Shotgun Instruction

IF you add weight, I would try to add it in a way that you get the balance point where you want it. If you only add weight to the buttstock, and it changes the balance to the rear, your barrel will feel "whippy" as you swing it. Most folks that shoot driven birds like a gun perfectly balanced on the hinge pin so it moves effortlessly, while clay target shooters seem to prefer a little muzzle heavy gun tends to swing smoother on the follow through. With the 870, taking an empty hull and filling it with lead and placing it behind the mag spring will add about 4oz or so. Add another one in the butt and you've gained a 1/2 pound very easily. If you still need more, add another in each location.

Get the gun fitted, a good recoil reduction system - not necessarily just a pad - and shoot light loads - you should be good to go once the shoulder heals

Good luck
 
OneOunce's way to add weight works on a pump gun pretty well.

On my guns, what I do is check the balance point / put some tape on the receiver - and mark the balance point as you hold the gun level in one hand. Then I add the weight / using OneOunces way - or with a mercury recoi supressor ( if you have room for it ) - or on some guns, especially semi-autos, I use lead tape, from a golf club store - and add about 8" in the area of the forearm / and 8oz in the butt stock ( take the recoil pad off / and pack it in the bolt hole in the stock ) ....and move them back and forth until you get the same balance point.

You can also buy weighted end caps / for the nut that holds the forend on the mag tube.

I'm not a big fan of external barrel weights ...but you could do that as well ( but it scratches up a barrel / and that irritates me ).

What works best - depends on your gun / how much room there is inside the forend.
 
As a guy that has had a complete shoulder re-build in my shooting shoulder ..... completely torn rotator cuff, 4 bone spurs, torn bicep .... ( and the 9 months it took me to recover from that surgery - last year ) ....advises me to tell you, don't mess with shoulder pain. My surgeon ground out the bone spurs, repaired the rotator cuff, cut the bicep - and re-attached it with 2 screws mid way up my arm - to the bone.

I was young and stupid / played football on astro-turf that was akin to concrete in the 70's .... and was way too macho when it came to lifting things that were out of my league ( I'm 6'5" and 290 lbs ...and I can move anything ...) and I used to think I was invinceable ..../...but over many years of .... a few motorcycle accidents, a few shoulder dislocations, a few skiing accidents ...and all that stuff adds up. All of the fun I had / and the stupid things I did - contributed to what became constant pain to the point where I couldn't sleep more than an hour at a time / and the eventual surgery last year.

Now as I go into my 60's ....its a burden that I deal with every day ..!!!

Shotgunning didn't hurt me ....and it won't hurt you either / after you get the gun mount and gun fit figured out. I still shoot shotguns once a week today ( reasonably well ) - and a variety of handguns a couple times a week. I have some intermittent nerve issues in my shooting arm and shoulder from the surgery ...but overall I'm in Great Shape ....

... but what I am saying, is take it easy ....let yourself heal !!!

When you get to be an old crabby goat - like some of us - you'll thank us ....
 
Oneounce and BigJim.

Th golf tape I am familiar with and I looked around the net and discovered weighted mag caps and clamp on barrel weights. (Like Jim I donn't like the idea of scrathing up the barrel with clamps.) I was trying to figure out a way of slipping something like a snap cap in the mag for weight, but was concentrating on the wrong end. No way would that work since as I racked, even if I was only loading a single shell at a time for trap, it would want to feed the snap cap. What oneounce explained makes sense. It adds weight and still permits me to use the magazine, but it now has a 5 round capacity as opposed to 6, and 5 is plenty. I also like the fact that using an empty hull costs peanuts and allows me to adjust the weight. Thanks again!
 
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BigJim: I don't know about waiting to turn into an old crabby goat. I am probably older than you (63 and counting) which has something to do with why I have been so careful approaching this sport.

I used to love golf, but I can't touch a club.

That rotator cuff injury of yours was a bitch and it must have been hell to deal with, but the fact that you can shoot suggests that if I do things right things will be a cake walk for me. I was concerned with the rotational aspect of recoil. It hasn't been a problem.

Me, I skied a little and used to ride a street Harley, but fortunately never had a bad accident. (Little guys don't fall as far and impact with less force.)

I will listen and take it easy on my shoulder.

(I went back and saw I misssed the part about the torn bicep. That was nasty. We were all indestructible back then.)
 
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But I had more fun than most .....:D

You are a little older than I am ....thank you ....I knew there was someone out there ...:rolleyes: ...besides Zippy13 of course ....:p

On all the clay target games - you never need to have more than 1 shell in the mag - so you have plenty of room for weight .../but ideally you want the gun to fit, and swing the same, in the field too. So coming up with something that works for both is a good idea.

Keep the faith ....it will all work out.

