silence of Cho Seung-hui was so impenetrable it disturbed his family even when he was a boy growing up in South Korea, relatives of the Virginia killer told the Guardian today.

His grandfather feared Cho, at eight, might be mute; the boy's great aunt worried that he had mental problems. And his mother, Kim Hyang-im, spent most of her time in church praying for him to snap out of his unhealthy taciturnity.

Article continues
"She was heartbroken. It was always her biggest worry when she called home," said the mother's aunt, Kim Yang-soon. "After they moved to America, she hoped his silences would ease as he grew older. But in fact, they got worse."

The poor but hard-working family had a difficult beginning. Cho's mother was forced into an arranged marriage with his father, Sung-tae, who was 10 years older and from a very different background. She was from a well-educated family of North Korean landowners, who had been forced to flee without possessions during the Korean war; he was from a poor family in the south, but had made enough money to marry by working in Saudi Arabia for 10 years on construction sites and oil fields.

As Hyang-im was 29 - a late age for a woman to find a husband in South Korea - her father told her she had to accept the proposal. "She didn't want to marry, but she gave in," said Yong-soon. "Her husband was not fit for her. But she always followed and obeyed him. She never fought him, though sometimes I wish she had done." No one in the family recalls any violent behaviour from Cho or his parents that might have hinted at the carnage to come.

But they were unnerved by his sullenness. "My grandson was shy even as a little boy and he would never run to me like my other grandchildren," his maternal grandfather, Kim HyongShik, told the Hankyeoreh Daily. "The boy was so different from his super-intelligent older sister. His extreme shyness worried his parents. I thought he might be deaf and dumb."

Schoolmates interviewed by local media said they remembered Cho as quiet and nondescript. His former teacher, Noh Yong-gil, has no recollection of him.

But the father doted on his son and daughter. "He lived for his children. He would have done anything for them," the grandfather recalled. "But now this has happened. It's as if everything they've done, the reason for their whole existence has been for nothing. It's as if they've not lived at all."

The family moved to the US in 1992. It did not go smoothly. During their eight-year wait for a visa, they became increasingly short of money, selling their second-hand shop and their home to make ends meet.

They had spent the night before their flight with the mother's family, who live in a wooden hut in the middle of a field of cabbages, spring onions and horseradishes. "They were very happy to finally be going. They thought they were off to a better life," said Yang-soon.

It was only the second time the grandparents had seen their grandson. "He would not talk even when I called to him. He was so quiet that I remarked that he must have a very gentle nature," Yang-soon said. "But his mother told me he was too quiet. Soon after they got to America, he was diagnosed as being clinically withdrawn. It amazes me that he ever made it into university. I guess he must have had some mental problems from birth."

Cho's family worked hard to make a success of their life in the US. His father spent hours in the laundry, earning enough money for his children's education. His mother supplemented their income with part-time employment as a waitress at a cafeteria. Her spare time was devoted to the Korean church in Centreville, where she implored the pastor to help her son. According to the Joong-ang Daily, she always prayed that her boy could become more outgoing.

When Cho started college, at Virginia Tech, his mother took his dormitory mates to one side to explain about her son's unusual character and implored them to help.

"She was worried that he spent all his time in his room, lost in a world of video games," the paper quoted the pastor as saying. "[Cho] came to bible studies for a couple of years, but rarely spoke and never got along with the other youths. I can't believe he has done this to such a devoted mother."

Back in Seoul, the family are worried that they had not heard from Cho's parents since the killings. They have wondered if things might have been different had they been able to bring the boy out of his shell. "I just wish he would have talked," says Yong-soon. "There is an old saying in Korea that people who won't talk will end up killing themselves. That is what happens when the resentment builds up."
 
I never gave in to the anger and frustration of my situation and harmed another person. Therefore I have little tolerance for people who decide to take out their frustrations in this way. I definately do not empathize with them since I do not feel they were at all justified.

I don't sympathize, I do empathize, and I still do not condone. There is no amount of empathy that justifies the actions he took.

NBC gave the package to law enforcement, and only after receiving their authorization did they air it. I'm happy to have seen it, I'm fascinated simply because I couldn't fathom taking the same actions he took.

BUT, and this is the real kicker, putting a face to this guy helps ME better digest what occurred and took it from a vague action that happened in some state I don't live in to a real person. This also means that I am MUCH more able to change gears and defend myself and my community in the future whether I am armed or not.

Just like we really don't need stronger doors on airplane cockpits: Now that people know that hijackers will take down the whole plane, the second someone jumps up and tries to reach the front of the plane with a weapon, there are 5-10 guys jumping him.
 
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