shooting a double action as a single action

...when Brian Zinns, the great bullseye shooter, chose a gun recently,
he chose the gun with a better trigger over the more inherently
accurate gun.
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I think that, as stated, conveys an 'inaccurate' impression. ;)
He chose the weapon that -- as a man-machine system -- would deliver better accuracy.
The weapon's inherent accuracy was good enough that when combined with a precise triggering mechanism for the man, it became the best overall.



One of my several AR platforms over the years was chosen that very way. Armalite's factory trigger won me hands-down for the carbine.
 
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I think its easier to find fault with the gun, than it is to accept that we might be the issue. Human nature I guess.

Its not so much about adapting to the gun, as it is about improving "you". Once you improve you, the little things you once thought were a big deal, are now basically insignificant, if you think about them at all.

Im just glad I learned my lesson early on, and didnt waste a lot of money on needless gunsmith bills.

I wasted it on more ammo and components.
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That's nice for you, rhetoric maybe, but if I don't bond with a gun, especially its accuracy and trigger, I get it worked on or I sell it. I have other nice choices. You cannot dispute that some guns are naturals, and those are the ones we'll shoot or seek out.
 
You must have lost your moral fiber. I like shooting both ways, DA is more fun. Try shooting 6 straight with no stops then tell me which is more fun. My GP100 and Trooper love it as much as I do. But I will give the GP a trigger job.
 
That's nice for you, rhetoric maybe, but if I don't bond with a gun, especially its accuracy and trigger, I get it worked on or I sell it. I have other nice choices. You cannot dispute that some guns are naturals, and those are the ones we'll shoot or seek out.
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Perhaps its just one of those "see the light" things. :)

I shoot a lot of different type guns, and once you put a little time in with any of them, they all pretty much feel natural to shoot with. The only exception for me, is the current trend with some long guns, to have overly long stocks and higher combs, that make quick shouldering unnatural and a distraction.

They way I see it with improving "you", instead of the gun is, the more you improve you, the more you can deal with pretty much anything you pick up. If you only improve the gun, then thats what youre stuck with. What happens when you dont have your favorite "tuned piece", and are forced to use something else?
 
AK103K said:
They way I see it with improving "you", instead of the gun is, the more you improve you, the more you can deal with pretty much anything you pick up. If you only improve the gun, then thats what youre stuck with. What happens when you dont have your favorite "tuned piece", and are forced to use something else?
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I understand your point, and agree, but not entirely:

First, shootin's shootin', and if you're a good shooter, you're a good shooter. Good shooters aren't rendered impotent without their "gamer" gear. That they are is a popular misconception, and/or a rationalization.

Second, having a good accurate gun with a smooth trigger and good sights is the quicker way to that goodness. Matter of fact, you may be more likely to have issues with other guns if you got "good" with a crappy gun, since you've likely developed compensating bad habits.
 
I used to shoot mostly SA on my DA guns, but a while back I dedicated myself to learning DA shooting, especially since I got my S&W 642... I haven't a choice, it's DA only. I now greatly enjoy shooting DA and am now just as accurate as shooting SA with my guns.

Now, if I'm shooting one of my cap n' balls, it's single action because I don't own a Starr!!! :D
 
Longtime DA revolver guy here.......most,if not all,advice concerning the finger's "stroke" in DA mode will see you "pulling through".And won't argue that.....but,if you learn to "stage" a DA trigger,and practice,it can rival SA in accuracy.

I really don't like the long "locktime" in SA......yes,it's manageable,but will stage DA "almost" everytime now when high precision or long shots require it.And will also say,that it(staging)made me a MUCH better pull though shooter.
 
I always thought locktime to be,in miliseconds.....from the moment the trigger broke to ignition?So,it's irrespective of how hard the SA pull weight is?

And for the record,we have several guns with $$ professional action "jobs".
 
The DA revolver was invented for a reason
As a combat weapon it was quicker to use that having to cock the trigger for each shot

My basic SD gun is a 65-5 3"
I had the hammer bobbed and converted to DAO
In SD mode you are going DA
In fact I am thinking of training to shoot one handed and stop the 2 handed method and quit the bad habit of staging
We are talking SD not target shooting
 
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I always thought locktime to be,in miliseconds.....from the moment the trigger broke to ignition?
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Got it! That suggests that disliking perceptible locktime challenges those who say that steady pull through double action is more accurate and that staging, not 100% sure when the gun will fire, is a bad habit. If one has the skills to maintain sight picture throughout a DA squeeze, and to follow through, might he favor a gun that facilitates that?
 