Short story - but in 1998 or so, Browning introduced the 525 series Ciroi O/U - factory engraved, great looking gun. I decided I had to have one ....but I didn't know much about gun fit. I paid about $ 2,000 for the gun - one of the first ones on west coast / and it beat the daylights out of me. By station 3 on a sporting course - I would have a face bruise, then bloody cheek ....and I'd finish the round .....big shoulder bruise all the time - let my face heal - pick the scab off ....and do it again in about 2 weeks. I finally fixed it with a stick on comb pad - raising the comb and making it almost parallel to the rib - and adding some to length of pull. I understand not quitting ... But Shotguns just don't come in one size fits all... I have since moved on to other models of the Citori, that fit me a lot better ....no face slap, no bruised shoulders.. Get around some "Skeet" shooters - they seem to really understand this "Gun Fit" issue....
 
BigJimP,

Got back from WalMart and it doesn't look as though I am going to get the low recoil stuff I should be starting with there.

If I take the 870 in the field, it will be set up completely different than it now. At a minimum, it will have something like a vent rib 28" barrel. I may not need the added weights for clay shooting with such a barrel, only with the current home defense barrel.

I will give it a month but then I may consider another gone for the range and keeping the 870 as is for HD. That or getting the second barrel. First I want to get the basics down.
 
oneounceload; I may order from that outfit. Truth be told I am tight with a buck, but in this case it may be worth it to pay theh price to get the ligher loads. First, I think I will follow your advice on adding some weight to the gun and am going to try to pick up a few boxes locally to see how I do with that in the heavier gun. That and I just sent an email requesting info on setting up a lesson.
 
Since you're really getting into this stuff ....look at the MEC line of reloaders too ....

http://www.mecreloaders.com/

Many of us have been reloading shotshells for a long time / primarily because we want a specific velocity with a certain pellet size ....for a specific gague. The MEC Grabber model - is a simple Progressive machine / that manually indexes ...and is a very solid machine. Even though I've gone on to some of their hydraulic machines ....I still have one Mec Grabber in 12ga and one in 20ga that I'm going to pass down to one of the kids pretty soon - that I bought in the 70's ...

Reloading shotshells will also save you a few bucks per box / because you can load a premium quality shell - way less than premium ammo - and still cheaper than the promotional ammo too. But mostly get exactly what you want...my primary 12ga load is 1 oz of 8's at 1225 fps .... but for some of the grandkids I can back that load clear down to 1150 fps ...with just a 10 second bushing change. In 20ga I can load them up to 1oz, down to 7/8 oz ...or even down to 3/4oz like a 28ga load ....

My cost, using current component prices, is $ 3.67 a box for my 12ga loads ...and that's a pretty good savings ....and it adds another factor to the hobby....
 
BigJim. I have mused about reloading but am not going to get into that, yet, although I can see its benefits. Not just the direct cost benefit saved if you shoot a lot of rounds, and the ability to customize shot to your needs, but the satisfaction some have expressed from loading.

Still, we have to bear the cost of appropriate equipment in mind; large screen high definition TV for the garage and a frig for necessary refreshments.

I noticed a picture of your table saw and outfeed table on another thread, where you had some of your SGs displayed on it. I also have orders from family members backed up for basic book shelves and things to make on my somewhat new Home Depot granite top. It is probably rather crude compared to what you use but I love it. That is getting a bit off topic for this forum.
 
Adding weight to the 870 butt

I popped the pad of the stock, which was super easy onece I figured out the screw werre Phillips heads. So exactly what is the proper way to add the weighted shot hulls to the stock? I doubt that I just toss them in the hollow cavity or do I?

As long as I had the pad off I tried mounting the gun and it seemed to fit MUCH better the very first time I threw it up. With the pad it was nearly impossible not to see way to much barrel and now the top of the receiver and the bead is what I see and without scrunching up my neck.

Before shortening anything I will get a pro to check the fit and then consider if it should be cut a tad more to allow for a thicker pad and thicker clothing (tested with a thin shirt).

BigJimP suggested reloading and having looked at the low end machine he suppoed a link for it may be possible not to far down the road. (My wife got her new car.)

For the time being I am going to check out a place called Bas Pro, which has been described like a Disneyland or cornucopia of outdoor supplies. I am pumped.
 
For the weight inside the stock / figure out where you want it - how deep in the cavity you want it ... and use a dowel rod / an old towel ...or whatever to take up the space in front and in back of it....so it doesn't slide back and forth - and stays precisely at the point you want it. You can tape the spent hulls together or whatever works / doesn't have to be fancy...just so it doesn't move.

