recommendations for long range rifle

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P71pilot

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My Dad recently got into long range competition 300-1000yds, and is shooting a fancy custom savage in 6.5-285 Norma

I would like to join him in this hobby, but am severely limited in budget,

I have two requirements for the rifle

It MUST have iron sights, i will not own a rifle without them. God forbid the rifle is out hunting and gets dropped from a tree stand or onto a rock, scopes can and do break. The rifle absolutely has to have iron sights. I know that very few bolt rifles these days have them.

Requirement number two is that the rifle must be under $700. I have seen older remington 700s on gunbroker for about $500-$600, so if those are recommended that may be the route i take.

I will reload for the rifle. My dad reloads for his 6.5 so i would just have to acquire components and dies and a shellholder. And loading data of course.


I believe any rifle is capable of great accuracy, especially when you can tailor a handload to it.

So far i am leaning toward a older Remington 700 with irons, these are usually only available in 7mm mag and 30-06, that i have seen thus far, although i am sure there are other calibers like .270, etc to be found.

I was first looking toward accurate milsurps, but i dont think they are capable of the the type of accuracy i would need at 500+ yards.

Any input and opinions are appreciated. I would like to achieve about 1/3MOA with handloads, which i think is out of the realm of reality for milsurps. With my two requirements my choices are very limited. I set a budget of $700 on the rifle because i would like to keep thr total package at $1000, spending $300-$400 on the scope
 
Sorry, your confusing me...

You want a rifle for competition shooting 300-1000 yards, yet you want iron sights for hunting???

These 2 seldom go hand in hand.

Can you have a decent hunting rifle that will shoot, and hit steel out to 1000 yards, yes..

To do competitions with said hunting rifle, not so well. Trust me, I'm there..

I'm shooting a fairly stock Stevens 200 in 7mm-08AI. I did the chamber reaming myself, along with glass, and pillar bed, trigger job, stiffened up the factory stock.
I bed the rail to the action, and installed Vortex rings, with a Vortex CrossfireII 6-18x44 scope. (best I can afford at the time).
I also installed a Green Blob bi-pod on it (cheaper by far imitation of an Atlas bi-pod). Made my own sand bags for the rear of the stock.

Can I hit the target at 600 yards? Yes...
Am I anywhere near competitive? Heck no!!
Do I have fun doing it? Heck yes!!

Along with your spending with the firearm, don't forget the cost of casings (at least 100 of the same lot number hopefully), primers, powder, bullets (match grade).

On my limited budget I'm using PPU casings (got them for a steal from Grafs).
Federal Match primers.
Alliant Power Pro 2000 MR powder. (2836fps, 2 SD)
and Berger 140gr. Hunting VLD. (G1 bc of 500)

Most competitive shooters would recommend a heavier, non hunting bullet, but these are readily available to me, and I like to buck the trends.

I don't shoot anywhere near what some guys do. I put about 900 rounds a year downrange. Most guys will wear out a barrel in a year.
 
I think I get exactly what he's saying.

The gun has to be able to do both in case the long range shooting trend falls off and he still has a good gun he can hunt with that has iron sights just in case.

On the second he doesn't exactly say that he's going to be competing in long range shooting but maybe he will. But his dad probably goes to the range a bit and it probably feels dumb siting there doing nothing while dad shoots. Two guns equals twice the fun.

The one problem I see is many prefer a heavy stock for long range shooting which wouldn't be fun to carry around the woods and it's also an additional cost.

A Remington 700 BDL or Winchester model 70 in used condition might fit quite well.
 
First of all, you are better off going cheap on the rifle than the scope. Many modern rifles around $500 or less guarantee sub moa out of the box with factory ammo. You can generally speaking get them down to 1/2 or even 1/4 moa with a well developed hand load.

I recommend the Ruger American Rifle in either.300 Win Mag, or 30-06. The 30-06 is about $100 cheaper but the .300 win mag will launch larger pills at faster velocity with higher ballistic coefficients down range making longer shots easier. And the 300 Win Mag is a .30 cal so bullets are easy to find. I have a Ruger Am rifle in .270 win which I was able to get at 1/4 moa without really trying to develop a good hand load. The Ruger American also comes standard with a free floated cold hammer forged barrel and adjustable 3-5 lb trigger.
The .300 win mag is about $500 and the .30-06 is about $400.

For a scope I would go with the Leupold VX-R 6x18x40 Mildot Or the Nikon Monarch 4x16x50 Mildot mounted using Burris signature XTR rings. The scopes are about $500 each and rings $80. The Burris rings have the ability to have either a 0 MOA cant (like standard rings) or 40 MOA cant. This is necessary when trying to zero scopes with standard amounts of internal travel at 800+ yards. Don't shim your rings....and the XTR rings by Burris will handle heavy recoil and are easy on the scope.

