Second chance for Remington, or a Mossberg?

Problem with the Wingmaster is that it would take a good amount of extra money to get to the specifications I'm looking for (shorter barrel, full length magazine tube, etc...) and I'd rather not have to start swapping parts right out of the box after paying for the whole package.
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Just down the road is a pawn shop with a rack full of Remington870's, both Wingmaster and Express. I can have my pick of the litter for about $200.00. That's where I'd start if I were looking for a shotgun to customize.

However, if I were looking for an out of the box, ready to run HD shotgun, I'd probably go with the Winchester 1300 Defender. It's one of the sleepers in the shotgun world. I see that they're easily available on places like Gunbroker.
 
I have 2 wingmasters but as far as a home defense gun goes I'd go for a new winchester SXP defender I have the SXP blackshadow with 28 in bbl and it is my favorite new pump. Best bang for your buck if you will. can be had for 400 or less NIB. Mine came with sling swivels and 3 chokes. The guns use the invector plus choke system. Great gun very very rugged.
 
PawPaw,

I love the 1300. It's a great shotgun and would actually be my first choice, but it's been discontinued forr a few years now and I can only find them used online which makes me a little bit uncomfortable because I can't look at their condition. Great guns, though. Super smooth action.
 
Winchester's SXP is where its at. It is the newest rendition of the 1300. Get one!

If not that, maybe go a little unconventional and check out Weatherby's shotguns? I bought an Upland PA-08 and I love it. I was between this and the Win SXP but went with the Weatherby for its simplicity of design. Now I am learning that I am having a real tough time trying to find a short barrel for the Weatherby where I thought I could get one easily. I want a single reciever, dual barrel setup and I thought I'd be able to get it via buying a second barrel for the Weatherby. Cheaperthandirt had Win SXP camp/field barrel combos for under $450 but they are out of stock right now
 
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I've got a Mossberg 590A1 20" barrel, 9 rounds, parkerized finish and ghost ring sights. It had the 4-round speedstock which I replaced with a Blackhawk Compstock. Its a very impressive shotgun and a blast to shoot. The ghost ring sight are entirely worth the money! Its extremely fast and easy to target and shoot. The Compstock allows me to shoot 200+ 3" mag rounds at the range if I want without any shoulder bruising or discomfort later and I'm not a big guy at 5' 8" 175lbs.

If its only purpose is for HP and occasional range shooting the 18.5" barrel would also be great. I got the 20" because I'll also be hunting with it. First time out I was hitting soda bottles easily at 100yards with 1oz slugger slugs. :D
 
If I wanted a home defense shotgun / and I don't - because I depend on my 1911's for personal defense...but if I did ....I'd look at a couple of different options ...over an 870 or the Mossberg offerings... neither of which would get my attention...:

a. in a pump gun ....Browning BPS all weather high capacity...list is $ 800 ...but I think the avg price is around $ 650.

http://www.browning.com/products/catalog/firearms/detail.asp?fid=011B&cid=012&tid=262&bg=x

But honestly, if I wanted a fighting gun ....I'd look at the Benelli M-4 ...as a much better option ...they're around $ 1,850 or so depending on how you want them equipped / but often in guns you get what you pay for - in my opinion. But its a solid gun / similar gun to the one used by the US Marines - good reputation among the Marines I've talked to in my son's unit.

http://www.benelliusa.com/shotguns/index.php?specs

Benelli offers their pump gun / the Nova in some tactical configurations ...and if you go that route, look at one that has the "comfort tech" recoil supression system in it. Firing slugs out of a fixed breech gun --- like a pump ---isn't that much fun ...which is why I'd go with the M4 as a semi-auto / much faster follow-up shots - much less recoil than a fixed breech gun.

