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scope or open sight for deer hunting
- Thread starter Xerovi
- Start date
Mongo_Bongo
New member
It all depends on you. For most of us of a certain age, iron sights are just not suitable.
A scope does everything better than iron sights. Close and far. The military doesn't even use irons anymore even for close combat. Just don't make the mistake of using a scope with too much magnification.
A variable with 1-3X on the low end is faster to get on target up close than iron sights. They are only a disadvantage when using too much magnification. Something with 4-6X on the upper end is enough magnification to hit big game farther than most people have the skills to shoot.
Most states allow shooting 30 minutes prior to sunrise until 30 minutes after sunset. Those 30 minute blocks are when most game animals are shot. Even at 10-15 yards you can't hit a deer if you can't see the sights. A scope makes shots during those times possible.
But, even with all of their advantages scopes just don't look right on traditional lever actions and traditional muzzle loaders so I think they have their place if nostalgia is important. And they can be very effective. In good light someone who knows how to shoot irons can be effective at surprisingly long range.
If you want to use your 7x57 and don't want to spend the money for a scope, then go for it. Just understand there are no advantages to using the irons, and some disadvantages.
A variable with 1-3X on the low end is faster to get on target up close than iron sights. They are only a disadvantage when using too much magnification. Something with 4-6X on the upper end is enough magnification to hit big game farther than most people have the skills to shoot.
Most states allow shooting 30 minutes prior to sunrise until 30 minutes after sunset. Those 30 minute blocks are when most game animals are shot. Even at 10-15 yards you can't hit a deer if you can't see the sights. A scope makes shots during those times possible.
But, even with all of their advantages scopes just don't look right on traditional lever actions and traditional muzzle loaders so I think they have their place if nostalgia is important. And they can be very effective. In good light someone who knows how to shoot irons can be effective at surprisingly long range.
If you want to use your 7x57 and don't want to spend the money for a scope, then go for it. Just understand there are no advantages to using the irons, and some disadvantages.
jmr40 said:The military doesn't even use irons anymore even for close combat.
This is not true, I retired from the Army in 2017 and BRM (Basic Rifle Marksmanship) is still done with sights. Did we have optics? Yes we did, we had ACOG scopes, Aim Point red dots, and a whole lot of different Night Vision optics. However, qualifying was always done with good old iron sights. We also did a lot of MOUT/CQB training without optics.
The majority of the time we went out to train all the optics were left in the arms room, in my unit we also didn't have enough optics to equip every rifle. So while the military has optics we didn't use them exclusively. From what my buddies who are still in say this hasn't changed.
mikejonestkd
New member
The military doesn't even use irons anymore even for close combat.
I am fortunate to work with the local college ROTC cadre and teach out of their Gym. The cadets and officers all qualify at my local conservation club annually with old M16A2 rifles, and all have iron sights.
Back on track with this thread, JMR40 summarizes it all up nicely. There is no advantage to iron sights over the correct power scope when hunting.
reynolds357
New member
Scopes seem to be much more popular than open sights for hunting. The average person can shoot a scope much more accurately than sights. Scopes offer a low light advantage as well.Do most people use a scope for deer hunting? I have a 7 mm rem mag with a scope but was thinking I might step down a notch and take my 7mm Mauser, but it does not have a scope. Thanks for advice.
A scope does everything better than iron sights.
If obscuring peripheral vision is desirable , and thus "better" ......um ....OK. Also, I doubt any scope is faster than a ghost ring- The added weight would make handling slower, I would think. ... It'd have to raining/snowing REALLY hard to obscure irons ...... I've had fog, rain and snow make scopes unusable until wiped clear ....... absolute statements are always disprovable. Every sighting system has features and drawbacks. TANSTAAFL.
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Depends where you hunt. If you can see deer from a distance a scope is a great accessory. If you are in a wooded area or high brush where a quick shot and short distance are very likely to happen iron sights are the way to go. If your sight is failing a little still, than a scope with a fixed power of of 1X or 3X is all you need. Pretty much a personal preference kind of thing.