You could put this package together for $1000-$1100 and have a nice 1/2 MOA rifle, decent glass, and crisp light trigger. You will not have iron sights but I have been hunting for decades and was in theater over in the Persian gulf and never once used iron sights. With good rings and a good scope, as long as you don't bend it falling out of a tree your fine. And if you go on a long hunting trip, keep a backup rifle in your truck.

Also, no iron sights allows for medium or sometimes even low rings.
 
It MUST have iron sights, i will not own a rifle without them. God forbid the rifle is out hunting and gets dropped from a tree stand or onto a rock, scopes can and do break. The rifle absolutely has to have iron sights. I know that very few bolt rifles these days have them.
Click to expand...


Insisting on iron sights today is like going into a car dealer and insisting that they sell you a car with wooden wheels. Forget this silly notion. Iron sights are more likely to break and fail if the rifle is dropped onto a rock than modern optics. I've been hunting and shooting for close to 50 years and in some pretty harsh conditions. I've dropped a few rifles and fallen down some hills while carrying them. I've never once had a scope fail me. I've had iron sights do so 2-3 times.
 
Any input and opinions are appreciated. I would like to achieve about 1/3MOA with handloads, which i think is out of the realm of reality for milsurps. With my two requirements my choices are very limited. I set a budget of $700 on the rifle because i would like to keep thr total package at $1000, spending $300-$400 on the scope
Click to expand...

Ruger American Predator in 6.5 Creedmoor, under 400 dollars at budsgunshop right now.

Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50, 420 dollars off of amazon right now.

B-Square Sport utility rings, 12 bucks off amazon.

That is a total (without shipping), of 832 dollars for a scoped rifle package that can shoot long range pretty easily, although the low end magnification is a bit on the high side for hunting.

That leaves you 168 dollars for iron sight purchase and install. I've not had a gunsmith ever charge more than that for standard Patridge style barrel mounted sights.

I hope this advice is helpful.

Jimro
 
I'm with Jimro on the Ruger American Predator in 6.5 CM only I put a Vortex Crossfire II 6X18, $220 at MidwayUSA. Add a sling and you're still under $700.

Reloading components for the 6.5 CM are everywhere now days.

That set up would serve you well in your hunting and 1000 yard shooting.

I thing you're a bit off on you need for irons. Todays scopes and mounts, they'll hold up as well as your iron sights.

I've been around a long time and I'm not easy on rifles, but I've never had a scope let me down.

Back in the 70s I carried a Remington 700 in 223 as a LE Sniper rifle. I even took it to National Guard drills, wanting to put this rifle through some rigorous test.

I was in an Airborne unit and made several jumps with that rifle strapped to my side and it never lost its zero.

That was in the 70-80s, todays scopes are a lot better and more rugged.

But if that bothers you, you can put iron sights on any rifle including the Ruger American.
 
I concur with Jimro and Kraigwy, the 6.5 is a good round too. I just suggest one of the usual .30 cal's but the 6.5 is a good round. But, the consensus is to go with a NEW Ruger rifle....and it is no accident that we all suggest it because it is just as accurate, if not more accurate, than ANY used remmington 700. The furniture on the Ruger American isn't as pretty as some of the high end rifles, but the main components like barrel, trigger, bolt, and mag are excellent and like we said, all under $500 and for some models closer to the $400 mark.

As for scopes, I would still go with the Nikon Monarch or Leupold VX-R which with rings maxes out your budget ($500 each), but you can assemble the other things like slings, bipods, etc some other day. And a cheap sling and bipod can be had for a total of $40.
 
If you were absolutely insistent about a rifle meeting your preferred requirements, I would take a look at the CZ 557 Carbine.

The CZ 550 has left many people praising its accuracy. I have not kept up on the 557 in those terms, however, it has irons, is chambered in 6.5x55 swede and I think would certainly be up to the task. It does not have a bull barrel but I am not sure how many rounds you put down range in any particular time frame in long range competition.

Buds has it in stock for $642. I am not sure it is a better option than others have suggested but it does match your criteria.

Maybe that is exactly what you are looking for. As others have said, a hunting rifle and a competition rifle generally have countering features. Weight being the biggest one.
 
