Remington NMA ball seater.
- Thread starter Deltadart
- Start date
Aguila Blanca
Staff
Try calling VTI Gun Parts and ask. I have found them to be very helpful, and I've called them more than once with off-the-wall requests.
https://www.vtigunparts.com/store/
https://www.vtigunparts.com/store/
Good morning everyone! Just a quick question... Which is the reason not to like the shape the bullet could adopt after being pushed into the cylinder? Remember it is not a muzzleloading rifle with ball and patch that keeps the round ball form and its particular ballistics...
A revolver round ball will always cut a ring while being pushed into the cylinder changing its form from the mentioned ball into a kind of "round base flat point" bullet. Something like a wadcutter profile point and a round base.
I don't want to be in front of a bullet like that...
A revolver round ball will always cut a ring while being pushed into the cylinder changing its form from the mentioned ball into a kind of "round base flat point" bullet. Something like a wadcutter profile point and a round base.
I don't want to be in front of a bullet like that...
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The JB Weld filler makes the most sense as a fix. However, I don't see how a deeper concave plunger is a problem. I've owned multiple Remingtons and even more Colt's repros and the only real problem was with a Walker with a sharp interior lip on the rammer face that would actually grab the ball and pull it back up and out of the chamber. A little bit of Dremel stoning took care of the lip. The only effect of a deeply concave rammer is it forms a circular indentation on the ball. This is just cosmetic and has little effect on function or accuracy. I'd say most of my revolvers leave the ring dent on the balls. None of my guns are set up for paper target competitions where there might be a measurable disadvantage to the indentation. I consider the circular dent as normal.
Remington NMA Ball Seater
Thank you all for the ideas. I guess I want my cake and eat it too. On this particular NMA, (I have 4) the rammer has a pretty pronounced conical profile to it. When I use .375 balls, they are snug, but no ring is cut. Going to a .380 is difficult to load, the upper and lower contacts of the rammer leave deep groves at the 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock position in the ball, however there is the desired lead ring. I do not like modifying a firearm much as I always want to be able to go to original should I decide to sell it, although unusual I would do so. I contacted Dixie, they had little confidence their parts would fit. I thought of the J-B Weld option, but here again modifying the revolver. I will try VTI tomorrow, and depending on what they say, may end up purchasing the Pietta part then just work it out with file and sandpaper if possible. The last option is simply have one made at a machine shop to fit round ball. I do see the Ox-Yoke loader stand for .44 and .36 where the cylinder is removed each time and loaded separate from the revolver, what are your thoughts on that.
Thank you all for the ideas. I guess I want my cake and eat it too. On this particular NMA, (I have 4) the rammer has a pretty pronounced conical profile to it. When I use .375 balls, they are snug, but no ring is cut. Going to a .380 is difficult to load, the upper and lower contacts of the rammer leave deep groves at the 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock position in the ball, however there is the desired lead ring. I do not like modifying a firearm much as I always want to be able to go to original should I decide to sell it, although unusual I would do so. I contacted Dixie, they had little confidence their parts would fit. I thought of the J-B Weld option, but here again modifying the revolver. I will try VTI tomorrow, and depending on what they say, may end up purchasing the Pietta part then just work it out with file and sandpaper if possible. The last option is simply have one made at a machine shop to fit round ball. I do see the Ox-Yoke loader stand for .44 and .36 where the cylinder is removed each time and loaded separate from the revolver, what are your thoughts on that.
I liked the idea of using a loading press so much that I never loaded a Remington by using the gun's rammer.
I don't have experience with the RMC Ox-Yoke loader but from their video it looks to be good enough.
I load 3 cylinders in a row using pre-measured charges stored in pill bottles, and use a small funnel to pour powder into the chambers.
Depending on the size of the powder charges and powder type, the cylinder pin needs to be wiped and lubed after firing 3-4 full cylinders anyway, so IMO using a loading press offers more advantages than disadvantages.
Especially if you purchase any extra cylinders.
And if you end up buying a Remington 5.5" Sheriff model, it has an even shorter ram handle so buying a loading press makes more sense than changing 2 rammers, or using an extension on the ramming lever.
I don't have experience with the RMC Ox-Yoke loader but from their video it looks to be good enough.
I load 3 cylinders in a row using pre-measured charges stored in pill bottles, and use a small funnel to pour powder into the chambers.
