Should I only shoot 38 spl in a python? (Does 357 wear out revolvers?)
- Thread starter cjsoccer3
- Start date
My $0.02:
Pythons seem to have a reputation for being delicate, likely assumed so because of the intricate lockwork. AFAIK, though, they're not quite as delicate as their reputation.
That said, the bigger issue is the growing paucity of qualified 'smiths and replacement parts for the Python. Shooting .357s here and there isn't likely to "wear out" your Python, but .357s do add wear and tear relative to .38s, and since it's tough to service Pythons nowadays, I personally would reserve .357s (as well as rapid DA shooting and fast reloads) for one of my other revolvers entirely.
Pythons seem to have a reputation for being delicate, likely assumed so because of the intricate lockwork. AFAIK, though, they're not quite as delicate as their reputation.
That said, the bigger issue is the growing paucity of qualified 'smiths and replacement parts for the Python. Shooting .357s here and there isn't likely to "wear out" your Python, but .357s do add wear and tear relative to .38s, and since it's tough to service Pythons nowadays, I personally would reserve .357s (as well as rapid DA shooting and fast reloads) for one of my other revolvers entirely.
The Python is not a weakling in terms of .357s and I'm not a fan of the
Python. It'll hold up as well as a Smith 586/686 for gentlemanly firing
of the .357.
Where the criticism comes in for the Python, from MY POINT OF VIEW, is
that the lockwork doesn't really hold up in fast and continuous double action
shooting, i.e. the timing goes out faster than a Smith. In other words,
non-gentlemanly use.
And it's from DA use that proves the Smith or also now the Ruger GP 100.
The 586/686, Ruger GP 100 and the Python are basically the same frame
size but the lockworks for the Smith and Ruger are more accommodating.
Just an FYI, usually the speed loaders for all three mentioned revolvers
work as will the leather basically fit the three.
The Smith 586 in 1980 was to take on the Python, which was already
waning in popularity because of price, and the GP 100 was Ruger's
response to the Smith 586.
Oh, gosh of gosh, why did Smith and Ruger have to emulate the
heavy lug of the Python on most of their mdoels!!!!!!!
Python. It'll hold up as well as a Smith 586/686 for gentlemanly firing
of the .357.
Where the criticism comes in for the Python, from MY POINT OF VIEW, is
that the lockwork doesn't really hold up in fast and continuous double action
shooting, i.e. the timing goes out faster than a Smith. In other words,
non-gentlemanly use.
And it's from DA use that proves the Smith or also now the Ruger GP 100.
The 586/686, Ruger GP 100 and the Python are basically the same frame
size but the lockworks for the Smith and Ruger are more accommodating.
Just an FYI, usually the speed loaders for all three mentioned revolvers
work as will the leather basically fit the three.
The Smith 586 in 1980 was to take on the Python, which was already
waning in popularity because of price, and the GP 100 was Ruger's
response to the Smith 586.
Oh, gosh of gosh, why did Smith and Ruger have to emulate the
heavy lug of the Python on most of their mdoels!!!!!!!
Doc Holliday 1950
New member
I have a "67 Python 4" since 1970 and have put so many 357 mag rounds thru
it that I can't even begin to count. For the first 10 years I never put 38's in it.
IMHO, I don't think that one is able to overshoot a Python that has been well taken care of shooting 357 mag ammo. If I'm wrong, please explain.
it that I can't even begin to count. For the first 10 years I never put 38's in it.
IMHO, I don't think that one is able to overshoot a Python that has been well taken care of shooting 357 mag ammo. If I'm wrong, please explain.
Bill DeShivs
New member
I never figured out how anyone can enjoy shooting .357s anyway.
Andy Blozinski
New member
"I never figured out how anyone can enjoy shooting .357s anyway. "
I have a Rhino and thus firing .357s is no big deal. But...the ammo costs more and I assume it puts more wear on the weapon, so I fire .38s for my whole range trip until the end. Then I fire a cylinder or two of .357s.
