Shooting at an oncoming car thats trying to hit you
- Thread starter TheNocturnus
- Start date
motorcycle
Jumping out of the way is probably the right way to go, but don't expect it to be really easy or clean. I did face this type of situation when I was 18.Not with a gun and not a car.
I was crossing the street to get to a bus that was going to take our group to a restaurant. Suddenly this large motorcycle (Honda 650 as it turned out) piloted by a drunk (determined by police at the scene) came screaming around the corner. I saw him coming and ran like hell for the other side of the road. His reactions were a bit slow, so he turned where he thought I wasn't going - and instead turned and headed right for me. I saw I wasn't going to make it in that direction, so I spun around and headed the other way - for three steps. In the meantime, this dimwit's brain told him to turn the other way too - a second too late - and I saw that there was no way to avoid him. I jumped, almost made it, my left leg got clipped while I was in mid air, I flew about 10 feet and he wobbled to a stop about 50 yards further. My left leg was broken in two places, my back was sprained, and my shoulder and chest were badly bruised. I ended up spending over a week in the hospital (this was 40 years ago, so it was less unusual than now).
Lesson 1: This happened in less time than it took you to read this. All thoughts were in impressions rather than words.
Lesson 2: If I had jumped a second sooner, I would have avoided being hit, a second later and I would have been seriously injured or dead.
Lesson 3: I couldn't care less what you think you would do, it's all different when that screaming hunk of steel is right there.
Lesson 4: It changes your life. The ensuing post-trauma arthritis put an end to almost all of my sports - no more tennis, no more skiing, no more running; it's not fun when every step makes your ankle crack and sends shooting pains up your leg. Of course that also translates to pain on walking up hills, stairs, long distances on the flat. I've gutted it out for 40 years with only NSAIDs to keep things in check.
Lesson 5: Don't be an idiot, get out of the way as best you can, if you shoot the guy and just get clipped by the car, you'll still likely be paying for the incident for the rest of your life - and I don't mean court costs (see lesson 4).
Jumping out of the way is probably the right way to go, but don't expect it to be really easy or clean. I did face this type of situation when I was 18.Not with a gun and not a car.
I was crossing the street to get to a bus that was going to take our group to a restaurant. Suddenly this large motorcycle (Honda 650 as it turned out) piloted by a drunk (determined by police at the scene) came screaming around the corner. I saw him coming and ran like hell for the other side of the road. His reactions were a bit slow, so he turned where he thought I wasn't going - and instead turned and headed right for me. I saw I wasn't going to make it in that direction, so I spun around and headed the other way - for three steps. In the meantime, this dimwit's brain told him to turn the other way too - a second too late - and I saw that there was no way to avoid him. I jumped, almost made it, my left leg got clipped while I was in mid air, I flew about 10 feet and he wobbled to a stop about 50 yards further. My left leg was broken in two places, my back was sprained, and my shoulder and chest were badly bruised. I ended up spending over a week in the hospital (this was 40 years ago, so it was less unusual than now).
Lesson 1: This happened in less time than it took you to read this. All thoughts were in impressions rather than words.
Lesson 2: If I had jumped a second sooner, I would have avoided being hit, a second later and I would have been seriously injured or dead.
Lesson 3: I couldn't care less what you think you would do, it's all different when that screaming hunk of steel is right there.
Lesson 4: It changes your life. The ensuing post-trauma arthritis put an end to almost all of my sports - no more tennis, no more skiing, no more running; it's not fun when every step makes your ankle crack and sends shooting pains up your leg. Of course that also translates to pain on walking up hills, stairs, long distances on the flat. I've gutted it out for 40 years with only NSAIDs to keep things in check.
Lesson 5: Don't be an idiot, get out of the way as best you can, if you shoot the guy and just get clipped by the car, you'll still likely be paying for the incident for the rest of your life - and I don't mean court costs (see lesson 4).
Getting out of the way seems to be the way to go, but I would argue you could be justified in shooting someone driving at you. I remember quite a few cops videos where the officer shoots at the driver of a fleeing car, sometimes when the officer is only walking up to the side of a car and IMO in no direct danger :-\
Such an important lesson. There are so many life changing events, and maybe it's just my pessimistic nature, but there are probably more negative than positive. You know, sneezing hard with 120 pounds of fertilizersacks stacked on your shoulders is a life changer, and a whole lot more realistic than being run over by a tweaker.
Lesson #6: Bad men who are out to kill you are a much smaller threat than just poor judgement and/or fate. Consider the fool who thought parasailing during the prelude to a hurricane was going to be more fun than playing with whatever else he was used to playing with. he'd have been better off if he was hit by a tweeker in a smart car, and it was completely avoidable.
I guess it all depends on where you live, what the laws are there, and what situation you find yourself at.