Depending on the size of the powder charges and powder type, the cylinder pin needs to be wiped and lubed after firing 3-4 full cylinders anyway, so IMO using a loading press offers more advantages than disadvantages.
Especially if you purchase any extra cylinders.
And if you end up buying a Remington 5.5" Sheriff model, it has an even shorter ram handle so buying a loading press makes more sense than changing 2 rammers, or using an extension on the ramming lever.
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Remington NMA Ball Seater
Arcticap
My NMA is the shorter barrel version with target sights. There is considerably less leverage than with the .44s. True after about 3 cylinders the gun needs to have the cylinder removed cleaned and lubed. The load station may just be the way to go anyway. By using it for the .44 and .36 it is easy to justify the small cost. By the way have you used the pre-loaded paper cartridges? I tried them on the 44s. Work well, but the time is spent nitrating the paper, cutting the cone shaped paper, rolling, gluing, charging, and gluing a ball on top seemed to me to take a lot more time than, than was saved at the bench. Any thoughts.
Arcticap
My NMA is the shorter barrel version with target sights. There is considerably less leverage than with the .44s. True after about 3 cylinders the gun needs to have the cylinder removed cleaned and lubed. The load station may just be the way to go anyway. By using it for the .44 and .36 it is easy to justify the small cost. By the way have you used the pre-loaded paper cartridges? I tried them on the 44s. Work well, but the time is spent nitrating the paper, cutting the cone shaped paper, rolling, gluing, charging, and gluing a ball on top seemed to me to take a lot more time than, than was saved at the bench. Any thoughts.
Driftwood Johnson
New member
Howdy
I would go with the idea of the JB Weld and wax paper.
But seriously, so you really think a ring on the ball is affecting accuracy all that much?
I never worried about it with any of my C&B revolvers.
I would go with the idea of the JB Weld and wax paper.
But seriously, so you really think a ring on the ball is affecting accuracy all that much?
I never worried about it with any of my C&B revolvers.
Is it really a probem ???
Fellas, first off I will have to admit that I don't know as much as "Most' of you about C&B's. But lately, I have been restoring a hand-full of Remington's and Colts Non-replicas. Just finished a Colt Walker and it's loading ram-face configuration is cone-shaped. I have also noticed that some of my other C&B replicas, are also cone-shaped, load and shoot round ball, quite well. …
I still recall an older mentort, state that a pure lead round wall is very forgiving. ..
So I have to ask, is there really a "Big" problem ??. …
Be Safe !!!
Fellas, first off I will have to admit that I don't know as much as "Most' of you about C&B's. But lately, I have been restoring a hand-full of Remington's and Colts Non-replicas. Just finished a Colt Walker and it's loading ram-face configuration is cone-shaped. I have also noticed that some of my other C&B replicas, are also cone-shaped, load and shoot round ball, quite well. …
I still recall an older mentort, state that a pure lead round wall is very forgiving. ..
So I have to ask, is there really a "Big" problem ??. …
Be Safe !!!
As I told before, the final shape will always be a wadcutter bullet with round base. Nothing to worry about its accuracy up to normal shooting distances for a handgun and a very good bullet profile in terms of terminal ballistics. I would keep it but each one have his/her own preferences and I respect them all.
Deltadart,
I have not tried to make paper cartridges even though I have some packs of cigarette papers in case I ever wanted to try them out.
I bought a custom made press before I ever started revolver shooting and didn't feel like spending any more time than needed to measure the powder and put it into pill bottles.
Once the investment in a press is made, then that should justify skipping as much extra labor as possible unless I was out hunting in the woods and had a real need.
Also because I use the loading press to punch out over powder wads from orange juice cartons, I don't feel that paper cartridges would save any time in the end.
Loading the chambers would still be a multi-step process.
It would take many more minutes to make any type of paper cartridges compared to normally only taking seconds to remove the cap off of a bottle before pouring the powder into each chamber.
Making cartridges might be fun for some folks, and I can respect learning that process. But I would rather save the time to spend on other things.
I have not tried to make paper cartridges even though I have some packs of cigarette papers in case I ever wanted to try them out.
I bought a custom made press before I ever started revolver shooting and didn't feel like spending any more time than needed to measure the powder and put it into pill bottles.
Once the investment in a press is made, then that should justify skipping as much extra labor as possible unless I was out hunting in the woods and had a real need.
Also because I use the loading press to punch out over powder wads from orange juice cartons, I don't feel that paper cartridges would save any time in the end.
