Should the Government Tax You for Being Overweight?

So what is your solution?
I don't know; I'm no medical care system expert. But it doesn't take an expert to know that opting for a proven failed system worse than what we have is not the way to go.
I hear all the complaints about government provide medicine, and how it does not work. Much of it is true though some of it is clearly overblown by people who are loyal to the us system. Yet I fail to hear how we can fix it. In truth our system is just as bad if not worse than a government run system, since most people here who can not afford insurance do not get any medical coverage.
I hear a lot of stats about how many people don't have health care, but I never hear stats on how many of those people choose to go without healthcare, even if they can afford it, but they want to spend the money elsewhere.

Back in my younger days, I didn't have healthcare because I figured I didn't need it. True or not, that's how I felt, and I met a lot of other people who felt the same way.

When I was in the Navy and had government healthcare, I had to use it even if I didn't want to. But my wife could get civilian care, and that's what I paid for because I didn't much like the care I was getting. Yes, it cost money, and yes I didn't have a big-screen TV, a high-tech stereo, a sports car, or shiny chrome rims, but my wife was well-taken care of.

I'd like to see the stats on who 1) can't afford healthcare, 2) need it, and 3) can't get it because they can't afford it.
In addition we give way to much power to companies that really have no incentive to provide quality care. The example you provide actually proves the point that the US system only cares about the bottom dollar. That is sad. The poor girl died because people did not want to spend the money to save her. That is not only unfair but down right disturbing in a country such as ours. Quality health care should be a right of the people. Our system has failed millions of people. While government provide care is not the best option we have to come up with something other than what we have now.
You will never have a perfect system. And no system is static. We are looking in the wrong direction.

What the government giveth today, it taketh away tomorrow. The marginal cases like that of Nataline Sarkisyan will be the first to be dropped, followed by others. Eventually, you'll end up with a lot of uncovered people, just like now. The differences will be 1) higher taxes and 2) no alternatives.
 
Forwardassist,

I'm serious about my question to you. I will have to agree with what JuanCarlos (a miracle in itself:D) said. However, I still want to open up the discussion about this (at the OP's blessing, of course).
 
I'd have to pay that tax, I'm a pathetic 34" in the waist. I'm completely and totally against for other, more valid reasons than the fact that I would have to pay it. There is no legit reason for a government to enact such a tax.
 
For the average US citizen, we will incur 90% of our lifetime medical bills in the last year of ourr life. Now this is the average, not everyone. If we can just get everyone to die one year earlier which isn't really going to matter very much because that last year of life is usually of very poor quality then we can cut medical expenses here in the US by 90%. Looking for volunteers to get the ball rolling. :D

Also taking nominations.
 
not off the bat, you have a certain amount of time to lose the excess weight, if don't have the willpower to do it then hey it's less money for them to buy food:D
 
Under the maximum waist size plan, a man who is 6'2" tall with a 34 inch waist would be taxed, but a man that is 4'5" tall with a 32 inch waist would not. Which one is overweight?

BMI is useless. According to BMI standards, the following celebrities are considered overweight: Tom Cruise (BMI 26), George Clooney (BMI 29), Mark McGuire (BMI 30) and President George W. Bush (BMI 26). And surprisingly, Arnold Schwarzenegger (BMI 33), Sylvester Stallone (BMI 34) and Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson (BMI 33) are all considered obese.

New Jersey Devils goaltender Martin Brodeur is considered overweight with a BMI of 27, 97 percent of NFL players are considered overweight with a BMI of 27 or higher.

BMI is completely incorrect.
 
Yeah, BMI is pretty bad. It's not always entirely wrong, it's just that for anybody that is of anything but an extremely average build, it doesn't work at all. Which is why you see so many athletes and bodybuilders categorized as "obese."

Same way you used to see some guys maxing PT tests at 300+ in the Army facing discharge for not making weight (the standards have since been relaxed for those that exceed a fairly high PT score requirement).

Basically, anything but an actual body fat measurement is going to screw some people over. And I'd bet there are even exceptions to body fat measurements.
 
Im down,

Not for taxing fat people, but taxing people who abuse the system, constantly in for medical treatment, not employed, allot of felonies etc...these people should be treated differently. Not allowed to abuse the system.
 
It's been at least 10 years since I heard of anything dealing with measuring actual body fat. At that time, the process (as I understand it) involved putting someone in some sort of water tank and measuring water displacement. Or something like that. If that kind of process is still necessary to get an accurate measurment, it's probably going to be very expensive. I can't imagine our government opting for that kind of process and expense. So we'd have the less expensive, less accurate process instead.
 
Yes, of course, tax everything. Play high risk sports, ride a motorcycle, or drink any alcohol, pay a tax. Have guns, pay a tax. Smoke, pay a tax. Go out after dark, pay a tax. Live in a high crime neighborhood, pay a tax. Bad genetics, pay a tax. Gosh, the possibilities are endless in this brave new world.
 