If there's a chance to move away from the car's trajectory, that's the first I'd do, but if I have to shoot I'd go for the driver first place. Wouldn't chance shots to wheels or engine.
We've had situations here where officers where charged by suspects driving vehicles, and either themselves or their partners shot the driver, mortally in some cases, and the shooting was declared justified. And we have strict use-of-force regulations on everything, especially firearms, so I don't see why it should be any worse in America, with better self-defense laws.
If there's a chance to move away from the car's trajectory, that's the first I'd do, but if I have to shoot I'd go for the driver first place. Wouldn't chance shots to wheels or engine.
We've had situations here where officers where charged by suspects driving vehicles, and either themselves or their partners shot the driver, mortally in some cases, and the shooting was declared justified. And we have strict use-of-force regulations on everything, especially firearms, so I don't see why it should be any worse in America, with better self-defense laws.
If you read my post, the chief of police in a neighboring town was fired because he fired a .40 S&W through the windshied of an oncoming car as he stood in the path, after a long high speed chase. The car was spraying water and on it's last legs, so the chase was ending anyway, and that was the reason for disciplinary action.
The other example was a deputy sherrif who fired through the back window after a guy tried to pin him to a guard rail, I can't recall if he was prosecuted, but I believe he was fired.
Here, in america, you can't engage in any tactics that seem out of the ordinary without serious risk to career or possible imprisonment.
it's not a good situation being a cop here, as your actions are sometimes scrutinized down to the minutest details, and you are held to strict standards of hindsight.
The other example was a deputy sherrif who fired through the back window after a guy tried to pin him to a guard rail, I can't recall if he was prosecuted, but I believe he was fired.
Here, in america, you can't engage in any tactics that seem out of the ordinary without serious risk to career or possible imprisonment.
it's not a good situation being a cop here, as your actions are sometimes scrutinized down to the minutest details, and you are held to strict standards of hindsight.
I dont know where all you live, I heard the last say "here in America" and everyone was fired. all LEO. Id have to say prob most of that is BS. They could have gotton rid of some not because of that but just because city council, mayor or some sort wanted them out. I can also name about 4-5 shootings in Texas in the county I live. all LEO shot through windows. One shot the man 9 times in the neck and none got reprimanded. Maybe its just where we all live is different. But to say all would be fired, thats just no so. And even if it was between my life and a car. Id make the car look like Bonnie and Clydes!!
That almost sounds like you're calling me a liar. The events are true. your departments obviously work differently.
Keep in mind that a cop in florida shot a guy on a motorcycle that was bearing down on him, and that resulted in riots and burning.
People do not see a motor vehicle as a lethal weapon, and shooting a driver is not always acceptable to the people who have the power to stand in judgement with the ability of hindsight, and the power to discipline.
The chief of police was fired because of his judgement. He used a gun when it was obvious that the chase was already over, and by surviving, he proved conclusively that dodging the car worked. it was an unnecessary use of a weapon.
Keep in mind that a cop in florida shot a guy on a motorcycle that was bearing down on him, and that resulted in riots and burning.
People do not see a motor vehicle as a lethal weapon, and shooting a driver is not always acceptable to the people who have the power to stand in judgement with the ability of hindsight, and the power to discipline.
The chief of police was fired because of his judgement. He used a gun when it was obvious that the chase was already over, and by surviving, he proved conclusively that dodging the car worked. it was an unnecessary use of a weapon.
secret_agent_man
Moderator
The Texas DPS virtually pioneered duty use of the 357 SIG. One of the main considerations was windshield penetration. The Harris County Sheriff's Office (Houston) is also notorious for windshield shots.
That does not equate legally to a hypothesis that use of the gun was unnecessary. It simply proves that dodging the car was a viable strategy. The cop was where he had a legal right to be, doing what he had a legal right to do. All that is necessary to justify the shoot is the injected presence of the threat of death or great bodily harm, providing the cop had no duty to retreat under the applicable state legal code. The hell with a departmental code some desk jockey wrote, which may have cost a cop his job but did not result in charges.
Every once and a while, a good one-liner comes along on these pages.
I would take a defensive stance right in front of the car and give the driver "the look", as the car approached I would run towards it, throw my purse up in the air, step onto the bumper and execute a twisting front flip with a turn... at the same time i would pull my .45 Storm and shoot through the windshield and top of the car (hitting the driver of course) I'd safely land behind the car (as it was passing under me as I flipped, duh...) re-holster my gun, catch my purse as it came back down, flip my hair out of my face and say something catchy then turn and walk away... (as the car blows up behind me...) LOL
*cue the music...
Well, either that or just move out of the way, I mean it really depends how far the car is... run inside a building or store...something like that.. LOL
*cue the music...
Well, either that or just move out of the way, I mean it really depends how far the car is... run inside a building or store...something like that.. LOL
I see Angelina Jolie playing your role in the movie...
briandg,
You're right. I didn't read your previous post since I was just answering to the OP.
