RCBS PRecission Mic

This is the sort of thing which can take someone who is OCD right over the edge.
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it is easy to get lost in the weeds of this stuff. I got bit by the OCD bug last summer and the more I experimented the more I realized that the answer for me is finding to getting tight groups just meant finding the right powder and load and good basic case prep

This morning I found a .3 wide node for my .223 that produced consistent .3 and .4 groups with cheap GFL(Fiocchi) brass that is on its 5th reload and had no more case prep than the initial trim a quick chamfer on the inside of the neck, cleaned and a quick trip through the annealer. It was shot at SAAMI magazine length. To heck with chasing load lengths , I am just going to skip to load and shoot it.
 
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Hounddawg, that was pretty much my conclusion. :) My outdoor range is a place called Kelbly's Shooting Range where I have been shooting at least the last 25 years. The range is home to the annual Super Shoot in the bench rest community which is a pretty cool event. These are the 100 and 200 yard guys. While I am not a true bench rest type I get to meet some interesting people out there all of whom are quick and willing to share their thoughts, formulas and about anything accuracy related.

Heck, anymore beyond bullet, case and charge the biggest thing effecting my groups is my 68 year old body. My case prep is pretty basic also. Most of the tools and gauging I have are a result of having owned a small brick and mortar gun shop back in the early and mid 90s. When my wife and I sold the business the buyer could not afford most of our inventory. Reloading supplies was a niche so I ended up with a small mountain of stuff. Some we sold off at gun shows and the remainder I kept. :)

Ron
 
@Yosemete - all three of my rifles are Savages or at least that is what they started life as. 1 model 12 FTR and 1 model 10 FP and a pawn shop Stevens 200 with a cracked stock.

@ Reloadron - there is still a lot of things I learned that I still think makes a difference. Making sure primers are seated correctly and bullet runout come to mind. But a lot are just time wasters
 
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Since I got my gun 32 years ago everyone always told me how Savages are very accurate. It shot ok early on but never any better than about 2 MOA. Then it got bigger. I have not been reloading very long but getting this old gun to group tight now after all this time is very rewarding.

About 3 years ago I discovered the barrel was bumping the stock. I sanded it out and it warped again this fall when it got really wet hunting and I sanded it out again. I had it at about .75 MOA after I bought some Nosler brass.

After hunting season I came to this site with my poochy primers and the concave bolt face. Since that thread I have learned a lot! While I regret giving my money to the gunsmith I did it turned into a good learning experience. I know not which changes and details made how much difference in many instances. I know that since I got anal with brass preparations finding sweet spots became easier. But there were so many improvements in my ways that happened in a short time that it's really hard to know which ones mattered most.

I don't have much money to buy supplies so if it takes me longer to reload because I'm being a perfectionist that's ok. My last sweet spot was the biggest improvement over my other groups than any I have shot. It was the seating depth, powder charge, brass consistency, bullet consistency, action screw tension and probably less headspace and a new spring. I will continue to add improvements as I learn them. Some day I will get a gun that will appreciate these skills more noticeably.
 
Savage has that floating bolt face helps in bullet run-out. Once you have your case head space , I seat the unprimed case with the bullet I'm shooting , seat it long test in chamber bolt won't close the slowly lower until you feel a slight resistance , that's zero go another .001 bolt should close with no resistance. Keep your zero measurement so you can jump or jam your bullets. Even with a new lot of the same bullet you still have to test again. Hope I Helped .

Chris
 
How does the floating bolt face help with bullet run-out. I'm not sure what you are talking about. I also do not trust the feel as much as a measurement i do strip down the bolt but using feel gives me +or- .001" for shoulder adjustments.
 
Lee collet neck die is a inexpensive fix for bullet runout. Even when I full length resize I will run them through a Lee before I seat bullets.