A Ruger American is an entry level hunting rifle. Isn't really suitable for long range target shooting.
"...would like to achieve about 1/3MOA with handloads..." 1/3 MOA is .3" at 100 yards. Not likely to happen with an entry level hunting rifle. Barrels aren't up to it. That level of accuracy isn't necessary for a hunting rifle or a long range target rifle. The bull at 1,000 yards is 24" diameter(looks a lot smaller) and the kill zone on a deer is about 9" x 9". A consistent 3" is good enough for deer.
Under $700 pretty much rules out any kind of target rifle unless you buy used. Read the rules for whatever course of fire your pop's shooting first. Not all of 'em allow any kind of magnum. You really do not want to shoot a hunting rifle weight magnum all day anyway.
"...older Remington 700s on GunBroker..." Very hard to damage one, but you need to look at the chambering. And where the thing is located. Shipping to an FFL, etc. can cost.
The iron sights on commercial hunting rifles, if there are any, are crappy. Most commercial hunting rifles are D&T'd for scopes, but not irons. And if you drop the thing from a deer stand, the irons'll be damaged too.
 
Looking on my local armslist there are several older 700's with iron sights available. Averaging $500. I also saw some winchester model 70's averaging higher. Usually seller was asking $700 or more.

The iron sights are a must, so it looks like my choices so far are the Remington 700 (30-06, .270, 7mm mag), Winchester model 70 (30-06, .270, 7mm magnum, .264 winchester), and the CZ rifle in 6.5x55.

I prefer a bigger bore, but i know most of the available bullets for the smaller calibers have higher ballistic coefficients and will be easier to shoot accurately at longer ranges.

My Dad hasnt even shot out to 1000yds yet, he is still doing load development and usually shoots at his competitions 300-600yds, most of the time trying to ring steel at various ranges in a tighr time frame. Sometimes the target is hidden behind a pallet. Other times he shoots for group size at certain ranges.

I do not have nearly the money saved up for this tifle and scope, so it will probably have to wait until tax time or unless i get a nice side job before then.

I really like the .270 cartridge, but if i get something in 6.5/.264 it will save me and my dad some money, as we would be able to share bullets (possibly)
 
The CZ 557 that I entered into the mix is also chambered in .270.

Edit: I only threw in the 6.5x55 due to your dad handloading a different 6.5 already.
 
Add my vote to the 6.5 Ruger American Predator. I'd put (I did on my .243Win) a better optic on it than they suggest, but the rifle is capable, and a lot more accurate than T, O'Heir will admit. :)
 
If you go to Dicks Sporting Goods, they carry the Savage VT line (made especially for Dicks, and Field and Stream, which is owned by Dick's).

Heavy barrel usually 24" for about $500.

I would definitely get a Vortex Viper if I could afford one!!
 
The Savage VT with a 24" barrel in either 308 or 223 will serve as a 1000 yard rifle.

The 223 version comes with a 1:9 twist, so that limits some of the heavy for caliber bullets, but a 75gr Amax will sometimes shoot ok with a 1:9, sometimes. But a 223 is going to give you the problem of diminishing returns, and make it hard to keep any bullet supersonic past 900 yards. You would have to push a 75gr Amax to 2,950 fps at the muzzle to keep supersonic at 1k, and that's a load well beyond SAAMI spec.

The 308 version is a better option, with either a 155gr Palma bullet, Berger 168 Hybrid, Sierra 175 SMK, or Hornady 178 Amax known to have solid 1k performance.

But still, the 6.5 Creedmoor, or 260 Rem, or even 6.5x55, are going to give you much better ballistics for 1k shooting. They can all launch a 140gr match bullet that is going to beat the pants off of anything but a magnum chambering. But, it won't beat up your shoulder in the process, which is something I rather value in target shooting.

Jimro
 
Jimro the 75 grain A-max will not shoot well in the 1x9 savage but the hornady 75 grain BTHP which is a little shorter made for the AR 15 tiny mag will work well. I just tried it
 
The 75gr Amax is always "iffy" on a 1:9 twist, some folks have barrels that will shoot it, and others don't. It calculates into the potentially unstable range where it could go either way. I'm not surprised that the 75gr BTHP worked, it calculates out to "stable" even with modest velocities with a 9" twist, and would take a wonky barrel to make it unstable.

Those Hornady match bullets seem to shoot ok through the transonic zone, but still, a 223 isn't the best option for competing at 1k if you have other options.

Jimro
 
Insisting on iron sights today is like going into a car dealer and insisting that they sell you a car with wooden wheels. Forget this silly notion. Iron sights are more likely to break and fail if the rifle is dropped onto a rock than modern optics.
Click to expand...
Not true. A good set of irons will last indefinitely and are extremely durable.

OP, build your rifle how you want it. I'm a fan of irons too. If you buy a Savage, they will install irons on it for you if you send It to them for about a hundred bucks if I'm not mistaken.

I'd go .30 Cal because it's .30 Cal.
 
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