Ruger blackhawk transfer bar broke

[Driftwood Johnson]

Sorry, I should have explained that better.

Modern Rugers with transfer bars only have one cocking notch, the full cock notch. The badly colored arrow in this photo is pointing to the full cock notch on a New Vaquero hammer. With any transfer bar Ruger, there are only two positions for the hammer. Fully cocked, or all the way down.

Normally, one loads a Ruger by opening the loading gate, which drops the bolt and allows the cylinder to spin freely. One can then do the load one, skip one, and load four more no different than a Colt or clone.

When a Ruger hammer is welded up to eliminate the transfer bar, two new cocking notches will be cut into the hammer. A so called 'safety cock' notch, and a half cock notch. The half cock notch is positioned just like on a Colt. Pulling the hammer back to the half cock notch lowers the bolt into the frame. This makes loading the revolver no different than loading a Colt.




This is the hammer from an old Three Screw Ruger. This is how Ruger hammers were made before transfer bars. The lowest notch is the full cock notch, the next up is the half cock notch for loading, and the top notch is the 'safety cock' notch. With this type of hammer, the old Three Screws were loaded no differently than a Colt. The hammer was placed at half cock, which lowered the bolt into the frame. This allowed the cylinder to spin freely in one direction. Then the rounds were loaded in the Colt manner, load one, skip one, load four more than bring the hammer all the way back to full cock and lower it on an empty chamber.

Just like a Colt, the 'safety cock' notch was not to be trusted. A strong blow to the hammer spur could snap something off and cause the gun to discharge. So shooters familiar with single action revolvers knew to only load 5 and leave an empty chamber under the hammer.

After losing a couple of expensive law suits Ruger completely redesigned their single action revolvers in the 1970s to include a transfer bar, making them safe to carry fully loaded.

Yes, you are correct. A Ruger with the transfer bar removed and the hammer welded up is no longer safe to carry fully loaded with 6 rounds.

This is not an issue in Cowboy Action Shooting. One of the cardinal rules is revolvers are only loaded with five rounds, hammer down on an empty chamber. NEVER loaded with six rounds. This is a safety rule that is strictly observed.

This is true for shooters with modern Rugers with transfer bars too. Just to keep the playing field level modern Rugers are only loaded with five rounds, hammer down on an empty chamber. Never loaded with six rounds.

 

[44 AMP]

The New Model Blackhawk came out in (I believe) 1973.

I was mildly interested In Cowboy Action Shooting when it showed up in my area, went to a shoot to check it out. Some of the rules just put me off. Now, of course, its their game, so their rules, and I didn't mind being told I needed a cowboy hat (they would loan me one) but a couple of the rules, at that time, bothered me.

I had a period correct cartridges .45 Colt and .45-70, but because my Blackhawk had adjustable sights, it had to run in "modern class". Irritating, but ok, fine. My .45-70 wasn't allowed at all in the rifle side, because it didn't have an external HAMMER! (Ruger No.3).

Fine, fine, fine...I get it, period correct, or as close as possible, fine. HOWEVER, (and I suppose its something that happens in nearly all popular games, eventually the gamesmen get enough power to change rules in their favor) later on Cowboy shooting allowed the "cat sneeze" light loads we call Cowboy Action Ammo, AND now they allow non-period correct cartridges, such as .38Special/.357...

Met some nice folks, and enjoyed the shooting but never got really interested in playing their game, their way. I now have several Vaqueros, that do meet with "approval", but I no longer bother. Just me, and no slur on anyone who does play that game. It's just not for me...

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Howdy Again

According to the Ruger website, the old Three Screw Blackhawks were produced from 1955 until 1973. They don't give a date for the introduction of the New Model Blackhawk (with the transfer bar) but it must have been shortly after that.

I bought my 45 Colt/45 ACP convertible New Model Blackhawk in 1975.