Someone in one of the socalialist welfare countries did cost-benefit analysis on overweight people a few months back. What they found was that everyone gets a terminal disease at some point. If you get that disease sooner after leaving the work force, as most obese people do, your net health cost will be lower without diminishing your societal production. Basically if you die of a heart attack at 62 that is way better than collecting social security, taking tons of medications, receiving 20 colonoscopies... and dying at 80.
 
I was a D3 college football player a few years ago. I was a fullback, I am 6'2" and around 235 (36" waist). I was considered clinically overweight by my Docs charts, but when I finished school my bench was close to 500 pounds and I ran a 7:04 mile (now its around 430, no reason for protein bulk up anymore :( mile is around the same :)

I would say yes, even if I have to pay the tax as well. Overweight people are unhealthy, they take up room on airplanes (been hit in the face with many a wide posterior trying to get down the aisle :barf:) They give our country a very bad name with the rest of the world, we are already seen as a flabby, weakening, fast food nation and it will only get worse.

I am not talking about any massive tax, just a few dollars more to be put towards orphanages or something like that. I think that the overweight standards should be set by body fat %.

I am sorry to any morbidly obese people I might have offended here but with a few admitted exceptions there are few reasons to be over 300 pounds (exceptions would be professional athletes and people with health issues restricting them from exercise or dieting and other things like that)

Thanks,

YK
 
receiving 20 colonoscopies..

OMG, I've already had two. If I have to have 18 more, I think that I will have to shoot myself at some point!! :eek::eek:

The stuff they make you drink is so awful!

And being under anesthesia is never very good, in my opinion. But on the the other hand, though, I doubt that I could handle being awake while someone is probing up my colon.

I've got 45 months to go till my next scheduled one. They keep finding so many polyps each time, that I have to keep coming back every 5 years for another one. Last time they removed 6 of the buggers. That was twice the number I had the first time. :( :(

And here I got my first one at 49, a year before they say you need to get your first colonoscopy ( 50 ). Yet I already had three polyps started. Oh well, at least it is still better than letting the polyps grow, and turn into cancer.

My aunt died a pretty terrible death from colon cancer three years ago. She was 81, and never had a colonoscopy in her entire life. By the time she went to see the doctor, the cancer was quite widespread.

Unfortunately, she was a rather stubborn person. No one could tell her to do something that she did not want to do.

.
 
FwdAss said:
So what is your solution? I hear all the complaints about government provide medicine, and how it does not work. Much of it is true though some of it is clearly overblown by people who are loyal to the us system. Yet I fail to hear how we can fix it.

First get out of the mindset that your owed or entitled to ANY of it. The common starting point of 'if X won't GIVE it to me then Y should because it's HARD to do myself.' is symptomatic of the fundamental problem. People genuinely feel ENTITLED.

One specific solution to this particular issue is to start by recognizing being fat, or entertain yourself with drugs or alcohol are personal choices. The vast majority of American do NOT have these problems outside of their free will decisions. You absolutly free to put yourself at risk but NOT to expect a free pass from the consquences. Your not a 'victim' of those consequences your a VOLUNTEER to them.

After coming to grips with urge control there is an additional approach to handle the unforeseeables and I have mentioned it before. First PAY YOUR OWN DOCTOR BILLS AND PRESCRIPTIONS. Too many people think office visits and the resulting prescription ought to be free. NOPE. The office visit where I reside for a Family Practitioner is $55. A prescription for Amoxacillion (a common wide spectrum antibiotic) is another $70. A Specialist I went to charged me $85 for an office visit. Another one my son had to see cost me $129. A pediatrician costs $90. Full coverage health insurance however cost over $1000 per month to cover an entire family in participation with an employers group plan. Some employers simply pay it for you and reduce offered pay to compensate. The costs are much higher for full coverage for an entire family on a self pay consumer plan.

It should be becoming clear it is a great savings to NOT participate. But of course to worry sold to us is 'what if something MAJOR happens' right. Well there ARE critical care coverage policies available. They do NOT cover ANYTHING except CRITICAL care. You pay for your visits, your sprained ankle, etc. but you are covered for injuries requiring hospitalization, cancers, heart attacks, blindness, etc. Genuine critical needs. The cost for for me is about $700 a YEAR. Yes a YEAR. less then ONE MONTH of the cost to contribute to an HMO where the restrictions and choices are narrow and for less then 2 months self pay for the family my ENTIRE family has this coverage.

A bit of self reliance and willingness to pay for things MYSELF and the bases are covered. Go to the Doctor when you need to not just because Jr. coughed twice today.

Enough people get on this track and the rampant taking advantage of people because the sell has been made that your inevitably doomed if someone doesn't get you some full coverage health care will end. The insurance companies have sold the public on the idea they MUST have full coverage health insurance then priced it out of their reach when employers starting offering it to attract the more desirable employees and now the pubic at large BELIEVES they can not do without it and have even come to the point that NOT buying it and paying their OWN bills isn't even part of the thinking.

Remember.......you are entitled to NOTHING you haven't EARNED. Us fortunate enough to be Americans have rights and liberties others earned for our benefit, but outside of the best right off the bat chance in the world to achieve we are not owed ANYTHING not earned.

