Real world .223 barrel length advice required...

R

RigidCollision

Inactive
Hi guys,
I am putting together a .223 bolt gun using a Howa 1500.
The rifle is predominantly going to be used for target use, initially at 100 - 200 yards with some seriously long range experimentation on the cards. My real buzz is tack driving that target consistently as far away as my skills and my equipment will allow. I will have the occasional fox to despatch for local landowners and .223 seems like a good choice as it has low recoil, is relatively cheap to run and allows for some longer range training. I have had my shoulder rebuilt twice and find recoil tires me out quickly. Most of my shooting is prone.

I have a three way dilemma: 20" varmint barrel, 24" varmint barrel or a 20" fluted varmint. All come with a 1:9 twist. Each has its own virtues, fluted is lighter, heavy is good for felt recoil and accuracy.

I know all the science behind fluting and understand that the cooling advantages are actually negligible in the real world and it renders the barrel less stiff etc... A heavy, short barrel may be stiffer and have better accuracy... A longer heavier barrel may help with felt recoil.

So my question is this: What are the real world differences in the choice I am deliberating over and what would your recommendations be based on your experience?

Any views would be greatly appreciated.

King regards
 
I have HOWA factory rifles in both sporter and heavy barreled .223 (both 24"). There is virtually no recoil from a HB .223 IMHO but I don't notice the .223 recoil in anything. I've fired 10 shot strings with the HB w/o noticeable heating. That would be nice for a range rifle.
If I was choosing for your purposes, I'd be looking at a fluted 24" HB. That will allow somewhat higher velocities to help stabilize the heavier bullets(also puts the 40 grain V-Max Fiocchi ammo into the WOW category).
 
I have a heavy barrel 20 inch 1in9 twist Savage model 10 in 223 caliber, it's one of my favorite rifles.
As for now my handloads I'm using, through my Chrono are moving just a little over 3300 fps and they group 5/16 of an inch at 100 yards.

Last Saturday I was shooting Dasani water bottles re-filled with tap water placed at 270 yards, using the back of my truck as a rest I had no trouble making water explosions out of them.
Because of neck problems I can't shoot off of a bench so I now shoot standing up and use the back of my truck, works well for me.

I though about re-barreling to a longer barrel or buying a longer barrel rifle however after doing a lot of research the consensus seems to be that a 20 inch barrel is all one needs with the 223.
There's really not much recoil with this rifle, the heavy barrel helps absorb that, I see my hits through my scope.

I've killed a lot coyotes with this rifle, it's one that I use often.
I don't believe I would want the additional weight of a longer barrel if I had to pack the rifle very far, for just target shooting the longer barrel may be fine.

Good luck with your rifle build.

Best Regards
Bob Hunter
 
The primary advantage of fluting is to reduce weight by a few oz without having quite as much effect on stiffness and accuracy. It is a compromise that will allow most of the advantages of a heavy bull barrel, but with weight closer to a sporter weight barrel.

If weight is a concern I like them. If you're looking to shave 1/4 lb from the rifles weight I think it is a better option than going with a pencil thin barrel. If squeezing the last .1 MOA out of the rifle is more important then an unfluted heavy barrel will be more likely to get you there.

Recoil from a 223 in a heavy barreled bolt rifle is a non issue regardless of which you choose.

The 24" barrel will give you 50-75 fps more speed over the 20" barrel, maybe less. 223 doesn't need much more than about 20" to be effective.
 
If you want to go long range, from the choices stated, I'd go with the 24" varmint barrel. Lighter weight, such as gained by fluting, is NOT a help for longer range, nor for precision shooting at ANY range. The 24" tube will help with maintaining velocity further out, as well.

Accuracy will not necessarily depend on barrel length. A 20" tube can often be more accurate than a longer barrel, but loses velocity at long range.

Of course, for practical reasons, the .223 isn't the best choice for more than 600 yards anyway. So TRUE long range will not be the best use for the rifle in question, with any of the barrels mentioned.
 
I don't consider recoil to be a factor, especially with a varmint-class barrel.
Whether or not the weight might give your shoulder some trouble is a good question, though. My father has had 3-4 operations on his left shoulder, and he has a very difficult time carrying a rifle (even with a sling) for more than 10-15 minutes. Make him haul a 8-10 lb rifle around during a big game hunt, and he can't lift the rifle to actually shoot it, by lunch time. Put his 12 lb .416 Rigby or 11 lb .450 Nitro in his hands, and he's done before he gets out of camp.


For a "walking varminter" I would be looking at 20" or shorter.