I have been shooting Cowboy since 2000 and I can assure you that nowhere in the rulebook (over 40 pages now) does it say you have to wear a cowboy hat. In fact you don't have to wear any hat at all. However it is not uncommon for shooters to make up rules, or think they heard about such and such rule. Wearing a wide brimmed hat will protect you from hot brass raining down out of your rifle and falling down your neck. So will long sleeves, trust me on this. I have a scar from a hot 44-40 round that fell onto my left arm with my sleeve rolled up. It was so hot it stuck to the skin and I had to stop shooting to brush it off.

Mouse fart loads have been part of CAS as long as I have been shooting. However a few years back a power factor was introduced, to keep the loads from being ridiculously light. The power factor for all ammo is not less than 60 and no velocity under 400fps. I don't know anything about power factors, but 400 fps is sure pretty darn slow.

I am going to assume you wanted to shoot your Ruger No. 3 in the Precision Long Range category, since 45-70 is not allowed as a Main Match rifle. (All Main Match rifles must be chambered for a 'pistol' cartridges, such as 45 Colt, 44-40, etc.) Yes, single shot rifles must be originals or replicas of single shot rifles manufactured during the period from approximately 1860 until 1899. And they must have an exposed hammer, like a Sharps or a Rolling Block or a High Wall.

These days you could use your Blackhawk in the Age Based categories, but yes, when I joined they were only legal in the Modern category.

Regarding ammo, from the handbook:

"Revolver ammunition must be centerfire calibers of at least .32 caliber and no larger than .45 caliber or percussion calibers of at least .36 caliber and no larger than .45 caliber."

"Must be in a caliber commonly available in revolvers. Examples include, but are not limited to, .32-20, .32 Magnum, .357 Magnum, .38 Special, .44 Magnum, .44-40, and .45 Colt"

That is not an all inclusive list. A few other legal revolver calibers are 45 Schofield, 44 Russian and 38-40. I know because I shoot them all on occasion.

Yes 38 Special is allowed, it is the most common revolver ammunition because it is inexpensive in factory loadings and does not recoil much. In point of fact, 38 Special was developed in 1899, so it fits into the general era of 1860 to 1899. But 357 Mag, and 44 Mag do not fall into that time period. They are allowed as long as muzzle velocity is kept under 1000 fps.

Heck, 45 Auto Rim is even allowed if you have a revolver chambered for it.

You will have to excuse me now because I have to load up some Black Powder 44-40 rounds for Sunday.

 

[44 AMP]

I have been shooting Cowboy since 2000 and I can assure you that nowhere in the rulebook (over 40 pages now) does it say you have to wear a cowboy hat.

When I was checking out Cowboy shooting it was the mid 80s, and the rules weren't anywhere near what there is today. It may just have been the local group's rule, but I can assure you they said I needed to wear a cowboy had, and they would loan me one...

Also, at that time, there were no "cowboy action" light loads, unless you handloaded them yourself. Personally, I've always felt that if the object was to replicate the old west, cat sneeze loads were wrong, and should not have been allowed. I think those loads show a clear victory of gamers over re-enactors. I did see one guy show up with a LeMat, and he was shooting actual eek black powder!! They made him shoot all by himself.

times (and the rules) changed now?

The .38 Special may have been developed in 1899, but all my reference material is consistent saying S&W introduced the .38 Special in 1902, in their Military and Police model revolver.

Would I be able to shoot a .30 Luger or Broomhandle Mauser (C-96) today? both predate 1899, slightly....Could I shoot my Norwegian Krag in 6.5x55mm in rifle side matches? its dated 1897...??

Just curious...

 

[Crunchy Frog]

Driftwood was right (as usual); unless you are shooting in one of the two very specialized "costume based categories", a hat is not required. The game has rules, fine, but we don't need uninformed people making up rules.

Some of the rules are driven by the reality that we shoot steel targets, which are usually mild steel targets due to cost, at fairly close range. A rifle round like your .45-70 would damage them. A FMJ round would be more prone to ricochet.

