Shooting animals for the sake of shooting them?
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chris in va
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I live in Virginia. The next county over has a bounty of $50 for any coyotes shot.
Problem is, to my knowledge VA really never had an extensive predator list. Bears, sure but they don't usually take down coyotes, and I'm not aware of any cougars in the area. That makes them top on the food chain, except for...you guessed it...humans.
So if hunters don't take them down, nothing else will except for old age and injury/disease. Last year I was coming home from the grocery store to see one run across a 4 lane road into my subdivision. Looked like a bushy tailed German Shepherd.
Problem is, to my knowledge VA really never had an extensive predator list. Bears, sure but they don't usually take down coyotes, and I'm not aware of any cougars in the area. That makes them top on the food chain, except for...you guessed it...humans.
So if hunters don't take them down, nothing else will except for old age and injury/disease. Last year I was coming home from the grocery store to see one run across a 4 lane road into my subdivision. Looked like a bushy tailed German Shepherd.
Sigma 40 Blaster
New member
I think some people need to get off of their judgmental soap boxes, I bet that guy lives in the city. I had to drive 30 minutes to kill a coyote that had my mother in law trapped in her car like Cujo, not to mention they lose a few cattle a month due to these worthless animals. Any of them aggressive enough to approach me while I'm down there go down, I figure if they're smart enough to run they are good for their gene pool...don't really care what anyone has to say about that.
I do hunt hogs, deer, and squirrel (don't eat the tree rats but my brother in law does). I do it for several reasons, the challenge of the hunt being the primary reason...I'm not a treestand kind of guy, I actually get out in the woods, walk, hide, and sometimes chase on foot.
I'll go further and say I have no heads mounted on my wall and wouldn't go to an exotic place just to kill an exotic animal...I enjoy it, spending time with my family members who go out there with me, and enjoy the meat that usually results.
Maybe I'm just not as enlightened as the might protector of varmints but I have to worry about protecting my family (and our property) first. Killing humans and livestock is in a different category than stealing TV's or eating garbage...
I do hunt hogs, deer, and squirrel (don't eat the tree rats but my brother in law does). I do it for several reasons, the challenge of the hunt being the primary reason...I'm not a treestand kind of guy, I actually get out in the woods, walk, hide, and sometimes chase on foot.
I'll go further and say I have no heads mounted on my wall and wouldn't go to an exotic place just to kill an exotic animal...I enjoy it, spending time with my family members who go out there with me, and enjoy the meat that usually results.
Maybe I'm just not as enlightened as the might protector of varmints but I have to worry about protecting my family (and our property) first. Killing humans and livestock is in a different category than stealing TV's or eating garbage...
TexasSeaRay
New member
Sigma, you bring up a good point about the gene pool.
Coyotes are a testament to Darwin's theory. The truly superior examples of the species will, in all likelihood, never be seen nor shot by any human.
Why? They're smart enough and evolved enough to know that contact with or near humans is not good. They've perfected their hunting techniques, established territory, and become dominant in their "turf," thus driving the lesser examples into range of humans where they can then be disposed of.
Jeff
Coyotes are a testament to Darwin's theory. The truly superior examples of the species will, in all likelihood, never be seen nor shot by any human.
Why? They're smart enough and evolved enough to know that contact with or near humans is not good. They've perfected their hunting techniques, established territory, and become dominant in their "turf," thus driving the lesser examples into range of humans where they can then be disposed of.
Jeff
Thanks to Thunderhawk88 down in So.Cal for pointing out they're a nusiance animal even in liberal California.
Of course if you shoot one, expect some authority to show up because of a call about a man shooting at dogs.
Up here in Northern California, it's pretty rare to see them around the bay area. But get into the hills or get out towards the central valley and you can find them... occasionally.
Here in CA, some of the urban sprawl (into the wilder areas) comes in the form of gated or "premier" communities (another way of saying a small house for a high price). Folks moved into one of these near San Diego and inside of 2 years had a problem with Coyotes. After 4 of 'em took down a pair of adult Weimaraners someone pleaded with the state to "do something". That turned out to be letting hunters shoot them just east of the community. But one resident was the treasurer for a local PETA chapter and organized a protest action "to prevent the reckless slaughter of Canis latrans". The irony is that while out protesting, a coyote killed her Yorkshire Terrier (Canis Rattus). Despite this, she still tried to stop the killing of Coyotes.
Which just goes to prove that 'Yotes are smarter than some Californians.