I have a Rhino and thus firing .357s is no big deal. But...the ammo costs more and I assume it puts more wear on the weapon, so I fire .38s for my whole range trip until the end. Then I fire a cylinder or two of .357s.
UncleEd, Yes the N Frame is a little more than the L Frame 586/686. I have three N Frames. They are a Model 27-2, Model 28-2 Highway Patrolman and a Model 25-13 in .45 Colt. Then for comparison I have a Model 686-1 in an L Frame. I can not tell the difference with my medium size hands. In fact the Model 25 is actually lighter than the Model 686 until you load them and the .45 Colt rounds cause the Model 25 to be an ounce heavier. Now if you loaded some of the newer 686's with the 7 to 8 round capacity, they might be heavier.
I think the perceived grip size on the L and N frames could be dependent upon types of stocks/grips.
It will be interesting to get other's opinions.
I think the perceived grip size on the L and N frames could be dependent upon types of stocks/grips.
It will be interesting to get other's opinions.
Another echo for MrBorland's and UncleEd's comments. The frame and cylinder of the Python aren't weak, it's the Colt V-spring lockwork that has a reputation for being somewhat delicate. Rightly earned, in my opinion, based on the Colt's that have passed through my hands.
The Python is built on Colt's ".41-frame". The Colt Official Police and Officer's Models are built on this frame and I seem to recall reading somewhere that Colt felt those revolvers could handle limited amounts of the hot .38/44 that S&W built the N-frame (.44-frame) .38/44 Outdoorsman and Heavy Duty to handle. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong on this! I do know from handling a couple of OPs and OMs that they are physically much bigger than my K-frame S&Ws, looking much more like the larger L-frame.
Enjoy shooting your Python, don't hammer it with fast DA shooting and combat drills and it'll last a very long time. Learn how to check the timing, keep an eye on it, get it repaired properly when it starts to go out.
And if you do get the urge to do a lot of hard and fast DA-work, get yourself a S&W 586/686. Everybody needs more than 1 good revolver anyway!
Edited: lamarw, the L-frame grip is identical to the K-frames. The N-frames, at least the older ones I've owned and fired, have a longer trigger reach than the Ks and Ls. I heard somewhere S&W made a change and all current production revolvers have K-frame-size grip frames, but don't quote me on that.
As to weight, yep, my 586 weighs as much as my grandfather's old Highway Patrolman. Balances more to the muzzle though with the heavy barrel and full underlug. But the grip is smaller, which is good cause I didn't come out as big as my grampa.
The Python is built on Colt's ".41-frame". The Colt Official Police and Officer's Models are built on this frame and I seem to recall reading somewhere that Colt felt those revolvers could handle limited amounts of the hot .38/44 that S&W built the N-frame (.44-frame) .38/44 Outdoorsman and Heavy Duty to handle. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong on this! I do know from handling a couple of OPs and OMs that they are physically much bigger than my K-frame S&Ws, looking much more like the larger L-frame.
Enjoy shooting your Python, don't hammer it with fast DA shooting and combat drills and it'll last a very long time. Learn how to check the timing, keep an eye on it, get it repaired properly when it starts to go out.
And if you do get the urge to do a lot of hard and fast DA-work, get yourself a S&W 586/686. Everybody needs more than 1 good revolver anyway!
Edited: lamarw, the L-frame grip is identical to the K-frames. The N-frames, at least the older ones I've owned and fired, have a longer trigger reach than the Ks and Ls. I heard somewhere S&W made a change and all current production revolvers have K-frame-size grip frames, but don't quote me on that.
As to weight, yep, my 586 weighs as much as my grandfather's old Highway Patrolman. Balances more to the muzzle though with the heavy barrel and full underlug. But the grip is smaller, which is good cause I didn't come out as big as my grampa.
I wouldn't fire anything but 38's in it, but then I don't shoot anything but 38's in any of my 357's. I've got thousands of rounds of 38 brass that I've never reloaded, not to mention the ones I do.
I've never seen much sense in shooting louder, harder kicking, more expensive ammo in any gun, just to punch a hole in a piece of paper. I suppose if I hunted with a handgun, or carried one for self-defense or as a duty weapon it might be different.