Sure Shot Mc Gee
New member
If I'm Still Hunting the bush. I preference open barrel sights as I've shot game on a full out run more than once using the point and shoot method. Can't do that, having a optic tube cloaking the sight plane. Such quick shooting skills are acquired with practice and more practice never a born with gift.
As I see. More hunters go home skunked year after year who's rifles are equipped with only a scope as opposed to those whom choose less powerful sporting firearms equipped with open barrel sight and they too having more than one hunting tactic to increase the odds in their favor. (Such hunters using open barrel sights make things happen) as oppose to those using a scope perched in the air waiting hour after hour for a chance.
As I see. More hunters go home skunked year after year who's rifles are equipped with only a scope as opposed to those whom choose less powerful sporting firearms equipped with open barrel sight and they too having more than one hunting tactic to increase the odds in their favor. (Such hunters using open barrel sights make things happen) as oppose to those using a scope perched in the air waiting hour after hour for a chance.
If I'm Still Hunting the bush. I preference open barrel sights as I've shot game on a full out run more than once using the point and shoot method. Can't do that, having a optic tube cloaking the sight plane. Such quick shooting skills are acquired with practice and more practice never a born with gift.
Last November, I shot two deer jumped from a plum thicket .... both on a dead run, with a 3-9x32 scoped 24"barreled 10+ pound bolt action rifle .... in less time than it took for you to read this ..... skills with the equipment that you are intimately familiar with are what matter at crunch time .... the particulars of the equipment much less so .... I see so many people that jump from one gun to another, to another, all in a vain effort to gain some small advantage, when we all know that the biggest variable in the system is the shooter ...... run one gun until it using it becomes automatic ....like walking or breathing .....
bamaranger
New member
answers and questions
Yes, it is my observation, now for many years, that most folks use a scope for deer hunting. Quite honestly, I cannot recall seeing another hunter, at a check station, public land or private club, hunting with iron sights (on a cartridge rifle) of any kind, in a long, long time.......maybe 20-30 years or more.
Up to a decade or so ago, I occasionally hunted with a GI M1 Garand, or iron sighted (leaf and blade) Remington Model 14, just for kicks. My eyes are to the point now that any optic is a real boon, and I would have to have very ideal circumstances and lots of time to break a shot with much certainty with either rifle. I'd likely need my glasses as well. I can still shoot my peep sighted Mossberg 44US or the Garand, especially with spectacles...in perfect light and lots of time to press off the shots.....not what one gets when hunting whitetails.
I doubt if even a ghost ring peep sight is as fast as a low powered scope. Note too that any decent scope will gather a bit of light and allow shots in dawn and dusk conditions where iron sights will be unusable. Also, the aperture of a peep can indeed be clogged with mud, sleet or snow, and be rendered unusable till cleared. I'd say that a peep sight poops out about 10 minutes before one looses shooting light with the proper scope rig. How that dovetails with your states hunting regs is another matter......
As far as hunters with open barrel sights "making things happen", I suppose that refers to human drives and traditional still / stalk hunting, perhaps even tracking. I'd agree that those skills are becoming lost arts, but I cannot equate some higher success rate to those that still practice them, howsoever few. A lot depends on circumstances. Hard to organize a drive if you are a lone wolf. Hard to still hunt if the cover is so darn thick you have to crawl through it. Hard to stalk or push public land if there are others present not part of your group that take deer out of your drive. There seems a veiled reference that hunters with open barrel sights are more successful than hunters using scopes and using stands. If legal, I think how one decides to hunt is their own business.
Exactly what are "open barrel sights" anyhow? Never heard it before, much less seen it in print. Open sights maybe?
Yes, it is my observation, now for many years, that most folks use a scope for deer hunting. Quite honestly, I cannot recall seeing another hunter, at a check station, public land or private club, hunting with iron sights (on a cartridge rifle) of any kind, in a long, long time.......maybe 20-30 years or more.