I heard once in my youth during the bicentennial (1976) a speech and a piece of it stuck with me to this day and has formed alot of my perspective. Liberty is too often defined as 'freedom'. Ask someone what liberty is and 'freedom' is almost always the answer. Well liberty is NOT freedom. Freedom is unto it's self. Liberty is the OWNERSHIP of one's OWN life. YOU own YOUR life. As owner your responsible for it not anyone else. And that life is finite. It will end at that will be all you get. During your life the amount of finite time you spend working of the behalf of another is compensated What you purchase or barter with that compensation is YOUR property. You have exchanged a portion of your finite life to acquire it and for any person or entity to force or compel it from you without compensation or benefit to give it to another finds your life less valuable then theirs and has made you slave to the beneficiary.

The speaker was more articulate but he brought an understanding of what being an American was and how very very different it was then any other country.

We are somehow now in a condition where not only is that not relayed as public knowledge but where we are actually buying into the 'equal result' mentality. There was a reason socialism and communism and monarchies and dictatorships, et al were seen as so despotic by past, and many many current Americans. Those mindsets are exactly counter to what America MEANS at what the state of being an American is about and what makes America so very different then any other country. It's not arrogance or haughtiness, it's the understanding of what liberty really is.

The socializing of anything is to make the populace subjects of the high government. There are other countries where being a subject is part of the culture and has been for so long that a sense of national pride is taken from thinking of ones self as such. But America is NOT like Europe or Asia or ANY OTHER place. To surrender that for free stuff because getting the things you need for yourself and your children is HARD should be to EXPECT to have a sense of being out of the mainstream and one should expect that sense of embarrassment that has turned to bitterness to hostility.

The saying that a Democracy will fall soon after the people learn that they can use their ballot to put money into their pocket from the Treasury filled from the pockets of others should be remembered. Those of this Republic see it far too much like a Democracy and have now learned that free stuff is a vote away.

We actually have people running for President on the PROMISE of getting people free stuff!!!. AND having demonstrated by dead and word that thet believe America needs to become MORE like the rest of the world!
 
YukonKid wrote:

Overweight people are unhealthy,

So are skinny people. Being too skinny is a sign of malnutrition, (very unhealthy) or of a posible eating disorder, also unhealthy. Gonna tax skinny people too?

they take up room on airplanes (been hit in the face with many a wide posterior trying to get down the aisle )

So keep your face out of the isle staring at the fat people.

They give our country a very bad name with the rest of the world, we are already seen as a flabby, weakening, fast food nation and it will only get worse.

Wow. You seem very discriminatory towards overweight people.


I am sorry to any morbidly obese people I might have offended here but with a few admitted exceptions there are few reasons to be over 300 pounds (exceptions would be professional athletes and people with health issues restricting them from exercise or dieting and other things like that)

Really? My uncle is 6'9" and well over 300 lbs. No "visible" fat on him. Bet he still fails the BMI tho. No excuse for him? YOU tell him he's getting taxed for that, and let me know how that works out for you.....

I'm 6'4" and have been really close to 300 lbs my whole life. I am considered morbidly obese by the current measuring system. I assure you that at 6'4" and 270lbs, I am VERY far from fat. And I don't think I've EVER seen a 32" waist, except maybe at 15-16. Do I get your tax too? A might bigoted aren't we? :(
 
Derius_T, you sir seem to be very bitter about this issue. I realize that we all have differing opinions and that yours and mine happen to be at opposite ends of the spectrum.

As for skinny people, I do not hear of to many of them dyeing of heart failure and blood clots, sweating from walking up stairs or complaining about regulation office chairs being to small (don't laugh, I had to put up with it for 3 months :rolleyes:). I realize of course that is is very unhealthy to be extremely skinny, but much more-so to be extremely obese.

As to my airplane statement, I do not stick my head out in the aisle hoping to be nailed by a big wheezing person on their way to the back, but it does happen with just my head in its purchased space. Anyone who has traveled as extensively and frequently as I have knows that these things happen, and although they are always accidents it is still unpleasant.

As to the way obese people portray our country, I am sorry to say that it is correct, although not the way I would wish it. Other countries view us as an obese nation, just like western europe and Asia are renowned for heavy public smoking.

As to your personal physical condition, well...I guess you would be paying the tax, just like me. I am not talking about an outrageous tax, but a few extra dollars a year would be nice. The body is a temple and although it is your choice to live anyway you desire in this country it is more rewarding to lead a healthy life. I think we can all agree on that.

There is nothing stopping anyone who feels fat to diet or run. I was a fat kid until I hit high school, then discovered I was good at hurting people. I did football, rugby, and wrestling and I can tell you I got in shape so fast it made my eyes water. I stayed in sports ever since and they have been my savior.

Thanks for reading, I hope we can keep this all civil, even if we don't all agree (which we never do :) its the nature of the beast)

YK
 
The government will not and has not ever paid for anything. It is our money, the tax payers money and does not belong to the government!
Enough said!:mad:
 
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