Reliability and longevity from caliber and style

Chris, I would recommend that what every you buy, you get a reloading set-up too. You will not "save money". You will shoot a lot more for the money you spend.

Having read the answers to your question posted my other members here, I have little I would add as far as the guns go. They give good advice.

What area and state are you in? If you live in a large city the opportunity to fire your guns regularly are often less than if you live out int he country, and if you live in one of the more communist/socialist areas you will have hoops to jump through compared to living in the wide open western areas of the USA.

It may not seem to be an issue when you first get started in shooting, but I assure you these questions will matter as time wears on.
 
Wyosmith- I live in Oklahoma and live within 10 mins of a few ranges. I try to go shooting every week if not at minimum 2 times a month. I don't shoot a lot maybe 100 rounds a trip max but it keeps me sharp.

I never hear anything bad about Sig's and really want to try one out, however the M&P 9 I shot today was awesome. If the Detail Strip is easy I will probably buy one of those if the wife can shoot it decently as well
 
Alrighty. I finally went and test fired both VP9 and the M&P9 both were fantastic. The VP9 seemed to be a little more ergonomicly fitting however the mag release definite needed to be gotten use to. Shot both quite well, however still adjusting back to 9mm. Lol. Both seem to be about the same price as well. MARINE I don't know if you have both of these firearms, sounds like you do but u may just be very intelegent on both platforms, either way. Would you sway towards an M&P9 WITH apex trigger or VP9 besically stock for CCW or Open Carry depending on how I feel. :)?
 
I have both.

They are both a little large for concealed carry, but it is possible. The shape of the VP9 may have an advantage.

The mag release on the VP9, I use my trigger finger to activate it, not my thumb... Very easy that way.

Prices for my area, the M&P goes on sale often for less than $500 for a standard model. (PSA usually)

The VP9 runs around $600 for the base version.


The full Apex AEK on an M&P is awesome... Get the Poly replacement trigger to go along with the kit, more solid setup.

To me, the Apex trigger in an M&P is one of if not the best striker trigger.


That being said... the newest M&P triggers are worlds better than before. You may be happy with a stock trigger, or maybe add the Apex Poly replacement trigger, to remove a little mush from the trigger, and be happy with that. My M&P9c, I simply polished up the internals, and replaced the trigger... And that was enough, I didn't bother with replacing the internals with an Apex AEK.


Between the M&P and the VP9, I really like both pistols. The VP9 fits me better overall and the mag release is awesome... The finger grooves are just ever so slightly annoying to me, and the trigger on the M&P is better... Those little niggles are what keep me from declaring it my favorite over the M&P


Either option is a solid choice.
 
Alrighty. I'm heading to the metcaf gun show tomorrow to try and score one. Do you have any advise on the grip? I feel like it is very bland if you will, and offers not very much grip aggressiveness. Like on a Glock 30s for example. I feel as if I were to get into a scuffle and drop my gun into a puddle or gasoline or what have you that I would not be able to hold onto it. Any advise or information there?
 
I have not had any problems with the grip texture on either the VP9 or the M&P.

That being said, if you do decide to get the talon grips, I suggest the rubber version. The gritty version can be uncomfortable to carry, and begins to be hard on the hands after you shoot a couple boxes of ammo at the range.
 
I think a steel-framed 1911 would probably hold up better long term than a polymer-framed Glock 21 but I have no proof of this.

I don't think you need to prove it. You can break plastic but you can't break steel.
 
...you can't break steel.
Of course you can. It's not difficult to find examples of steel-framed pistols that have frame cracks from use.

In general, the longevity of a pistol has more to do with how well it was designed and the manufacturer's attention to quality control than it does with what it's made of.

That said, even a good design implemented with good quality materials won't last forever. Virtually anything will eventually break after enough use.
 
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...you can't break steel.

Of course you can. It's not difficult to find examples of steel-framed pistols that have frame cracks from use.

In general, the longevity of a pistol has more to do with how well it was designed and the manufacturer's attention to quality control than it does with what it's made of.