There are a lot of others on this forum that can discuss "fighting shotgun tactics" with you - with way more authority than I pretend to have ...but any decent shotgun, if it will cycle the ammo you choose to use / you can take the "hunting plug" out of the mag ...and admittedly it might still have a 28" barrel on it ...but its still a 'defensive shotgun' - just maybe not an "optimal" fighting shotgun .../ but are you thinking about 'defense' - or a shootout at the Ok Corral ... / I don't think many civilians have much of a real need for a "fighting shotgun" ...not that you shouldn't buy whatever you want ...I'm just suggesting that you think thru where you're going with this purchase. In many police depts --- where they used to grab that defensive shotgun years ago ...I think a lot of them are thinking they have better options today .../ higher capacity handguns - freeing up their other hand, etc....

Based on what I read / classes I've taken on defensive shooting / tactical defense shooting ...its all about shot placement ...and the expectation is its really going to be over quickly ...like 5 sec's quickly .../ so a double tap out of a 1911 ...might be all I'll ever need ...and if necessary, I can fight my way to my gun safe...and my rifles and shotguns - and higher capacity handguns, etc.

But buy what you want ...at whatever budget you have ...and train with it often - and by that I mean at least twice a month or more !
 
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$1850 for a shotgun in my mind is way excessive. And needing a recoil absorbing stock seems pointless. I'm not trying to be a jerk, I just don't understand why. Even slugs don't kick that bad. I've shot them with a pistol grip. I've shot 3 inch #2 one handed out of my double barrel, isn't bad at all. Before I got a 12 gauge all I heard from people was how hard a 12 gauge kicked. Well, it's a myth in my book. I even have a 10 gauge single shot with 3 1/2 inch chambers, it still isn't even too bad. And since you need this gun for defense, you'll probably only shoot once or twice. Are you really gonna care how much recoil you feel when you are fighting for your life? Myself, I can't justify spending much money on a shot gun. As long as it works, it's all that matters. If I was gonna go all out and get an expensive shotgun, it'd be a Saiga 12 with wood AK furniture, 20 round mag, and an 18 inch barrel.
 
I use pistols for home defense. The shotgun will not be used for home defense. I just like the home defense style shotguns and feel like having one. But I actually don't believe shotguns are the be all end all for home protection. The main reason for this is that I like consistency. Since I'm primarily a handgun guy with very little experience with shotguns, I'm much more comfortable trusting my life to a pistol that I've had plenty of training with. This also stops me from having to take the extra time in a new weapon system so that my carry pistol can double as a home defense pistol and I won't have to worry about fine motor skills deteriorating as much as they would if I were using a weapon I train with less.

But that's not the point. I'm looking for a shotgun with a pump mostly for fun that is in a home defense type configuration because it's what I feel I'd have the most fun with at the range. My views are subject to change, but as of right now I just want a nice 18-20" barreled shotgun with good capacity for taking out and having fun. That's why it doesn't need to be expensive and my budget isn't much for it. I still want it to be reliable though. It's not fun being at the range slamming a shotgun on the ground to get the action unstuck.
 
I have one of those Rem 870 Police Shotguns but have not taken it to the range yet to run anything through it, that is why I made no comments on it.

All my other 870 Wingmasters run great.

My 1100's run great also.

My Saiga-12 is a blast to shoot, but I don't know if I would want a semi auto for home defense. Nice back-up weapon, but my primary is an 870 with my wife following me with a handgun (after calling 911).
 
my thoughts on the matter....

Ive put well over 5000 rounds though my stock 500 with out a single problem. Ive shot walmart value packs to high brass OO to slugs and sabots. Also various handloads of #2 and #4 shot. My 500 still looks new. I use my 18" barrel most of the time.

I have a buddy with an express that has simular use to it...also without a problem.

Though we both agree, we like the action lock and safety location on the mossberg for tactical/home defense use.

The win Pump Defender seems like another great option. Made in turkey. I saw one at gander mtn. The dude at the counter pointed it at the ceiling and hit the action release. The slide smoothly slid down on its own! I was impressed.
 
Right now, I'm really liking the looks of the Mossberg 500 Cruiser set up for breaching. Not the one with the chainsaw handle, but the pistol grip model with the standard hand guard but the front of the barrel has a sort of flash hider type front that's set up to protect the integrity of the barrel when shooting door hinges.

Yes, I said it, I like pistol grip shotguns. They seem like they'd store nicely, and I'm not particularly recoil shy and have been able to handle them well in the past.
 