For more of a "carry it when I have to, but generally only from the truck to the bench"-type rifle, anything is fair game.

You just have to find the right balance of velocity vs weight for your own uses. That's pretty much what this comes down to, for me.

A 20" barrel should provide muzzle velocities around 3,150 fps for 50-55 gr bullets and 2,800-2,900 fps for 69 gr bullets.

If you add another four inches, to get to the 24" mark, the velocities should increase by about 105-125 fps.
Is the extra weight worth 115 fps?
At longer range, it may come in handy. Or maybe not. The difference in bullet drop (69 gr SMK) at 1,000 yards is about 40 inches (~560" vs ~600"). ...But even a 77 gr SMK will go trans-sonic around 750-800 yards. And, at that point, all bets are off.
Jumping to 90 gr SMKs, muzzle velocity drops to around 2,600 fps in a 24" tube, bullet drop is reduced to ~420", and the bullet doesn't go trans-sonic until it's nearly at the target (950-1,000 yards)

But if you aren't shooting farther than 400-600 yards, the 69 gr SMKs or a shorter barrel will be just fine.
 
Just for clarification, are you having a HOWA action fitted with your choice of barrels or using a factory barreled action?
 
I just got a Ruger American rifle in .223, weight is not quite 6 1/2#, and the 3x9x40 scope I'm going with is under a pound, so I'm looking at ~7.5# for a walking carry gun for coyotes & ghogs. Specs say its got a 1/8 twist, so I'm thinking I can play around with bullet weights to see what it likes, but at the same time the opportunity to take it to the range for some LR testing and play time if it likes the heavier bullets. I would really like it if it will shoot the light and heavy weights equally well, but I'm not banking on that.

I've got a Rem700 varmit rig at 10+#, and was not the least bit interested in lugging that one around the farms and WMA's.
 
For what your looking to do I would go with the 24" varmint barrel you listed, I was in a simular position with an AR build and am going with the same 24" barrel.
 
Unless you just want the extra weight and length of a 24"-26" barrel,an 18" or 20" barrel is all you really need.
I have a Savage 12 FLVSS with a heavy fluted 26" factory barrel,a Rock River AR-15 with a heavy 20" barrel,and two AR-15's that I built with 18" SPR contour barrels. Other than the extra length and weight,the only thing you gain is velocity. The heavy barrels are easier to shoot more accurately for most shooters.
 
Txhillbilly is right. A heavy barreled rifle is easier to shoot than a skinny barreled version. That's my experience. And if the OP wants to shoot real long range, a faster twist would be needed for the heavier bullets.

Just for info, my 1 in 9 barrel works great for bullets 40 grains to 69 grains.
 
My personal preference for a target rifle would be the 24" heavy barrel option although any of the three should work just fine.

A longer barrel gives you the option of cutting it back and re-chambering later on to get some more barrel life if you want to go that route.

Jimro
 
carry

If you have to carry your new varminter much farther than from the truck to the bench, you will quickly appreciate a lighter rifle, especially if you have a shoulder issue.

I do not see .223 recoil as a problem, even in a lightweight sporter (such as the Rem Model 7 or a Mini-Mauser), much less anything in the varmint barrel class as you describe. From your choices, I'd opt for the 20" fluted.

For me, the .223 fills the role of a "walking varminter" perfectly, and the heavy-bull barrel rigs are for bigger cartridges like the 22-250, or the .220 Swift.
Your choice though, so enjoy.
 
A 20" barrel should provide muzzle velocities around 3,150 fps for 50-55 gr bullets and 2,800-2,900 fps for 69 gr bullets.

If you add another four inches, to get to the 24" mark, the velocities should increase by about 105-125 fps.
Is the extra weight worth 115 fps?
Click to expand...

Not sure about velocities in a bolt gun but in my Stag Model 6h which has a 24" heavy barrel I consistently get 3100 fps with 69gn Sierra HPBT bullets and Ramshot Tac powder. Also my load is below max by a few tenth's of a grain.
 
Hi guys,
Sorry for going quiet, just had surgery on my knee, only just got back from hospital.

Having read through your advice I have ordered the following:

Howa 1500 1:9 24" Heavy Varminter, MDT HS3 Stock. I already have some Burris signature mounts and a Weaver V24 scope...

I am going to do a full write up of the build including stats, torque settings, observations, barrel break-in and tests with factory ammo over varying ranges.

Watch this space
 
I have 16,20 and a 24". If you are going to be shooting at longer ranges the 24 should give you higher velocity. I bought it for hunting coyotes.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top