In SASS the handgun must be a single action revolver. It's not just about the period when the firearm was first introduced.

There is a another game called Wild Bunch Action Shooting that uses firearms from circa 1913. There is a Wild Bunch side match, BAMM (bolt action military match) that uses bolt action or straight pull military rifles. I bet your Krag would be great for that.

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Personally, I've always felt that if the object was to replicate the old west, cat sneeze loads were wrong, and should not have been allowed.

Howdy Again

While that may be what you think Cowboy Action Shooting should be, that is not the stated purpose of the Single Action Shooting Society.

Cowboy Action Shooting is a a combination of shooting firearms typical of those used in the Old West from 1860 until 1899 and Saturday matinees at the movie theater when we were kids. It is not historical recreation or re-enactment and does not pretend to be. A lot of folks who are not members do not understand that distinction.

The National Congress of Old West Shooters (NCOWS) is more of a historical re-enactment group than SASS is. You might like their rules better.

http://www.ncows.com/




Regarding the origin of the 38 Special, many sources quote 1902, including Frank Barnes in Cartridge of the World. However that is incorrect. Smith and Wesson developed the 38 Special cartridge (they like to call it 38 Smith and Wesson Special but it is the same cartridge) in 1899 for the 38 Military and Police Model of 1899.

This is a very early Model of 1899, the serial number is less than 200 and according to Roy Jinks, the S&W historian, it shipped in October of 1899. It is chambered for the 38 Special cartridge. You can always tell the Model of 1899 from the Model of 1902 and all later versions because the 1899 was the only one that lacked an underlug under the barrel to secure the front of the ejector rod.

This is a page from a reproduction of the 1900 S&W catalog showing the Model of 1899.

Here is a page from the same 1900 catalog. Notice the round on the left is the 38 S&W Special cartridge. Notice too that it was loaded with Black Powder at the time, that is why the round is so long and modern Smokeless loads have a large amount of air space in them.

Regarding your Broomhandle or Luger, all pistols still have to be single action revolvers. Regarding your Norwegian Krag in 6.5x55mm, I'm pretty sure no bolt action rifles are allowed.




P.S. Not everybody in CAS shoots mouse farts. I load all my rounds to the gills with Black Powder. I don't really care how I place in the competition, my object is to get a clean match. Sometimes the smoke is so dense I have to wait a bit for it to clear for me to see the targets.

You will have to excuse me now, I have to load up some shotgun shells with Black Powder for the match on Sunday.

 

[44 AMP]

Thank you, Driftwood, for the explanation and the lovely pics.

I was aware that Barnes's had several errors, (as well as more than a bit of his own personal opinions) but found it interesting that several other references, particularly the short histories in several reloading manuals were also consistent in stating 1902.

I checked with a friend, who has much better reference material on this than I do, and after getting lost in him giving me chapter and verse on the changes to the S&W Military and Police, we came up with an idea where the "introduced in 1902 with the M&P" MIGHT have come from.

The 1902 gun was the first to have the ejector rod barrel lug and so, visually is the "first" model that looks like all the "modern" S&Ws. The 1899 "looks" like a Colt, (with an S&W cylinder latch).

I think the loading manual's "1902" history is probably a case of some "expert" from an earlier age, making the statement, and it just being repeated and accepted as the actual truth.

Thank you for taking the time from your loading and shooting to give clear, accurate information and proof, shattering some long held beliefs with reality. It can be astounding to find out that what "everyone knows" isn't always right.

 

[stagpanther]

If you have to wear a cowboy hat for cowboy action shooting--which I think is kinda cool--they should also require accurately spitting chew into a spittoon prior to taking the shot.

I did have a transfer bar break on one of my Blackhawks long time ago--I vaguely recall it was a result of being out of time with the pawl/loading gate but it's been a long time since I've had one apart so I might be dreaming that.