Not sure what a floating bolt head does for runout but it does make sure the bolt lines up perpendicular to the chamber so truing the bolt is unnecessary
 
Not sure what a floating bolt head does for runout but it does make sure the bolt lines up perpendicular to the chamber so truing the bolt is unnecessary
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On that thought. There is a bit of spring tension on the bolt head by the friction washer that might throw off how much the bullet is onto the lands. Also truing of the bolt might not be necessary but lug to receiver face lapping must be done precisely.
 
the Savage floating bolt head is designed to allow a few thousandths of an inch of movement using that belleville spring you mentioned. Lapping a Savage bolt head is unnecessary. The floating design allows for a perfect fit similar to a custom action or a trued Mauser or Remington
 
Lapping a Savage bolt head is unnecessary. The floating design allows for a perfect fit similar to a custom action or a trued Mauser or Remington
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I disagree with this. My recent discovery is that all of the rounds fired through my Savage have case heads that are not square to the case itself. I found this a while back when measuring lengths... As I would turn the case it would measure longer or shorter in length by as much as .003".

Even though the new bolt head was lapped to the receiver face it was never squared up to the bore. I was just closing the bolt on some rounds with some feel still on them after sizing. If I turn the case and close the bolt I get around to a spot where there is more clearance. My receiver face or my lugs or both are not square to the center of the bore. :( I think that this is most likely an issue that has been the reason for the poor accuracy of this gun. When I have shot new brass it has shot better. The fired brass has been shaped to the crooked face of the bolt. The floating design only allows for a perfect fit if the receiver face is perfect. I either need to live with it or will have to have a gunsmith true up the receiver and then the lugs to correct it. Not very happy at the moment.
 
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The floating bolt fact alignes the bolt face to the chamber is a good feature. As long as you can strip the bolt ,I find is the most accurate way to set the case to the length an the bullet to the lands . I have a Rem.700 completely blueprinted with a M24 5R Rock Creek match barrel .I set my case headspace to .0015 - .002 an what shoots best in my barrel is a .002 jump using a Sierra 168grn.MK over 40.8 gn.of IMR 4064 F/L sized case. I shoot only 200 yards , that's the maximum distance for the ranges in my area .5 five shot groups sometimes better, if I do my part . The rifle can shoot better then me I'm sure. I'm not as steady an eyes aren't as good anymore , but still love shooting.
 
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Yosemite Steve
Only trying to help . Sorry for the confusion . Sometimes it's better keeping my comments to myself.
 
The floating bolt fact alignes to the bolt face to the chamber is a good fetcher? I can't decipher this one.
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The floating bolt face? "the chamber is a good fetcher"? or feature.

My Rock Chucker ram jumps forward when it is raised if I do not have a case in the shell holder so I would say the case is the 'aligner'. I can not get reloaders to take their hands off of the key boards so? You will have to take my word for it. If my Rock Chucker was a cam over press it would not go into a bind when the ram reached the top of it's travel.

F. Guffey
 
A floating bolt face will square itself to the chamber . On my Rem. 700 if the bolt face wasn't true or square with the chamber , when the round is fired the case head an case body would be off center .
 
Thanks Guffey. Now I don't know why I could not see that. I will stop throwing the stick now. My arm is tired and my bolt face just sits there.

You say that your Rock Chucker is not a cam over press. I am using one and do use the cam over method. Would you please elaborate on what you mean. Am I under the wrong impression here or do you have yours set up so it cannot cam over? Mine has an RV cam so it won't ping going up hills.
 
A floating bolt face will square itself to the chamber . On my Rem. 700 if the bolt face wasn't true or square with the chamber , when the round is fired the case head an case body would be off center .
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That was what the guy at the Sporting goods store had said when he sold us the gun. There was something familiar about the gunsmith who worked on my gun recently who I had problems with. I just found out he was the guy who sold us the gun 32 years ago. He knew about the floating bolt face yet he assembled the bolt head to the bolt in such a way that is was jammed together and one lug would not even touch. Still makes me grumpy. I think I got my lugs so they are holding the bolt face true now (as of last night) so hopefully I will be exploiting that feature in the future.
 
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