Taxidermist
New member
I'm from the sticks in northern New York and I enjoy hunting coyotes. Being a taxidermist I do use the hides. I sell them to city slickers. LOL. I can say there seem to be very few people left in this area who hunt any furbearers. I don't see hunting coyotes as hurting their population at all except it removes the dumb ones from the pack. It is getting harder every year to call them. You need to change calls it seems every year because they are smart and catch on quick. Besides that I enjoy hunting them and not ashamed to admit that.
John
John
SteelJM1
Sorry Steel JM1 your attitude was showing in your first post.
Your lack of knowledge and experience showed in most of your posts.
Not attacking you. Just stating my opinoin from reading the thread.
No hard feelings, you did not know what you were talking about and had an attitude about what you did not know. You know know a LITTLE bit more and seem to have changed you attitude a LITTLE bit .
NukemJim
PS SteelJM1 Please note my top signature line.
Sorry Steel JM1 your attitude was showing in your first post.
Your lack of knowledge and experience showed in most of your posts.
Not attacking you. Just stating my opinoin from reading the thread.
No hard feelings, you did not know what you were talking about and had an attitude about what you did not know. You know know a LITTLE bit more and seem to have changed you attitude a LITTLE bit .
NukemJim
PS SteelJM1 Please note my top signature line.
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I don't hunt anymore. Not because I didn't enjoy it but because I can't get around in the hills and brush anymore. But this morning I killed an animal just because I was tired of listening to it.
I live in a house that was built in 1913. It has two floors, a basement and an attic. In the front yard is a walnut tree that draws squirrels from four states away. This fall, after the nuts were pretty well gone, one of those little tree-rats took up residence in my attic. I could hear the little beggar rustling around over my head as I tried to sleep. From time to time he'd drop something and I could hear it rolling around. Other times he'd just push the insulation into comfy little piles so he could rest on or in them.
This morning I pushed a step-ladder up under the trapdoor to the attic and ventured up into the dark. Now, as I've gotten older and less fit I've also gotten bigger so the trapdoor was a bit of a challenge just to get my shoulders through but I finally twisted and contorted until I could get both arms and my upper body through the hole. I scanned the smooth surface of fluffy insulation with my Maglite until I saw the damned squirrel sitting on a joist, eating one of my walnuts and otherwise ignoring me.
Since this had been just a recon trip I wasn't armed so I pulled myself back down through the trapdoor and retreived my daughter's 10/22, loaded it with Aguila Super Colibre and climbed back up there. The audacious little pest was still sitting right where I had seen him before so I laid my flashlight down to give me enough light, took careful aim and ....
My daughter, standing at the foot of the ladder asked me what went wrong since she's heard the hammer fall but didn't hear a muzzle report. I carefully handed the rifle down to her, then my cell-phone (it had fallen out of my pocket) and finally the bushy-tailed corpse.
So yeah, once in awhile I kill something I don't intend to eat but I still have a good reason.
I live in a house that was built in 1913. It has two floors, a basement and an attic. In the front yard is a walnut tree that draws squirrels from four states away. This fall, after the nuts were pretty well gone, one of those little tree-rats took up residence in my attic. I could hear the little beggar rustling around over my head as I tried to sleep. From time to time he'd drop something and I could hear it rolling around. Other times he'd just push the insulation into comfy little piles so he could rest on or in them.
This morning I pushed a step-ladder up under the trapdoor to the attic and ventured up into the dark. Now, as I've gotten older and less fit I've also gotten bigger so the trapdoor was a bit of a challenge just to get my shoulders through but I finally twisted and contorted until I could get both arms and my upper body through the hole. I scanned the smooth surface of fluffy insulation with my Maglite until I saw the damned squirrel sitting on a joist, eating one of my walnuts and otherwise ignoring me.
Since this had been just a recon trip I wasn't armed so I pulled myself back down through the trapdoor and retreived my daughter's 10/22, loaded it with Aguila Super Colibre and climbed back up there. The audacious little pest was still sitting right where I had seen him before so I laid my flashlight down to give me enough light, took careful aim and ....
My daughter, standing at the foot of the ladder asked me what went wrong since she's heard the hammer fall but didn't hear a muzzle report. I carefully handed the rifle down to her, then my cell-phone (it had fallen out of my pocket) and finally the bushy-tailed corpse.
So yeah, once in awhile I kill something I don't intend to eat but I still have a good reason.
grymster2007
New member
Seems most here shoot animals for a reason. Put meat on the table, sell the furs, eliminate a threat or nuisance. I don’t recall reading a post from anyone “Shooting animals for the sake of shooting them”… think that’s a good thing.