Up to a decade or so ago, I occasionally hunted with a GI M1 Garand, or iron sighted (leaf and blade) Remington Model 14, just for kicks. My eyes are to the point now that any optic is a real boon, and I would have to have very ideal circumstances and lots of time to break a shot with much certainty with either rifle. I'd likely need my glasses as well. I can still shoot my peep sighted Mossberg 44US or the Garand, especially with spectacles...in perfect light and lots of time to press off the shots.....not what one gets when hunting whitetails.
I doubt if even a ghost ring peep sight is as fast as a low powered scope. Note too that any decent scope will gather a bit of light and allow shots in dawn and dusk conditions where iron sights will be unusable. Also, the aperture of a peep can indeed be clogged with mud, sleet or snow, and be rendered unusable till cleared. I'd say that a peep sight poops out about 10 minutes before one looses shooting light with the proper scope rig. How that dovetails with your states hunting regs is another matter......
As far as hunters with open barrel sights "making things happen", I suppose that refers to human drives and traditional still / stalk hunting, perhaps even tracking. I'd agree that those skills are becoming lost arts, but I cannot equate some higher success rate to those that still practice them, howsoever few. A lot depends on circumstances. Hard to organize a drive if you are a lone wolf. Hard to still hunt if the cover is so darn thick you have to crawl through it. Hard to stalk or push public land if there are others present not part of your group that take deer out of your drive. There seems a veiled reference that hunters with open barrel sights are more successful than hunters using scopes and using stands. If legal, I think how one decides to hunt is their own business.
Exactly what are "open barrel sights" anyhow? Never heard it before, much less seen it in print. Open sights maybe?
PocketCamera
Moderator
if the 1903a1 was capable of shooting an enemy soldier in the chest at 1200 yards with iron sights in the war, it can STILL shoot a deer in the chest at 200 yards with minimal fuss provided the shooter learns to shoot the rifle.
and the fact that the amount of factory rifles that ONLY come with scope mounting capability, dont mean scopes be better
and the fact that the amount of factory rifles that ONLY come with scope mounting capability, dont mean scopes be better
reynolds357
New member
A Richmond Rifle was capable of shooting a man in the chest at 1200 yards in the War Between The States. It would not be my choice for a hunting rifle today. Because something can do something does not mean it is ideal for the task. I could be wrong, but my take from O.P. was that he was looking for the easiest, most user friendly option. IMO, thats a scope.if the 1903a1 was capable of shooting an enemy soldier in the chest at 1200 yards with iron sights in the war, it can STILL shoot a deer in the chest at 200 yards with minimal fuss provided the shooter learns to shoot the rifle.
and the fact that the amount of factory rifles that ONLY come with scope mounting capability, dont mean scopes be better
Trying to make shots with open sights in the low light of dusk and dawn {when deer are most active} is difficult past 50yds.
If your hunting from a treestand I'd say a good aperture sight would be just fine.
We have to use open sights on muzzleloaders here in Colorado, makes a modern in-line with all the improvements into a 50yd gun instead of a 150-200yd gun.
If your hunting from a treestand I'd say a good aperture sight would be just fine.
We have to use open sights on muzzleloaders here in Colorado, makes a modern in-line with all the improvements into a 50yd gun instead of a 150-200yd gun.
I dont know how long your shots could be but if less than 150 or so, look around and find an old Weaver K4 or a 1.5-4.5 variable they made and go w/ that. Would be deadly at those ranges.
There are some good Weavers available. Try ebay.. Any other 4x would do just fine also.
I say 4x cause they have quite a wide field of view and the target is easier to pick up w/ 4x than a stronger scope.
There are some good Weavers available. Try ebay.. Any other 4x would do just fine also.
I say 4x cause they have quite a wide field of view and the target is easier to pick up w/ 4x than a stronger scope.
if the 1903a1 was capable of shooting an enemy soldier in the chest at 1200 yards with iron sights in the war, it can STILL shoot a deer in the chest at 200 yards with minimal fuss provided the shooter learns to shoot the rifle.
The rifle wasn't the one making the shot ..... it was the user, and likely as not, one man in 10,000 couldn't make that shot consistently, in field conditions, under time pressure. Without proper corrective lenses, most people can't even SEE a man's chest at 3/4 of a mile, unless he's wearing bright colors contrasting to the colors to his background.