Question Posed To Me About Gun Control

M

Mosin-Marauder

New member
My English teacher is kind of an anti gun liberal, I've found out, pretty cool teacher nonetheless. We were talking about argumentative writing today, and the topic of Gun Control came up, and she said "What opinion would a prisoner have of gun control, compared to that of a gun owner or a gun store owner?" I hated it, but I drew a blank, I don't really understand what the opinion of a criminal has to do with anything. So I thought I would seek the help of my elders, hahaha. It's probably stupid of me to ask but i thought you guys could help me understand the question a bit better. Sorry for asking, thanks in advance.
 
Like most things, it depends.

If that criminal is locked up on gun charges that wouldn't have been a law without "gun control" then I'm sure he hates it.

If that criminal made his living preying on defenseless people in areas he knew to be "gun-free zones" then I'm sure he hoped for more gun control laws and hoped everyone followed them. Unarmed people were good for his business.

"Gun owner" is entirely too diverse of a population to say what they think. You have trap shooters that have no problem with banning ARs. You have hunters that have no problem with banning handguns. And of course you have other gun owners that reject anything that even rhymes with gun control.

Same with the gunshop owner. His personal feelings are not necessarily predictable simply because he owns a gun shop. He might see nothing wrong with banning private sales - that might increase his revenue. He might sell 12 gauges and 30-06s to hunters and not understand the milsurp crowd. Or he might be like the aforementioned gun owner and hate any governmental involvement in his fundamental rights.

It just depends. Good luck with your teacher. Don't walk into a trap or get emotional.
 
I try not to get passionate with my arguments unless they go on for a really long time. Thank you for your help, I will keep these things in mind.
 
There supposedly was a study that asked criminals what they feared most: other criminals, police or armed home owners.

The answer was "armed homeowners". The logic goes that police will usually give you a warning and chance to surrender. Criminals know that other criminals don't have anything to steal. Homeowners will shoot you without warning.

If that is true, (I've never seen a link to an actual study like that) then the criminal would probably be in favor of more gun control.

I'm in graduate school right now and I have to walk this sort of line a lot. I try to pick questions to respond to that aren't so loaded with emotion.
 
Maybe your reply should be that she needs to ask a prisoner if she wants a good answer. We can make up our own biased opinions of what their opinion should be. That's a recipe for failure.
 
"What opinion would a prisoner have of gun control, compared to that of a gun owner or a gun store owner?"
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My response would be to inform the teacher that he's starting with a faulty premise. "Gun owner" covers an immensely wide and diverse portion of the American population. To assume we all think in lockstep (or even remotely agree on anything) is to resort to stereotypes.

It's hard to give fruitful answers if the question is flawed.
 
"prisoner" isn't exactly a narrow category, either.

AND, when taking into account what "prisoners" may feel about things, also take into account that they may lie, simply because they can.

After all, what are you going to do, put them in prison???
:rolleyes:

You might take the approach that the "prisoner" is the thief, robber, rapist, murderer, who does what they want to do, no matter the law, simply because they can, and they want to.

And the "gun owner" is the one who doesn't want them to make him their next helpless victim.

The Predator does not think their prey has the right to anything but to be their prey. IF they think of it at all.

Self defense is the fundamental natural right. Animals have teeth, claws, hooves and horns. fleet of foot, or flight, plants have thorns, poisons, and other combinations of defense mechanisms.

Ask the Lion's opinion of the Cape Buffalo's horns, then ask the Buffalo. Bet you get two widely different opinions.
:D
 
https://www.learnaboutguns.com/2009/02/04/what-criminals-really-fear/

The 1986 study is there. Criminals inherently fear less than the rest of us or they wouldn't be out taking the risks they take. An armed citizen carries every day., The felon only carries at work so to speak.

In the end, I agree with you, who cares what the criminal thinks. In the end it is a matter of being a free person with the right and means to personal protection. The most gun free place is a prision. I don't think even the criminals aspire to that degree of "safety."
 
I think the one main thing to NEVER lose sight of when discussing gun control (no matter where on the spectrum the other participant sits) is that gun control only ever affects the good people who follow laws.

Gun control advocates seem to live in a fantasy world where they make a law or rule and expect that psychopaths, criminals and murderers might actually somehow alter their evildoings because of (yet another) law that prohibits them.

As if somehow... it wasn't already very much against the law to rob, rape, murder and cause complete mayhem.
 
Confused priorities !!!

Whenever I see folks talking about gun control, their lack of common sense always focusses to "The-Gun". There are three elements to these shooting scenarios.

The Victim;
In most cases, didn't ask to be shot. So it might be a great idea if he is allotted self protection. .... ;)

The Gun;
Does not have any reasoning powers or loyalties. Just a simple tool waiting to be used. ..... :rolleyes:

The Shooter;
Has full control and decides when and how he will use that tool. It's not surprising that most of these lost souls have one thing in common and that is mental issues that keep being ignored. We all know at least one person that is close to the edge and that is why I say my morning and evening prayers.

Keep your 9mm handy, say your prayers and;
Be Safe !!!
 
"My English teacher is kind of an anti gun liberal, I've found out, pretty cool teacher nonetheless."


Beware of cool people like that - they are the ones that often want to take away your firearms, and they vote accordingly.
 