I've owned a Mossberg 500A for 10+ years (bought it used), and my brother has owned a Remington 870 Express for 20+ years, we both used the 870 in high school, and he shoot on the high school skeet team with the gun.

I really can't recall a failure in either gun, I prefer the tang safety of the 500 over the 870 cross-bolt, but that's about it.

Did the OP ever think about sending the gun back to Remington? I believe you shouldn't have to, but everyone makes a mistake every now and then.

I wouldn't have moment's hesitation grabbing either gun for whatever I needed to do, maybe they just used to make them better?
 
The mossbergs pistol grip kinda gets in the way of the action release lever. Keep that in mind. It ironic that the 500 is known as being very tactical friendly but it has this one big design flaw IMO. This is why I went back to a standard shoulder type stock.

I then realized I shoot better with the shoulder stock. even at a mid position. I can tuck the stock up against my gut at a mid position and have more control.

Also, Sometimes in the summer the park across from my house gets littered with drunks after the bars close. There always seems to be some kind of drama. I like to keep my 500 out and unlocked on those nights. I like to leen it against the wall in the corner behind my nightstand. With the pistol grip the 18" barrel sits about 2" below the top of the stand. This makes finding it quickly in the dark potentialy challenging.
 
My rationale behind a semi-auto defensive shotgun .../ or even a pump gun with some recoil absorbtion, is I was assuming I thought you wanted it for a primary defense gun ...so I was assuming you'd probably put at least 50 shells a month thru it.

No the recoil on a pump gun isn't that bad ...but its more than I'd like with heavy slugs or "OO" thru it in any big quantity. It certainly depends on your budget...but to me, a shotgun costing $ 1,850 isn't that big a deal ...if its a gun that you'll enjoy having and shooting for the next 20 + yrs.../ but if
$1,850 takes the fun out of it ...you have other pump gun options.

As some of us have gotten a little older ... we understand recoil is cumulative / so it wears you out mentally as well as physically ....even if you're only going to put 50 shells a year thru it in a typical training day...but you were asking for options beyond the 870 and Mossberg...just trying to help ...

I'm big enough to handle the recoil at 6'5" and 275 lbs - though a little into my later yrs over 60 yrs old ....but if I were going to train with a tactical shotgun ....I'd probably do it in combination with my primary defensive handgun ...maybe 200 rds thru my handgun / and at least 25 - 50 thru the shotgun. Get my transition speed up ...going from the handgun - to the shotgun - and back and forth, mixing in some reloads, etc.../ and I'd probably do that at least once a month to stay sharp or more if the gun was new to me and I was getting comfortable with it.

But that's why....I'd go with the Benelli M-4 / to cut down on the stress to my body at 600 - 1,000 shells a year probably thru the shotgun. ( I put at least 10,000 shells a year thru my primary target shotguns ..../ but I don't shoot loads nearly that heavy every week ).
 
Don't get me wrong, I would absolutely love an M4. What a sweet shotgun it is! But I've been spending a lot of money lately already so my wife would kill me if I went that much over budget.
 
Personally I'd avoid 870's until this current extraction issue gets dealt with. I purchased my 870 express in late '09 and have had extraction issues with some cheap shells. When I was debating between the 500 and 870 the general consensus was that either was a good choice, and in the end I opted for the 870 simply because I thought I would like that safety location more. Today I would trade the safety location for a 100% reliable gun.
 
I recently bought a new 870P and have had it to the range with absolutely no problems. I haven't used a shotgun in more years than I care to admit and this one will serve me for the rest of my years. It is the basic model with wood furniture, Remington # 4901. The "Police Magnum" is certainly available to civilians without difficulty.
 
I like the Mossberg 500 platform. Easy to customize and inexpensive. If you have a little ability you can design it any way you want.

Mossberg5001.jpg

Knoxx recoil reduction stock

Mossberg500grip2.jpg

UAG red/green dot
 
Get a 500. I don't particularly like the new express. they are heavier than the mossberg and have a rough crappy finish on the barrel.
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