Real Gun(is that in reference to revo vs semi-auto,haha)........

I'm generally the odd guy,in that...I really do prefer a tuned Colt DA to a Smith.And we..."gots lots of each".Will even say that given proper loads,almost prefer fixed sights to adj.But WRT "staging" and it's merits...it,like individuals,boils down to that weapon...and that guy...on that day.

One of my favorite wheelguns is an old Python......bluing worn off,round count in the tens of thousands.Given most circumstances,I'll stage the trigger....and put small game in the pot.It's a squirrel and rabbit machine.Another Colt is a .22 Trooper.......it's got a cpl "hitches" in it's DA(too lazy to open her up,haha)....and will shoot it by staging as well,everytime.

Cpl Smith's of note......an old model 629 with a pro action tune that is the best of both worlds.The single action breaks at 3 1/2 pds and will shoot braggin groups.And DA,it's just as sweet,BUT....it definitely dosen't like staging.Another Smith that dosen't care to be staged is a K38.Everybody who shoots it(has been though by a "Smith guy"),loves it......I can shoot it way better SA than DA?

If I wanted to really buckle down on SA would use one of my Rugers......It's all good,best of luck,shop.
 
small bone, pick, etc.

With practice, one can shoot just as fast and more accurately SA as DA with an un-modified, out of the box double action revolver
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This is utterly and patently untrue, and can be proven consistently and repeatedly.



'Specially if you need a reload, ay?
 
"actually it depends on the person. and their physical abilities"

It's one thing when people state, " I can shoot a double action revolver, just as fast and accurately, shooting single action, (cocking the hammer for each shot and pulling the trigger) as someone shooting it double action. Someone will think this when they are playing around at the range.

But, when you actually put it to the test in competition, timing the shooter and scoring targets, you find that the good shooters are all shooting double action. None are shooting single action, with double action revolvers, even for occasional more difficult shots. USPSA and ICORE are both action handgun sports. You have to find a balance of speed and accuracy. The balance is tipped a little more towards speed in USPSA and more towards accuracy in ICORE. But you still have to be fast and accurate in both. Mark
 
What we have today is a nearly complete reversal of the attitudes of 100 years ago. Back then, the overwhelming majority of handgun users considered the DA revolver to be shot SA (for accuracy), and DA for emergency use only (point blank defensive shooting).

Back in the 20s Ed McGivern began to open people's eyes to what could be done with a DA revolver, shooting it DA. Others followed, and today we have people who will tell you the only way to shoot a DA gun is DA. Some will even go so far as to hint you will be killed if you do otherwise...(yes, I have actually heard that).

I'm in the camp where 99% of my DA revolver shooting is done SA. I'm not a gunfighter type, and have no plans to be one, or train like one. I'm fine with the "risk" I'm taking. I have no doubt in my ability to DA shoot and hit at belly to belly distance, and I have done DA work at slightly longer ranges. I just don't make it my main focus.

If you do, fine. I can tell you that you WILL NOT HARM any DA revolver in proper mechanical condition by shooting it SA.

While it is fiction, I would recommend the movie Unforgiven as a good cinematic treatment of the differences between the stories about gunfights and the reality of the same gunfights. Particularly the scene where Gene Hackman tells about how the "fastest gun" in the fight might have won (and lived) if he had been a little slower...

I'm a shoot however you please, and if you are accurate, that's what matters most guy about most shooting. I fully recognize the importance of, and what an advantage being a good combat shot can be. They aren't wrong, but there is a more to handgunning than just combat shooting.
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I'm the same way. I have a Detective Special and a Cobra that I shoot in SA mode the vast majority of the time. I can hit a torso at 15 yards DA but can hit a head sized target at 25 yards shooting SA.
 
I've put a good many rounds through my SP101 4.2". When I shoot it's about 70% DA and 30% SA. The only reason I shoot more DA, is that I'm good enough with the gun in SA that that it's pretty obvious where the practice is needed. I'm definitely an order of magnitude better with my SP101 in SA

If accuracy is important in SD (and it is), I hope I would seek whatever advantage I can if I'm unlucky enough to find myself in a situation.
 
I just received a Redhawk with a custom spring and slick trigger job, making me think that ones facility with DA has a context. Tricked out guns can be a totally different matter than those with off the shelf setups.
 
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