NOT a Bullseye. Having had a Rifle pointed at me and my kids by some nimrod using his riflescope to spot game ("I was jus' tryin' to see whut ya wuz....") I take a VERY dim view of this. You want to spot game with glass? Get a pair of Binoculars ..... and stop pointing your rifle at things you don't want to shoot.
Range of 4X fixed power scope
- Thread starter bricz75
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NOT a Bullseye. Having had a Rifle pointed at me and my kids by some nimrod using his riflescope to spot game ("I was jus' tryin' to see whut ya wuz....") I take a VERY dim view of this. You want to spot game with glass? Get a pair of Binoculars ..... and stop pointing your rifle at things you don't want to shoot.
stagpanther
New member
I did not take the original post to mean literally glassing for game--though maybe that's what the original poster meant.
A good 3 or 4x fixed that isn't overly bulky should allow you to view the target area with both eyes open while viewing through the scope--and hence beyond the scope's objective's FV--much like a red-dot.
Greater field of view--greater awareness of both game and other undesirable targets wandering into your targeting IMO.
I recently shot these 300 yard groups, at CMP Talladega, with a pre WW2 M70 and a vintage El Paso Weaver 4X scope. I have to quarter the large black circle target with my cross hairs. The bull is designed for iron sights and there are no internal features to aim at. But, given the limitations, if you can see what you are aiming at, you can hit it.
I have shot out to 1000 yards with a 6X target scope. I could see the target rings, not well, I could see the spotting disc and hold off. I shot a score in the 190's that day with a rifle with a 6X scope and 308 Win.
At long range matches I have noticed a lot of crossfires due to high power scopes. Shooters can't tell what target they are on and will random hit one, sometimes three targets over. While seeing better is always good, high magnification has its trade off's. Go out to the range with a zoom spotting scope. At what setting do you see the bullet holes at, lets say, 200 yards? Bullet holes are usually seen with lower zoom settings, at higher settings, mirage washes things out.
Just after WW2 the 4X was the standard and hunters did well with the things. Then the 3X by 9x scopes became affordable and lots of game was taken. Don't be deceived into thinking that high magnification somehow eliminates the need for marksmanship skills. If someone can't hit an animal with a 4X scope, maybe they should not be using a 12X, or any scope at all.
I have shot out to 1000 yards with a 6X target scope. I could see the target rings, not well, I could see the spotting disc and hold off. I shot a score in the 190's that day with a rifle with a 6X scope and 308 Win.
At long range matches I have noticed a lot of crossfires due to high power scopes. Shooters can't tell what target they are on and will random hit one, sometimes three targets over. While seeing better is always good, high magnification has its trade off's. Go out to the range with a zoom spotting scope. At what setting do you see the bullet holes at, lets say, 200 yards? Bullet holes are usually seen with lower zoom settings, at higher settings, mirage washes things out.
Just after WW2 the 4X was the standard and hunters did well with the things. Then the 3X by 9x scopes became affordable and lots of game was taken. Don't be deceived into thinking that high magnification somehow eliminates the need for marksmanship skills. If someone can't hit an animal with a 4X scope, maybe they should not be using a 12X, or any scope at all.
black mamba
New member
For any distance much past 75 yds. I like magnification. 3-12x scopes are very versatile, from up close to very far away (as far as I'll shoot, anyway). For dangerous game, the two most important factors are field of view and eye relief. My Nikon Slugmaster scope is 1½-5x, has huge field of view up close on the low magnification, and a full 5 inches of eye relief. Very comforting on a 458 Win Mag. But if your game is standing broadside at 100 yds, then you still have 5 power to make a precise shot.
I think all variables should be carried on the lowest power. If the game is far off, you'll have time to zoom in, but if they jump up close to you, you won't have time to power down.
I think all variables should be carried on the lowest power. If the game is far off, you'll have time to zoom in, but if they jump up close to you, you won't have time to power down.
Deaf Smith
New member
Scope with 4x works fine. Binoculars, on the other hand, need to be much higher power. Use the binoculars to find the game, identify if they are legal, and anything else out there, then the 4x to get the critter.
Deaf
Deaf
Distance has nothing to do with the magnification.
1903A4's and M1 C's and D's used a 2.5X scope. The USMC used a Lyman 5A 5x scope. And later the 8X Unertl.
"...a scope with less power..." Less magnification is good with shotguns and heavy recoiling rifles like .458 Win.
Higher magnification comes with a big handicap in the form of a smaller field of view. And not being able to take close range hunting shots due to the blurring. Variables come with the handicap of weight(a Bushnell 3-12 x 40 scope weighs 21.3 ounces.) and a smaller field of view. Most hunters with variables put the thing on about 4x or so and leave it there. You do not have time to fiddle with a scope when hunting deer sized game.
"...An old rule of thumb is..." Not true. Carlos Hathcock put a 10X Unertl on an M2 BMG, but used a regular 8x on his M70.
1903A4's and M1 C's and D's used a 2.5X scope. The USMC used a Lyman 5A 5x scope. And later the 8X Unertl.