That said, even a good design implemented with good quality materials won't last forever. Virtually anything will eventually break after enough use.

Truly spoken. A 1970's vintage car was built from real steel and iron, and you could almost count major engine work after about 75k miles, and suspension work as well. We now have cars built with lighter engine and suspension components (aluminum blocks, plastic intake manifolds, etc.) that are running 300k miles without major overhauls. The design is what allows these lighter weight materials to endure...........It's all about the combination of design AND materials, not just one or the other
 
Well I have finally decided that I'm going to get an M&P 9 the most important reason behind this decision was the fact of the M&P has replaceable slide rails so in the event that SH TF I would be able to replace literally everything piece by piece aside from the slide and the frame this is why I chose the M&P nine over the VP nine and the Glock 19

Let the argument begin :)
 
Well I have finally decided that I'm going to get an M&P 9 the most important reason behind this decision was the fact of the M&P has replaceable slide rails so in the event that SH TF I would be able to replace literally everything piece by piece aside from the slide and the frame this is why I chose the M&P nine over the VP nine and the Glock 19

Let the argument begin

If it floats your bought rock on, though you're worried about replacing a part that hasn't broken on Glocks with over 100,000 rds through them. There was a recall in the early 2000s, but I have never actually met a person that had this problem https://books.google.com/books?id=UMNumhIb7bIC&pg=PA104&lpg=PA104&dq=glock+slide+rails+break&source=bl&ots=GG1g2yzw10&sig=ip58OCRDP5vVU4nuyLTc3AMFT5Q&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiUpKbk25DKAhXBez4KHariDcIQ6AEIazAM#v=onepage&q=glock%20slide%20rails%20break&f=false. With the money you'll have spent on ammo or reloading components to get to a high enough round count to break the slide rails you could have bought a number of spare pistols.

I find it sort of funny how worried people get over SHTF in terms of firearms and small parts. Unless you have a sustainable food source, a water collection and filtration system, and a steady supply of medical equipment and treatment from someone other than yourself there are many, many ways you can die long before the slide rails on your pistol break. In fact it probably won't break in your lifetime even if the SHTF never happens. And at that point by all accounts the manufacturer should take care of it for you since the S hasn't hit the F. To me multiple pistols is more important than multiple parts.
 
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The best spare parts to have for a gun... is another gun.

It's a common mentally.


One that has merit.

For me, I have a few common parts on hand, and a spare gun or two. :D

The parts allow me to fix the most common problems without having to wait for parts to be delivered or in stock somewhere. If a part is on backorder, I can still use the gun in the mean time.
 
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For me, I have a few common parts on hand, and a spare gun or two.

Common parts is one thing. Springs, extractors, and other small parts I get. Slide rails or in the case of M&Ps locking blocks and sear housings are less common and, imo, a lot less prone to breakage unless we're talking extreme round counts.

With Glocks and M&Ps so many people are selling parts that it's pretty uncommon for them to be out of stock everywhere, including S&W. That said when I do order a part I always order a spare just in case. There's no harm in being prepared, I'm just saying understand the chances associated with each concern and whether other higher probability risks are being ignored.
 
You do make some very good points Tunnel. I guess it's something I may have to consider. Since I think about it there are more cases of slides blowing up than there are slide rails breaking so a backup gun would serve a better purpose. Maybe my mind can change tonight.
 
I think a backup gun is a good idea regardless of the manufacturer. I have two Glock 19s. One I shoot once every two months, about a box to ensure function. That one I use for nightstand duty. The other gets shot about every weekend and is what I use for various courses. I probably put about 600 rds a month through that pistol. Both have the same sights, same Talon Grips, same setup so that using one produces the same muscle memory and feel as the other. The point is to try to keep one in some form of preserved state. I still put 500 rds through the Glock 19 on the nightsand to make sure it functioned fine from the factory, but I try to keep parts wear to a minimum while checking function periodically. There's also nothing wrong with having extra parts. But the old "two is one, one is none" expression helps too in the off chance something major happens (case rupture, squib that you don't notice, theft, etc.).

