S&W Model 36 "Chief's Special

Kentucky Rifle

New member
I've been reading Massad Ayoob's "In The Gravest Extreme" for the past couple of days. He states that the S&W Chief's Special is the most popular .38 ever produced, but has some major shortfalls. (Too small sights, five round capacity, and a short ejector rod that makes reloading a little slower. Just to name a few.)
I was a little surprised. I always thought the Chief's Special was about as close to snubbie perfection as a pistol could get. :)
Any thoughts or comments?

Will

[This message has been edited by WLM (edited October 06, 2000).]
 
The chief special may not be perfect but it does give you five quick shots from a very concealable delivery system.Its not a target model but affords able accuracy to get the job done.It does require a bit of practice to hone the skells necessary to accurately shoot this short barreled gun.I use the model 60 which is the stainless version. It is loaded with hydra shok bullets and I carry 6 extra rounds in a bianchi speed strip.take care.

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cliff
 
I started carrying 36 as a backup in mid 60s. Even used it for Navy expert re-qual one year on a dare....no problem. Have one of the original run now and it gets along with me just fine.

Sam...my favorite 9mm is the 9X32R
 
Humpfff!

If Ayoob says it, I take leave to doubt it. His credibility would be far better if he didn't reverse his opinion twice in three years or so. Remember, In The Gravest Extreme has been in print for several yers, and he'll have changed his mind several times in the interim.

I'd like to see some figures from a respected Smith & Wesson collector who has personally inspected old company records, befor believing they've sold more Model 36s than the Military & Police models.

All that aside, there is some limited validity to the observations. Let's see--
Change the ejector rod to full stroke, enough to clear .38 Spl cases.

Install high profile, 1/8 inch front and adjustable rear, target sights. Increase sight radius by lengthening the two inch barrel to four inches.

Add another chamber to the cylinder, or, as is so popular today, make it a seven or eight shot cylinder.

NOW, you've cured those little shortfalls that Mr. Ayoob points out, and you have a GREAT little gun. Or, maybe not so little. Perhaps it is "improved" to the extent we'll need to call it something else. Like, Model 15 Combat Masterpiece? Or perhaps a Model 686?

Five shots makes for a narrower profile cylinder. Short barrel with the front end latch necessitates a short ejector rod stroke.

I personally believe the major problem with the Model 36 and most of the other J-frames is that they are really pretty heavy for compact arms. I much prefer the Model 37. I feel that S&W finally came out with the "ideal" pocket revolver just shortly before the reprehensible compromise (sellout, that is.) The Model 637 combines the best of the Models 37 and 60. Light enough weight for real pocket carry. Stainless steel parts to resist corrosion. The sights are also a tiny bit wider, for faster pickup. There is still a hammer spur, so you can elect to thumb cock for greater precision.

Let those criticize who wish. The Chief ready to hand will fend off a lot more bad guys than the bigger, easier-to-shoot handguns left in the car or locked in the gun safe.

Interestingly, I just realized that as I write this, l'm still wearing the Model 37 in the ankle holster I put it on at 6:30 a.m.

Best,
Johnny

PS--
C.R.S.--You reminded me I need to re-qualify with the Airweight at the end of this month. Thanks.

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---The Second Amendment ensures the rest of the Bill of Rights---
 
I agree with Mas on the sights...

If you've ever seen the sights on a Charter Arms Off Duty, you'll hate those on the S&W 36. The 36 is a good gun, just lousy sights.

The short ejector rod is less of an issue if you are diilgent about practicing reloads.

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Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!
 
Ayoob doesn't know it all.

I carry a Mod. 60, the stainless. It's also .357 magnum. Black boot grips in a black Galco Speedmaster on a black belt. I carry this open on the belt a fair amount. In Oregon it's legal, and we have the "makinaw law" that says the gun is not technically concealed on a belt even if it's covered with a shirt, vest, coat. So you get to carry concealed out in the open.

The nice part about this is that most people aren't too concerned about a small little black revolver in a discrete black holster. It's not like a 1911 on a belt slide. And you have five shots of .357 magnum in a small package.

If that's what snaps your socks, who cares what Ayoob thinks? If you point the muzzle upward, the cases fall out of the cylinder.
 
I have the Model 38 Bodyguard Airweight with the shrouded hammer. It is my favorite because of its light weight and covered hammer so you don't snag it in your pocket. I also shoot tight groups at 25ft.
Mike
 
Unfortunately this may say more about me than about the gun, but my problem with the Chiefs Special and other .38 J-frames centers on the round butt. I just can't keep hold of it, and as a result can't control the gun properly, IOW, can't shoot it worth a darn. I do much better with square butt J-frames, which AFAIK are not made any more.

The exception is the PD series (337PD and 342PD), not because of the gun itself, but because of the excellent Hogue Bantam grip.

My $0.02.
 
jimmy,I have large hands and I have no trouble hanging onto a Model 37. Try one of these options: 1) Tyler grip adapter for factory grip 2) Ahrens Boot Grip 3) Spegel Boot Grip or 4) Eagle Boot Grip. The last three are in my order of preference. Regards, Richard.
 