BTW:
In the hills between Napa and Fairfield I’m seeing coyotes a bit more than “occasionally”. And some of them within 2 miles of Hwy 80.
BTW:
In the hills between Napa and Fairfield I’m seeing coyotes a bit more than “occasionally”. And some of them within 2 miles of Hwy 80.
We shoot coyotes once their fur is prime. And we trap them at that time..They don't casue major trouble so we wait until we can do something other that shoot them and leave them.
But we HAVE had troubles. A few years ago the snow got fairly deep and they started packing up. KIlled a couple newborn calves. So we started shooting them pretty hard after that.
I personally hate people who shoot a coyote just to kill something...The urge "To just kill something" isn't proper in most places.
But coyotes need to be controlled. It doesn't happen naturally (At least around here in Montana).
They CAN be dangerous. My uncle had one that although it didn't attack him...certainly wasn't afraid and was prowling around his house. Got a cat before he could shoot it....Now it probably wouldn't have happened, but...His 3 year old girl sometimes wanders round the house..Who knows..Play it safe than sorry.
But in ending..Anyone who kills anthing JUST for the fun of killing something....they almost should have their firearms taken from them....Pest control is differant..Such as me and dads shooting of over 15,000 rounds of .22LR ammo last year at gophers. (Down from 18,000 the year before
)
But we HAVE had troubles. A few years ago the snow got fairly deep and they started packing up. KIlled a couple newborn calves. So we started shooting them pretty hard after that.
I personally hate people who shoot a coyote just to kill something...The urge "To just kill something" isn't proper in most places.
But coyotes need to be controlled. It doesn't happen naturally (At least around here in Montana).
They CAN be dangerous. My uncle had one that although it didn't attack him...certainly wasn't afraid and was prowling around his house. Got a cat before he could shoot it....Now it probably wouldn't have happened, but...His 3 year old girl sometimes wanders round the house..Who knows..Play it safe than sorry.
But in ending..Anyone who kills anthing JUST for the fun of killing something....they almost should have their firearms taken from them....Pest control is differant..Such as me and dads shooting of over 15,000 rounds of .22LR ammo last year at gophers. (Down from 18,000 the year before
)MeekAndMild
New member
I don't know about the rest of the world but last month dogs/coyotes/foxes carried off a dozen of Mrs. Meek's chickens and three of her guineas. I have a blood feud with the wild Canis tribe but that doesn't mean I have any criticism against trophy hunters who kill them without other reason except that they need killing.
Right and wrong are purely human inventions; in the great wheel of existence each creature lives out its life in accordance with its own karmic destiny. While the man who finds pleasure in killing these animals might suffer for it in the next life I suspect that his fellow who lets one live out of misplaced kindness will suffer an equally bad fate (perhaps watching his own child die of rabies?) Likewise the man who hates his fellow man for reasons mentioned by previous posters is no better and indeed may be worse than the one one he hates.
Right and wrong are purely human inventions; in the great wheel of existence each creature lives out its life in accordance with its own karmic destiny. While the man who finds pleasure in killing these animals might suffer for it in the next life I suspect that his fellow who lets one live out of misplaced kindness will suffer an equally bad fate (perhaps watching his own child die of rabies?) Likewise the man who hates his fellow man for reasons mentioned by previous posters is no better and indeed may be worse than the one one he hates.
I Don't shoot just to shoot them and kill. I shoot to eat, I shoot to protect and I shoot to Defend mine and my own.
One day I came home at about 6:00 AM and found about 30-40 of my 70-80 chickens in a blood bath! The front of my 5 acres looked like a seen from WWII!
I was keeping some 80 chickens free range during the day and cooped at night! I had problems with coyotes once in a while,, They take one or two and carry there dinner away. Wild dogs just kill to have fun and do the game. That day, I visited all of my nabors and told them keep your dogs home. I lost a pile of chickens and will correct it tonight. Of course they all said My Dog would not have done that!!!!!! Hoisted the latter, got on the roof 10/22 and sleeping bag in hand and slept there over the night. At about sun up here comes a dog. Two dogs, five dogs, 7 dogs, 12 dogs..........
I was amazed. Where to hell did they come from? After a few minutes when there number had raised, they started tearing up the coop!
I killed 9 dogs that morning! Did I like it, NO! Did it stop the problems, YES! Was the nabors pissed at me, YES!