I wanted to state I don't have any problem with someone using an M&P and I want to make sure that wasn't the takeaway from my comments above. M&Ps have dropped to prices online that make them an extremely good value. If you have the money at a later date, consider a spare.
 
I try not to advocate one pistol over another here (at least these days). I find pistols are very subjective when it comes to shooting and most are roughly equally reliable when talking about the ~$500 striker fired pistol.

Since you asked, my personal reasons stem from a few factors. I like the fact that I can look at a Glock and tell that the striker is cocked. If the trigger is forward then the striker is cocked (it will stay to the rear when the striker is released). On an M&P you have no such visual option. Coming from hammer fired pistols it's a quirk of mine that I like that visual cue.

I find I shoot a Glock with a stock trigger essentially just as well as an M&P with an APEX trigger slow fire, and actually better when I pick up the pace. All else being equal, I'd prefer to use a pistol in the stock configuration when it comes to self defense. On Glocks I add Talon Grips, replace the magazine release, sights, and I polish the trigger bar, but that's it. I don't mess with the firing mechanism or trigger pull weight. On an M&P I always put in an APEX kit (though the newer M&Ps really don't seem to need it). Massad Ayoob has a number of articles about modifying firearms and the legal implications. The general result is that as long as the modifications don't lead to you claiming you "accidentally" pressed the trigger when you didn't mean to, you'll be fine. I also live in a very pro self-defense state. However, I still prefer not to go down that road if I can and in this case all else was actually equal (it usually isn't).

Though these days I carry a Glock 26 with the factory +2 baseplates, which is very similar to the M&P 9c in terms of size, I do at times carry a Glock 19. I find the slightly smaller size makes a difference to me when it comes to concealment compared to the fullsize M&P.

The last factor was I personally have had QC issues with a number of M&Ps. I had an M&P 45c that would fail to feed when you fired more than 50 or so rounds. I had an M&P 9 fullsize where the trigger was malformed and rubbed on the frame during the press creating a heavier than normal trigger pull. I had an M&P 9c that ejected straight to the 6 o'clock position and right into my forehead. I had an M&P Shield where the trigger safety would not engage between shots (it fell under the recall that happened). Lastly I had an M&P 9c where at around 800 rds the slide and barrel started peening and the sear housing block wouldn't sit tightly in the frame causing it to tilt (I had to expand the trigger bar loop to account for the off chance where the trigger bar was pushing the housing up at the same time as actuating the sear otherwise the striker wouldn't release).

Now, all these issues were fixed by S&W. But it's been my experience that they use their lifetime warranty as a form of QC rather than being more diligent before the pistols leave the factory. There will be many folks here that have had no such issues with M&Ps. I'm a statistician by trade and one man with a few samples isn't enough to judge a whole model line and that's why I gave S&W multiple tries. But what made me stop in the end was the variety of issues I kept finding. I have had issues with Glocks in the past with ejected cases bouncing off my head (none so bad as that M&P 9c) and generally less than ideal ejection. But the firearm still functioned, using "hotter" ammo (such as self defense loads) generally made those problems go away, and that was typically the only issue so I knew to look for it (I've owned easily half a dozen Glocks as well) and I have a few tricks to try to remedy that problem if it arises.

Given the issues I had and the fact that I shot Glocks as well or better made me switch from M&Ps to Glocks. However, this is just my personal experience. I'm of the opinion that each shooter has to find what works best for him/her.
 
I have 3 M&P pistols, and have had no issues with them...

So, as he said, one person's bad luck does not doom a firearm design.

Most have no issues with their M&P, it is a well liked and respected pistol.


I try to look at several people's experience with a particular firearm, I read and watch several reviews. I also take in account that people are more likely to take time to express complaints than praise.


As was said, most striker pistols at the $500ish price range are generally equally reliable and well made.


You will most likely have no issues with your M&P. And it's likely that you will end up with another pistol in the future, even if it isn't an M&P, it's still a backup.
 
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