Loading the chambers would still be a multi-step process.
It would take many more minutes to make any type of paper cartridges compared to normally only taking seconds to remove the cap off of a bottle before pouring the powder into each chamber.
Making cartridges might be fun for some folks, and I can respect learning that process. But I would rather save the time to spend on other things.
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Remington NMA Ball Seater
The problem I have with the .380 ball is applying so much pressure on the loading lever. When the ball gives way and is driven into the chamber, cutting the little lead ring as is recommended I end up driving the ball deep into the chamber. Then I have to go to each chamber to try to seat the balls equally, the issue is I usually end up seating the ball much deeper than I had intended to and compressing the powder more than I would like.
The problem I have with the .380 ball is applying so much pressure on the loading lever. When the ball gives way and is driven into the chamber, cutting the little lead ring as is recommended I end up driving the ball deep into the chamber. Then I have to go to each chamber to try to seat the balls equally, the issue is I usually end up seating the ball much deeper than I had intended to and compressing the powder more than I would like.
As to the paper cartridges, I used coffee filter paper, much more durable than newsprint or cigarette paper. The tapered dowel was easy to make on the lathe, and the geometry to make a template was also easy. After nitrating the paper and allowing it to dry over night, then folded in quarters, four patterns can be cut using the template. But after rolling, gluing, charging, and adding the ball that took a fair amount of time. Even when doing this while wasting time watching TV. With a little practice the process is improved very well. The cartridges do load quickly at the bench and burn clean. I see this as an advantage in a combat environment, but for punching paper I do not see the time trade off as an advantage.
Using a press will often compress the powder more too.
Maybe you could use some filler, cream of wheat, grits or semolina if you get a press.
Would you guess that your current paper cartridges are leaving any air space in the chambers or not?
Some folks make cylinder shaped "powder only" cartridges for consistency.
I'm not so sure about whether other cartridge shapes leave any air space or not, unless they're rammed and compressed enough to take the shape of the chambers and take up any extra space.
Since the .36 chambers are smaller than the .44, there probably wouldn't be as much potential leftover space as with a .44.
I don't think that leaving any chamber space is a safety issue, but it's only about being consistent.
However extra powder compression may be a good thing to do, especially with some substitute powders because it can increase velocity and perhaps consistency too.
A press makes it easier to compress or over-compress, which I don't know if there's even such a thing as to over-compress except maybe if using 777.
And even then, it's such a small charge that it shouldn't matter unless it shows up in chrony velocity testing or negatively affects accuracy.
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Remington NMA Ball Seater
I have only used the paper cartridges in the .44s so far. They load easily and I like them, but as stated lot of time to make the cartridges. My .44s have the longer loading levers and even though these are not that much longer they are easier. My cartridges were cone shaped, they went into the chambers easily and the rammer seems to seat them fairly well. I thought the cone idea was to cause the paper to rupture when seated ensuring rapid ignition. But that was an assumption on my part. I made a couple of different sizes of tapered dowels to accommodate different powder charges. Generally I use only BP, I have tried the substitutes but as burn those up I do not plan on using them again.
On a different note, I do use Trailboss in cartridge guns for the 100 yard range. I made up a poly 55 gal barrel to dampen noise, using synthetic mulch as a medium, It works great,and with Trailboss the velocity is subsonic. So there is no boom, and no crack. Recoil is minimal, accuracy is good. However past 100 yd I think the trajectory would look like a rainbow from the 30-30, .38-55, 45-70, or 50 cal rifles.
I have only used the paper cartridges in the .44s so far. They load easily and I like them, but as stated lot of time to make the cartridges. My .44s have the longer loading levers and even though these are not that much longer they are easier. My cartridges were cone shaped, they went into the chambers easily and the rammer seems to seat them fairly well. I thought the cone idea was to cause the paper to rupture when seated ensuring rapid ignition. But that was an assumption on my part. I made a couple of different sizes of tapered dowels to accommodate different powder charges. Generally I use only BP, I have tried the substitutes but as burn those up I do not plan on using them again.
On a different note, I do use Trailboss in cartridge guns for the 100 yard range. I made up a poly 55 gal barrel to dampen noise, using synthetic mulch as a medium, It works great,and with Trailboss the velocity is subsonic. So there is no boom, and no crack. Recoil is minimal, accuracy is good. However past 100 yd I think the trajectory would look like a rainbow from the 30-30, .38-55, 45-70, or 50 cal rifles.