Mosin-Marauder said:
...I've found out, pretty cool teacher nonetheless. We were talking about argumentative writing today, and the topic of Gun Control came up, and she said "What opinion would a prisoner have of gun control, compared to that of a gun owner or a gun store owner?"...
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We actually have some fairly decent evidence that criminals are most likely to favor gun control. Follow this link posted by Jeffm004 in post 9:
Professors James D. Wright and Peter Rossi surveyed 2,000 felons incarcerated in state prisons across the United States. Wright and Rossi reported that 34% of the felons said they personally had been “scared off, shot at, wounded, or captured by an armed victim”; 69% said that they knew at least one other criminal who had also; 34% said that when thinking about committing a crime they either “often” or “regularly” worried that they “[m]ight get shot at by the victim”; and 57% agreed with the statement, “Most criminals are more worried about meeting an armed victim than they are about running into the police.” (James D. Wright & Peter H. Rossi, Armed and Considered Dangerous: A Survey of Felons and Their Firearms [1986]. See Guns and Public Health: Epidemic of Violence or Pandemic of Propaganda? by Don B. Kates, et. al. Originally published as 61 Tenn. L. Rev. 513-596 [1994]).
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The whole phrase "gun-control" is absurd.

Guns are tools and in the correct hands, useful for many purposes. In the wrong or unskilled hands, that person can inflict harm. If liberals had their way, and the average citizen did not have ready access to firearms, that would do what? It would leave the Military, Law Enforcement and Criminals with the power to control the citizens. That is exactly what the founding fathers did not want to occur.

Cocaine and Meth are outlawed, however they still have a huge impact on the economy and our safety. No I am not advocating legalizing them, they have no beneficial use, but the problem is that the reaction to the "gun" is a band-aid solution at best.

The response by "zoomie" is pretty good. When considering an event, the "thought" of a liberal person is dependant on three things. Their perception of the impact of the event, their feelings about the event, the relevance of the event to himself. The "thought" of a conservative person is based on their perception of the facts of the event. Their consideration of the cause of the event. A decision regarding the benefit of the event to the general population. In order to craft a persuasive argument, you have to find those elements that can be held as true for both the liberal and the conservative. If that is not possible, then you have to be able to prove that the entire premise of the opposing argument is false.
 
The logic goes that police will usually give you a warning and chance to surrender. Criminals know that other criminals don't have anything to steal. Homeowners will shoot you without warning.
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My guess is that the perceived difference between police and homeowners was that the homeowners were considered to be more unpredictable since they weren't specifically trained to apprehend someone and because they were more likely to be acting out of fear.
 
The prisoner might be toying with the idea...that when he gets out, he might have to buy a gun on the black market; which bypasses gun control.
 
Your English teacher is getting you to think outside of the box, which is a good thing. She may be thinking outside of hers, as well.

Like us, criminals are human beings, they have families, live in homes, and want to make a living, as it were, and come home from a hard day at their chosen profession to kick back in front of the television like anyone else, to generalize broadly.

Consider that a criminal will probably be in favor of any law that increases the likelihood of his victims being unarmed and unable to prevent whatever crime he intends to commit.

Then consider along that line of logic the corollary that a criminal intent on a crime will seek a time and place most favorable to a successful outcome, in his opinion, such as a gun-free zone.

Further consider that a criminal does not obey laws, and perhaps consider how the criminal's preferences are in alignment with the anti-gun program across the spectrum of potential criminal activities, from the petty thief who doesn't want to be held at gunpoint, to the assailant who doesn't want to be shot, to the psychopath who wants to choose a location offering multiple victims and no chance of armed response from them.

Consider things such as that, then contrast the arguments made for or against gun control with what criminals want.
 
The general term "prisoner" is kind of misleading. The first response is to assume that she means the stereotypical hardened criminal who preys on others. A prisoner might also be someone who had too many DUIs, or someone who accidentally caused a death and got convicted of negligent homicide. For that matter, it could be a protester who got out of hand at an anti-gun rally! The point is that all of the categories she gave are broad, which gives you the opportunity to define them further in your writing, rather than falling back on stereotypes.

As a former English teacher, myself, I can tell you that nothing made me happier than a student whose work demonstrated critical thinking and analysis, even when that student's position was the opposite of mine. In that spirit, make sure that you are not just claiming, but demonstrating whatever positions you take in your paper, and avoid spouting rhetoric and quippy language.
 
I may be mistaken, but aren't felons prohibited from owning firearms? Will that not temper their opinion towards wanting gun control, as they have already demonstrated their will to break the law: the honest will obey the law and not own guns, while the dishonest will obtain what they want however they want.

I distrust anyone that attempts to have a "logical" discussion on gun control, as rights have been defined for us, via the 2nd amendment. Through the years a variety of "twists" have been added to that amendment, so maybe instead of adding more to the gun control idea. That teacher is using deflection (in the form of the prisoner's view) to draw the students into agreeing with her ill-conceived logic.
 
In my own simple non brilliant mind I truly believe that anti gun liberals when they talk about Control they have only one real thought in their minds, confiscation.
Talk to any real anti gun liberal, (and I have and have given it up for a lost cause) they don’t understand why someone would want much less own a gun and think that there is something wrong and in some cases evil to want and own one. Intelligent anti’s understand that they only way to remove all guns from society is first registration then comes confiscation.
Having no experience with criminals I think they would want more and very strict gun laws. It has been proven that in arias that have strong anti gun control laws, gun related crimes are much worse than those that have pro conservative gun laws.
My answer to her would be in the form of a question. “What would a person standing in their home facing a knife welding man that just broke into the house feel about gun control that kept her from owning a gun to protect herself.”
Then again that kind of question will probably fail her class.
 
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