"...a scope with less power..." Less magnification is good with shotguns and heavy recoiling rifles like .458 Win.
Higher magnification comes with a big handicap in the form of a smaller field of view. And not being able to take close range hunting shots due to the blurring. Variables come with the handicap of weight(a Bushnell 3-12 x 40 scope weighs 21.3 ounces.) and a smaller field of view. Most hunters with variables put the thing on about 4x or so and leave it there. You do not have time to fiddle with a scope when hunting deer sized game.
"...An old rule of thumb is..." Not true. Carlos Hathcock put a 10X Unertl on an M2 BMG, but used a regular 8x on his M70.
Depends upon the situation.... I keep my 3x9 on 3x most of the time, in case a deer comes up out of the creek next to the blind- then time is critical ..... but when an animal wanders out on the hay field hundreds of yards distant and I decide to take it , I have plenty of time to turn the power up, take several range readings, adjust the sticks, check wind, get a perfect sight picture, get settled, control my breathing, note the rise and fall of the crosshairs from my pulse, disengage the safety, reach natural pause between breaths and squeeeeeeeeeeeze.......
stagpanther
New member
You forgot "squirrel starts chirping" between breaths and squeeeeeeze.
Back before I started using the ground blind, squirrels used the raise hell when they saw us..... deer out on the hay field would sometimes stop and look our way when that happened ..... Never had one chirp when I had a deer close in, that I recall .... of course there could be a flock of lovesick peacocks going off ....if a deer was in close, I'd not notice them.....
.... but since I started using the ground blind, we've been pretty invisible to the squirrels, crows, nuthatches, woodpeckers and chickadees ..... even had a flock of turkeys wander by ....
Well, when I first started shooting ground squirrels in CA back in 1978, I mounted a Weaver K4 on my 22-250 and shot them all the way out to 450-ish yards. So, a few things to remember are
* get a scope with fine crosshairs, not a heavy duplex reticle
* get a scope that focuses sharp, not kinda sorta.
* learn the trajectory of your rifle by shooting at specific yardages, then on animals at random ranges
* shoot the same bullet and load for everything.
Great thread.
I recently picked up a BAS - Big A$$ Scope - https://www.natchezss.com/nikon-monarch-5-rifle-scope-5-25x50mm-ed-sf-advanced-bdc.html
This new-addition-scope is for my precision 223 bolt action rifle. Varminting is a bit different than big game. I like to know what eyelash I'm shooting. One of the perks of this scope is the on-line Spot On ballistics calculator. For every scope Nikon makes the ballistics calculator will tell you holdover for the reticle you have.
I discovered Nikon has an ~ equivalent model scope for every different manufacture scope I have on my hunting rifles that can be run through the Nikon ballistic calculator. You need to know a bit about the specific load you are shooting but the calculator can be applied to most any scope.
Quality scopes I have on several different center-fire rifles include - Fixed 6X, 2.5-8 variable, 3-10 variable, 4.5-14 variable, 2-7 variable, and the 5-25 variable. Some have ballistic drop compensating reticles, others do not. The Fixed does not so the only reference besides the cross is the top of the post on the vertical crosshair. Still, it can be correlated to a Nikon scope of similar features. Range trips with this information have been quite telling.
Years ago I gave my Son-In-Law a Marlin Lever Action with a fixed 4X scope. Don't miss the gun but sure miss the scope as I thought it about the perfect complement for a hunting rifle.
Also of note is the fact any big game I shoot at in the field is a lot larger than the 3" Shoot-N-See range target. High magnification at the range, low magnification in the field. Not much difference in the sight picture.
I recently picked up a BAS - Big A$$ Scope - https://www.natchezss.com/nikon-monarch-5-rifle-scope-5-25x50mm-ed-sf-advanced-bdc.html
This new-addition-scope is for my precision 223 bolt action rifle. Varminting is a bit different than big game. I like to know what eyelash I'm shooting. One of the perks of this scope is the on-line Spot On ballistics calculator. For every scope Nikon makes the ballistics calculator will tell you holdover for the reticle you have.
I discovered Nikon has an ~ equivalent model scope for every different manufacture scope I have on my hunting rifles that can be run through the Nikon ballistic calculator. You need to know a bit about the specific load you are shooting but the calculator can be applied to most any scope.
Quality scopes I have on several different center-fire rifles include - Fixed 6X, 2.5-8 variable, 3-10 variable, 4.5-14 variable, 2-7 variable, and the 5-25 variable. Some have ballistic drop compensating reticles, others do not. The Fixed does not so the only reference besides the cross is the top of the post on the vertical crosshair. Still, it can be correlated to a Nikon scope of similar features. Range trips with this information have been quite telling.
Years ago I gave my Son-In-Law a Marlin Lever Action with a fixed 4X scope. Don't miss the gun but sure miss the scope as I thought it about the perfect complement for a hunting rifle.
Also of note is the fact any big game I shoot at in the field is a lot larger than the 3" Shoot-N-See range target. High magnification at the range, low magnification in the field. Not much difference in the sight picture.