I haven't been to the US yet (I'm eager to, though), but I've shared a few years of my life working alongside Americans, both military or law enforcement personnel. This doesn't make me an expert, but we had time to share a few beers and compare how we do things, what we can and cannot do, etc, at either side of the pond. This said, if here, that we have -you bet- worse use of force regulations than you do, Judges, Police Supervisors and Prosecutors understand that a vehicle can be a lethal weapon, it's just hard for me to believe it's the other way around in the US. And at the end, it's that what matters, not the public's perception, which might be well far away from being right. As long as the tool used against you is likely to cause death or severe injury, the use of lethal force is justified.
The cases we had here involved officers who where down on the floor or in danger of being pinned between the car and a hard object, and if that's not a life threatening situation, please let me know what it is
.
You're right. I didn't read your previous post since I was just answering to the OP.
I haven't been to the US yet (I'm eager to, though), but I've shared a few years of my life working alongside Americans, both military or law enforcement personnel. This doesn't make me an expert, but we had time to share a few beers and compare how we do things, what we can and cannot do, etc, at either side of the pond. This said, if here, that we have -you bet- worse use of force regulations than you do, Judges, Police Supervisors and Prosecutors understand that a vehicle can be a lethal weapon, it's just hard for me to believe it's the other way around in the US. And at the end, it's that what matters, not the public's perception, which might be well far away from being right. As long as the tool used against you is likely to cause death or severe injury, the use of lethal force is justified.
The cases we had here involved officers who where down on the floor or in danger of being pinned between the car and a hard object, and if that's not a life threatening situation, please let me know what it is
.Let Police shoot at cars
It seems that cops have their fair share of situations involving a car chase, ending in an attempted arrest but the driver attempts to flee, using his car as a weapon, at which point, cops open fire.
As a CCW, we shouldn't be attempting citizens' arrests nor chasing vehicles. I can see a bar fight or argument, spilling out into the street or parking lot where somebody manages to get into his car and possibly run down his antagonist.
I'd be thinking of avoiding the vehicle rather than shooting at it--an act that probably won't stop the vehicle and puts innocent bystanders in real danger.
It seems that cops have their fair share of situations involving a car chase, ending in an attempted arrest but the driver attempts to flee, using his car as a weapon, at which point, cops open fire.
As a CCW, we shouldn't be attempting citizens' arrests nor chasing vehicles. I can see a bar fight or argument, spilling out into the street or parking lot where somebody manages to get into his car and possibly run down his antagonist.
I'd be thinking of avoiding the vehicle rather than shooting at it--an act that probably won't stop the vehicle and puts innocent bystanders in real danger.
Stressfire
New member
Maximus856
New member
I've had a car come at me once, but fortunately he turned out of the way and my buddy and I jumped towards the guard rail. It was a somewhat understandable situation, but a sad one as it how's just how bad things are today.
Two of my buddies in my platoon and I were driving on i95 and we saw a guy pulled over with his flashers on. We pulled over to see if he needed help and as soon as he saw us as I was about to walk back to him, he threw his car in reverse and floored it. He then put it in drive and came hauling butt towards us. Right as we jumped out of the way he turned the opposite way. To be honest, I don't know if I would of had the time to draw, but even more importantly is that I don't know if the situation would of called for it. I guess the guy thought we were highway pirates, but either way best bet is just get out of the way. If armed maybe be ready, but the car won't stop just because the possible BG is dead.
Just my $0.02.
Max
Two of my buddies in my platoon and I were driving on i95 and we saw a guy pulled over with his flashers on. We pulled over to see if he needed help and as soon as he saw us as I was about to walk back to him, he threw his car in reverse and floored it. He then put it in drive and came hauling butt towards us. Right as we jumped out of the way he turned the opposite way. To be honest, I don't know if I would of had the time to draw, but even more importantly is that I don't know if the situation would of called for it. I guess the guy thought we were highway pirates, but either way best bet is just get out of the way. If armed maybe be ready, but the car won't stop just because the possible BG is dead.
Just my $0.02.
Max
I'm in a wheelchair. I will be shooting through the grill/hood in the hope of hitting a control module/computer or some other vital component that will result in a "quick kill." Being a car guy I have an Idea of where these live and where the metal is the thinnest so I can make an educated guess as to where to place my shots but it WILL depend on a high degree of luck to pull off.
Your best bet will be firing downward through the hood along the fender-wells starting on the Drivers side. Shooting straight into the grill is a great way to waste lead. It MAY result in a dead car but that is most likely going to be after a considerable amount of time due to cooling fluid loss/over heating.
Your best bet will be firing downward through the hood along the fender-wells starting on the Drivers side. Shooting straight into the grill is a great way to waste lead. It MAY result in a dead car but that is most likely going to be after a considerable amount of time due to cooling fluid loss/over heating.