One day I came home at about 6:00 AM and found about 30-40 of my 70-80 chickens in a blood bath! The front of my 5 acres looked like a seen from WWII!
I was keeping some 80 chickens free range during the day and cooped at night! I had problems with coyotes once in a while,, They take one or two and carry there dinner away. Wild dogs just kill to have fun and do the game. That day, I visited all of my nabors and told them keep your dogs home. I lost a pile of chickens and will correct it tonight. Of course they all said My Dog would not have done that!!!!!! Hoisted the latter, got on the roof 10/22 and sleeping bag in hand and slept there over the night. At about sun up here comes a dog. Two dogs, five dogs, 7 dogs, 12 dogs..........
I was amazed. Where to hell did they come from? After a few minutes when there number had raised, they started tearing up the coop!
I killed 9 dogs that morning! Did I like it, NO! Did it stop the problems, YES! Was the nabors pissed at me, YES!
Steel,
If you don’t like coyote hunters that do it for the sport, then you must have a real problem with crow and prairie dog hunters.
I live in NH and I can tell you right now that hunting coyote is not like shooting fish in a barrel. They’re very smart animals and can be difficult to hunt in the northeast. I hunt them for sport and don’t feel I need to justify it. The state says I can, so I do. That’s good enough for me.
If you don’t like coyote hunters that do it for the sport, then you must have a real problem with crow and prairie dog hunters.
I live in NH and I can tell you right now that hunting coyote is not like shooting fish in a barrel. They’re very smart animals and can be difficult to hunt in the northeast. I hunt them for sport and don’t feel I need to justify it. The state says I can, so I do. That’s good enough for me.
The Tourist
Moderator
I have no problem with varmint shooting, as implemented as the name implies.
That being the removal of pests.
There are plenty of places in both North and South Dakota where ranchers want prairie dogs controlled.
And before you rant and rave about "big money" or "big cattle," you should also know that many of these areas are also envirinmentally sensitive to the plight of the black-footed ferret.
During the early 1990's, they even published the telephone numbers of ranchers who wanted eastern varmint shooters.
I believe this a very important and distinct difference in the 1880's sport of slaughtering hundreds of buffalo from the back of a train for target practice.
That being the removal of pests.
There are plenty of places in both North and South Dakota where ranchers want prairie dogs controlled.
And before you rant and rave about "big money" or "big cattle," you should also know that many of these areas are also envirinmentally sensitive to the plight of the black-footed ferret.
During the early 1990's, they even published the telephone numbers of ranchers who wanted eastern varmint shooters.
I believe this a very important and distinct difference in the 1880's sport of slaughtering hundreds of buffalo from the back of a train for target practice.
RockyMtnTactical
New member
According to profilers, 3 defining characteristics of a serial killer are that they exhibit 1) cruelty to animals 2) have a fascination with starting fires and 3) they wet the bed (60% of serial killers wet the bed past the age of 12).
Killing varmints, rodents, and other pests is not what I would consider "cruelty". Now, if you are torturing them before you kill them... well...
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MD_Willington
New member
We have livestock around here, the coyotes, if left to do as they please, will take the livestock... We do not appreciate the coyote taking the livestock
MeekAndMild
New member
homefires, sometimes I wonder at the irresponsibility of people who allow dogs to run free in the country. I also wonder if your local county ordinances might allow you to sue your neighbors for dog-related damages. I'm not a lawyer and not recommending frivolous lawsuits but allowing a dog to roam free where there are people who keep livestock sounds pretty negligent to me.
In my opinion once a dog gets into the frenzy of livestock killing there is only a small step from killing chickens and cats to killing small children. So my personal response is to remove the threat. But thats just me.
Also, no criticism if the .22 works for you, but I think that a shotgun works better.
In my opinion once a dog gets into the frenzy of livestock killing there is only a small step from killing chickens and cats to killing small children. So my personal response is to remove the threat. But thats just me.
Also, no criticism if the .22 works for you, but I think that a shotgun works better.
Mannlicher
New member
SteelJM1
I kill coy dogs because they are hurting the deer population on the farms I hunt. Coyotes are a huge problem around her, killing not only deer, but game birds, rabbits and squirrels.
Besides, its fun to watch them jump high in the air when I hit one with the .243
I kill coy dogs because they are hurting the deer population on the farms I hunt. Coyotes are a huge problem around her, killing not only deer, but game birds, rabbits and squirrels.
Besides, its fun to watch them jump high in the air when I hit one with the .243
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