Hello all. I tend to agree with Johnny Guest's commentary on the J-frame vs Ayoob's comments. Based on my own experience, the airweight J is a very, very good compromise gun and one that will likely be with you if the balloon goes up. Now that I'm retired from police service, I don't regularly carry a "real" gun as I did for 25 years, but I always have my airweight on me. Some have kind of taken me to task for relying on such a pipsqueak and there is merit in their views, but the little .38 with proper loads in this most compact of delivery systems is reliable, simple to use at close range, and better than yelling for help. Ayoob's ideas make sense, but do require getting away from the "J frame concept" and into a "K" or "L".
Best.
 
I've carried a Mdl. 60 for many years. It's in my pocket as I write this, in a Milt Sparks pocket holster. I also carry an additional six rounds in a Bianchi Speed Strip. When the weather is cool enough for me to wear a jacket or wool shirt, I carry my Colt's Lightweight Commander... but the Mdl. 60 is still in my pocket.

That said, I believe the "poor sights" (non)problem, is overstated. If you practice with the "J" frames using the fundamentals of shooting, you'll do just fine.

I.e., I have many times, used my Mdl. 60, with Federal 110 gr. JHPs, to hit a man sized, steel, waist-to-top-of-head target, at 150 yards. I had no rest, but used a standing, Weaver stance. This was done to prove to certain people the fallacy of those profoundly ignorant "experts" who scream "A snub nose .38 ain't no damn good past seven feet an' you can't hit nothin' with it!" Uh huh. (Yes, I practiced A LOT!And I knew some shooters who were a lot better than I.)

In my opinion, accurate shooting is 90% mental (which includes practice using the proper fundamentals), and the other 10% is the cost of one's equipment. The sights on a J frame, are just fine, for what the gun's intended, and practice will prove that out.

FWIW. J.B.

(And BTW, when I get lazy and DON'T practice the fundamentals of accurate shooting, I get sloppy as hell.)
 
I carry a 442 alot in my pocket. After reading about the pawn broker saving his bacon with a 25 ACP in one hand as he tried to pull the sword out with the other, makes me think that a good pocket gun is worth it.
 
Johnny,

I'm hoping that Ayoub means that the 36 is the most popular small-frame .38 ever produced.

If he's talking sheer sales figures, there's no way that the 36 takes the K-frames. It's simply impossible.

Smith & Wesson has made, by my reconing, between 3 and 4 million K-frame .38 Spls. since their introduction.

Add to those the nearly 1 million chambered in .380/200 for the British during World War II, PLUS the knockoffs, both licensed and unlicensed, made around the world to the S&W system, and the number starts to approach an absolutely astounding 10 million K-frame types.

The K-frame .38 is, by far, the single most successful revolver design EVER.

And while I can't be certain, as many of the records from the Soviet and Communist bloc are closed to us, the K-frame may be the single most produced handgun ever.

By contrast, far fewer than 1 million Model 36s have been produced.

Smith & Wesson alone has produced more Model 10s, probably by a factor of 2 or more, than Model 36s

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Beware the man with the S&W .357 Mag.
Chances are he knows how to use it.
 
Jimmy:

S&W made some VERY nice smooth wood accessory grips for the J's years back. You may be able to find some at a gun show.

One fit the round butt and was referred to as the "banana" grip for obvious reasons.

They made another one that fit both round and square butts that converted the round butt to a square target profile.

They preceded the now popular boot grips IIRC, but I could be wrong - I think they were made during the '80s, but may have continued to make them in dymondwood til recently. CDNN lists some S&W grips which sound similar. Maybe...

I have the banana on grips on a two inch RB J frame and the square butt grips on 3" target sighted RB J frame. And remember, rubber grips make bigger groups.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by C.R.Sam:... I think you beat Fud's record ...[/quote] :confused:
 
The Model 37 was my first carry gun,Still have it and still love it. ;) Not to long ago I purchased a LNIB 36 to keep it company ;)
IMHO they are one of the best small frame revolvers made. :) Still carry the 37 from time to time.
Happy Shooting :)

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We preserve our freedoms by using four boxes: soap,ballot,jury, and cartridge.
Anonymous
 
I've got two j-frames, an old model 49, and a newer 640-1. They are absolutely my favorite guns. One of these is the gun that will always be there should I need one.

Personally, I prefer those hard to see old version sights to the new one's. I can hit smaller targets and shoot tighter groups with them for the same reasons that I can shoot smaller groups using a small bullseye target rather than a large one.

Besides, the new 'combat' sights are too thick in relation to the rear sight notch. In fact, they are the same thickness. Couple this with a short sight radius and you have little light comming around the front sight blade.

Short ejector rod! Shoot a two inch k-frame, then tell me about a short ejector rod. Proper technique cures a short ejector rod problem much quicker than can an empty case stuck under the extractor star when you have an ejector rod that is too long be cleared.
 
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