ReCobs Target shop is where I buy my loaders and wads in case quantities....and they're good people.

http://www.recobstargetshop.com/index.htm

They have new Grabber models for about $ 370 ....but there are a lot of good used machines around too ...my local gun show always has some. There are cheaper models too ....but I like the capability of the Grabber ...its the low end of the Progressive machines ....but has a good resizer, etc ...and It'll give you a good 5 - 6 boxes an hour with no problem.

Bass Pro, Cabelas, etc are all fun shops to visit ...have a good time ...
 
Bass Pro, like Cabela's is a great place to look and touch - but their pricing is a little higher than you can get elsewhere.

As to the leaded hulls - see which one will fit - depending on the bored hole size, usually a 12, but possibly a 20 gauge might be necessary.

If you can't get the crimped ends shut properly, you might ask at your local gun club and see if someone can make you a few of them.

For reloading equipment, once you've figured what hardware you want, look on your local Craig's List, the gun club bulletin board, even Ebay - buying a used press is a lot cheaper than new.

From your description of you not having to "scrunch" down, and the barrel is aligning itself so you do not see barrel or rib, you might be getting close to a good fit. Pick the corner in a room where the ceiling and walls meet, close your eyes, mount the gun, open your eyes - if you are pointing and looking where you were when you closed your eyes, you're pretty close - the proof will be shooting targets
 
Well drooling at Bass Pro is out as I now have to meet my son in about an hour, but I went out and picked up mini-Mag flashlight for pointing drills.

I don't understand what oneonunce is saying about the bore size in relation to placing some leaded hulls in the stock. Are you talking about the hole that would be bored in a solid stock to accept the long screw and washer used to fix it to the receiver? Mine is a hollow synthetic stock.

What BigJim is saying about using a towel or what it takes makes sense. One thought I have is to use plastic clamps available at any big box home hardware designed for fastening copper or PVC pipe to house studs. Instead of secriwing them to the inside of the stock, fasten them with a semi-permanent adhesive/glue.
 
I don't understand what oneonunce is saying about the bore size in relation to placing some leaded hulls in the stock. Are you talking about the hole that would be bored in a solid stock to accept the long screw and washer used to fix it to the receiver? Mine is a hollow synthetic stock.
Click to expand...

Yep, this old man was thinking wood stock and the hole.............

Added: - swapping out the plastic for wood would easily add some recoil-absorbing weight as well
 
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That's okay oneounce. Given all the people you are helping with different makes and models I would think it would be easily to confuse. And I have thought about a wood stock, but if I do that this one will be kept as is for HD and I may look around for an old fasioned wood stocked/blued shooter. What people say about the wingmasters intrigues me but I guess they are all 2-3/4 inches. Now that I have something I can take my time and see if a good opportunity arises to get something used. (The guy I was shooting with the other day was shooting a 58 year old something that was gorgeous. He shot my little 870 twise on the trap range and nailed them both, not a wing but blasted them.)

Ans as for your help and the help of everyone, I am tickled.

RE the length of the stock, I replaced the pad and once again I was seeing an awful lot of barrel.
 
I was thinking wood stock too ....( assumptions..:barf:) ....so OneOunce and I were both envisioning a hole in the stock about 1" in diameter. My Benelli semi-auto has a carbon fibre stock as well / but it was pretty easy to fill the void with the weight wrapped and taped inside a bar towel.

When you say you're seeing a lot of barrel when you mount the gun - that's partly affected by the angle of the comb as well ...so there are a lot of factors working here - to get this gun to fit you right / so it quits beating you up.

The goal is no shoulder pain - even if you shoot 10 - 12 boxes a day...(which many of us do / especially in big 4 day tournaments ). If the gun fits - how many boxes you shoot will not be a factor .....mental fatigue / from watching that many targets ...will be the biggest reason you'll be tired at the end of your day - or at least that should be your goal in my opinion.
 
BigJim. There is lot I am going to have to do to shoot well. I didn't even mention that I wear varifocal glasses and suspect I need a pair designed specifically for shooting. As it is, I am looking over the top of the lenses.
 
Yes, I wear progressive bi-foculs too ....and they don't work for shooting ...and I even have an extra prism in mine --- because of some eye muscle laziness ... that blurrs my vision in my dominant eye ...off and on ...( makes shooting flying targets a little more challenging ...when there at big fuzzy clouds of 6 of them out there ...)... but what the heck, if it wasn't fun, I'd have another hobby...

Talk to Decot Hywyd.... they'll tell you what you need.../ they've made my shooting glasses for several years !! They aren't cheap / but its a good product - and they're good to work with ....

http://www.sportglasses.com

OneOunce and I are just into your checkbook clear to our necks aren't we ....we're sorry ...well, a little bit anyway .... I have to have separate lenses made for my handgunning too ....so I can see my front sight clear on my handguns ....

getting old, isn't for lightweights ....
 
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