Shooting that New No. 1....HELP

Bongo,
I shoot a Remington Rolling Block 45-70 with an aperture site with great results. You have a scope that was not tightened down in the first place. It's a start all over scenario! After the tightened down scope has been fired at the range, go to your NRA rules of shooting...Don't pull or jerk the trigger...squeeze the trigger. Take full breathe and release slowly, and stop breathing before the fire. Don't anticipate the "boom", rather let the boom surprise you. The 45.70 almost wiped out the late 1800's buffalo heard from people riding horses. It's most accurate in the experienced firing hands.
 
Okay, lots of suggestions here and all are greatly appreciated. I've seen some improvement in bullet sizing by running them down front first--and have a good number of jacketed bullets to fire side-by-side, so to speak, with the cast ones for some comparisons there. I'll stick with the 4198 for now as I believe that's the only smokeless powder I have that's appropriate for .45-70.
 
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LIL. I have a #1 in .45-70 and it is a great shooter (405 grain over a powder that doesn't come to me at the moment). Anyhow, why the Lead Sled?

What I would try, before anything else, is letting someone else try the identical set-up, to see if their results are the same as yours. This big bore, heavy kickers, can give all of us a moment of pause and/or the yips!
 
Number 1 question: Have you slowed things down/gone to ~40 grains/4198 ?
Click to expand...

Just getting there tonight, actually. I have just finished 20 rds with 42 gr 4198 under the same 320 gr cast slugs, and am at the moment wiping down 20 rds of 38 gr 4198 under some 350 gr jacketed soft point (round nose) beauties. These are the repackaged 'factory second' bullets from Midway that appear to be nearly identical to Hornady Interlock bullets:



I hope to get to the range in the next 2 days.

The commercial bullets of course throw a new factor into the mix, but what the hell, we're having so much fun why not add another set of variables to the problem.

I can't remember a thing regarding herpolhodes and polhodes of spin stabilization from physics, but I gotta wonder if a 1-in-20 twist barrel is really the best one can do for higher-performance .45-70 loads. Long before I start thinking I need to carve out a chunk of my retirement fund to rebarrel a toy, I will see better shooting from the stock Ruger No 1. But, I'm just curious about a twist rate that is nearly half that of say a 458 Win Mag. Why would you choose that twist rate for a No 1 or a bolt gun in this caliber? According to my Hornady load book, that's also the twist rate of the Marlin 1895 in .45-70.

Sur
 
Concerning the twist rate, I'm not an expert or anything, but I think the Rugers were made for people who wanted to hot rod the 45-70 cartridge for safaris and large game, which would traditionally mean using heavy for caliber bullets as opposed to the light for caliber bullets you're using.

The fastest twist rate I've seen in a 45-70 is 1:18.

If you're really looking for accuracy in 45-70, you aren't going to find it with light bullets. I didn't start to see any real accuracy from my 45-70 rifles until I started shooting 500+ bullets.

Right now I'm running 510 grain bullets (a traditional bullet for .458 Win Mag actually) over 5744. The resulting load subsonic, pleasant to shoot, very accurate (in one of my guns) and carries over a 1000 ft lbs of energy out to 300 yards.
 
You may want to look into things a bit further. The Ruger's 1:20" actually is a "fairly" fast twist for the .45-70!

The 1873 Trapdoor Springfield and the 1886 Winchester are both 1:22".

For a given bullet there is a "perfect" twist rate. For a range of bullets, there is a "works good enough" twist rate, which may not be the perfect one for a given bullet.

STANDARD factory ammo for the .45-70 is the 405gr bullet. Odds are good that the Ruger twist is good for that weight.

.458 STANDARD loads are 500gr bullets. Likely the faster twist in .458Win is for that reason.

Also, consider the twist rate that what makes a huge difference to a .22cal slug at 600yds might not be a significant issue with a .45 cal slug at 100yds (or less).
 
44AMP is right on. You have to consider that the speed the bullet is being pushed is also an important factor in twist rate. There's a reason almost every airgun made regardless of caliber has the same twist rate. It's because almost every high quality airgun shoots at subsonic speeds. Powerful airguns use their power to push heavier pellets, not light bullets faster.
 
The bullets are sizing far better than they were, thanks to the tip. The 420 gr units came out of the mold quite nicely and I've been simply not cranking in the lube for a first nose-first run. When I'm tired of that, I then put some pressure on the lube chamber and start the 2nd operation, crimping on the gas check. Truly a 100% improvement I think.



Here, the Jake's Moly Ceresin is beginning to give way to the Jake's Scarlet--I'm not expecting anything to improve due to the lube, but it's what's in the cabinet.

Case Prep

Having loaded mostly 40SW and 45 Auto once-fired brass, case prep for me has been quite limited. Even when I started buying 10mm Auto, 44 Mag and 45 Win Mag brass, sizing has been all that was needed--at least to my eye.

I've carried those habits forward to high-pressure .45-70 loading, and have just now noticed that was a bad call. My source for that brass is new Starline cases, and I started out simply full-length sizing and that's it.

While I noticed the case mouths are untrimmed and not perfectly flat and clean, it took me longer to realize they also have a slight burr on the outside. It can just be felt, but seen easily with the Opti-Visor. While it might be a 1/1000th or less, it's there--on the unfired cases. On the fired ones, it's been pretty much taken care of. :eek:

Anyway, squaring-away the case with a whole lot more attention to cleaning up the mouth in particular should go a long way toward avoiding undue pressure and more uniform performance, I'd think. 'More attention'...there's a thought.
 
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