One other factor that seldom gets mentioned. These guns for the most part, Pythons and Model 19's come to mind, well, the newest of them are 50 years old. Most of them come to us as used guns. We don't really KNOW how many or what type of rounds they may have been used with in the past. The next 357 load, might be the last one. That's hyperbole of course, but it's something too think about. Why subject these old guns (and yes, I'm older than most of them) to more wear and tear than necessary?
I've never seen much sense in shooting louder, harder kicking, more expensive ammo in any gun, just to punch a hole in a piece of paper. I suppose if I hunted with a handgun, or carried one for self-defense or as a duty weapon it might be different.
One other factor that seldom gets mentioned. These guns for the most part, Pythons and Model 19's come to mind, well, the newest of them are 50 years old. Most of them come to us as used guns. We don't really KNOW how many or what type of rounds they may have been used with in the past. The next 357 load, might be the last one. That's hyperbole of course, but it's something too think about. Why subject these old guns (and yes, I'm older than most of them) to more wear and tear than necessary?
K Frames Smiths are 38s you can occasionaly shoot 357s. N Frames are 357s that can shoot 38s.
The Python is like the Smith N Frame Model 28/27. I doubt you will wear them out with shooting normal 357 loads.
I had a couple that I shot the crap out of in the 70-80s. They held up quite well.
I have shot a couple K frames loose, a Model 19 & Model 13.
The Python is like the Smith N Frame Model 28/27. I doubt you will wear them out with shooting normal 357 loads.
I had a couple that I shot the crap out of in the 70-80s. They held up quite well.
I have shot a couple K frames loose, a Model 19 & Model 13.
Shooting 38s fast DA will be harder on it than shooting heavy 357s slow fire SA.
Shooting ultra hot 110 or 125gr loads with H110/WW296 will erode the forcing cone on any revolver (the real problem of K frame 357s this erosion leads to cracks in the thin cone).
Shoot commercial level 158gr (1200-1250fps not Buffalo Bore 1450fps level) loads and limit rapid DA shooting and a Python will last a long time.
Shooting ultra hot 110 or 125gr loads with H110/WW296 will erode the forcing cone on any revolver (the real problem of K frame 357s this erosion leads to cracks in the thin cone).
Shoot commercial level 158gr (1200-1250fps not Buffalo Bore 1450fps level) loads and limit rapid DA shooting and a Python will last a long time.
It's really just physics. If you take a piece of railroad track and whack on it with a 12 oz ball peen hammer you, the railroad track and the hammer will last a very long time.
Do the same thing with a 4 pound Engineers hammer, you'll get tired and, the hammer and the railroad track will start to wear after a while.
Do the same thing with a 4 pound Engineers hammer, you'll get tired and, the hammer and the railroad track will start to wear after a while.
Bob Wright
New member
Bill,
I, for one, find the .357 Magnum, especially in my 6" S&W Model 586, very pleasant shooting. It is flat shooting out to ranges of 75 yards or so and capable of putting down ground hogs or similar creatures.
Loaded with light JHP bullets it puts them down range very quickly, and with very good accuracy. My "ideal" six shooter is a 7 1/2" barreled Colt New Frontier. I do have a 6 1/2" Ruger Blackhawk Three Screw that is filling that want right now. I do have a pet load using a 158 gr. cast SWC at around 1200 f.p.s. that is pleasant shooting, though it does illuminate the area when fired.
Bob Wright
I, for one, find the .357 Magnum, especially in my 6" S&W Model 586, very pleasant shooting. It is flat shooting out to ranges of 75 yards or so and capable of putting down ground hogs or similar creatures.
Loaded with light JHP bullets it puts them down range very quickly, and with very good accuracy. My "ideal" six shooter is a 7 1/2" barreled Colt New Frontier. I do have a 6 1/2" Ruger Blackhawk Three Screw that is filling that want right now. I do have a pet load using a 158 gr. cast SWC at around 1200 f.p.s. that is pleasant shooting, though it does illuminate the area when fired.
Bob Wright