Question for the history buffs

D

Doc Hoy

New member
Was there such a thing as a field manual for cavalry at the time when the Walker was a popular cavalry pistol?

If so, did it encourage troopers to be careful to time their shots according to the horse's gate so as not to drill the horse in the back of the head?

In another post I read that this happened to one trooper and I was surprised that it was only one. Seems like carelessness and the heat of battle might have produced more occurrences than just one.
 
I've heard only one instance of a trooper shooting his horse and I heard it was because he had a terrible temper and wasn't much of a horseman, he got so mad at the horse he deliberately shot it
 
If so, did it encourage troopers to be careful to time their shots according to the horse's gate so as not to drill the horse in the back of the head?

LOL, I could see that happening. I have heard that some of the Cavalry horses got an ear lopped off from the troopers sabre, don't know if it's true or not but I can see it happening.:eek:
 
On a somewhat related note

Can you imagine the level of discipline that the horses would have to develop to do cavalry work!?

I don't know much about horses but I think they are naturally spooky animals. I was told that is true because of the shape of their eyes.

Trying to keep even the most devoted of animals calm in the din of battle must have been a triumph.

In peacetime country living during the Civil war era, the loudest sound would have been the passing of a wagon unless one lived near a mill or a town. A battlefield must have been a terrifying place not only because of the conflict, which would not mean much to a horse, but because of the noise.
 
There are available on Google Books and perhaps elsewhere some fascinating early manuals and standing orders, including a couple about cavalry. The ones I've printed out are all British but I suspect there may be American ones. The differences between 1800 and today is in some ways amazing and in other ways, not so different at all. Did you know that in 1800 if a soldier were allowed to marry, his wife lived with him in the barracks. They got a corner of the room with a curtain strung up for some privacy. The wife was expected to carry her weight by doing things like washing and so on. She was essentially taken on strength.

Unfortunately, revolvers came later and there is little information about small arms, at least in the ones I've been studying. However, cavalry troopers spent a great deal of their time in stables taking care of their mounts. That never changed as long as there were horses in the army, any army. Supposedly, during WWI, more tonnage of animal feed was shipped to France from Great Britain than tonnage of ammunition. Even as late as WWII, it is entirely possible that more horses were in use during that war than during the Napoleonic Wars.

You don't get this impression from the movies but you can easily imagine how horses became casualities in action, they being such large targets.
 
There are literally countless stories from our history that one could post on here. One that I refer to during our classes, is the safety issues with multiple loads in a muzzleloader. After the battel of Gettisburg, they found literally thousands of M/L's that had multiple loads. Obviously in the heat of the battle, souldiers just loaded, forgot to prime, pulled the trigger and reloaded again, repeating the process, several times. I would have probably done the same thing. .... :eek:

You have literally hundreds of shooters to your right and left as well as what's going on behind your back and more guys in front of you, trying to kill you. ..... :eek:


How about some more stories ???

Be Safe !!!
 
To Blue Train

It was not uncommon for spouses to accompany some rates in the Navy on board ships in the late 1700s and early 1800s. Children born to such unions were delivered at times during gunnery practice or even during battle, the loud report of the guns hastening the event. Hence the term; "son of a gun".

Admiral Nelson, killed during the battle of Trafalgar and his remains were preserved to be carried home for burial in a barrel of spirits. The story goes that the barrel contained port wine. When HMS Victory returned to England bearing this barrel of wine with Nelson's body, the officers of Victory celebrated his memory at a party on shore during which they consumed the contents of the barrel (only the wine, of course). The tradition lives on in both the British and United States Navies, under the title of "The Dining In." Only officers attend. Ladies or guests are strictly univited as the behavior always degrades to an embarrassing state. The only beverage permitted is Port Wine. No limit is placed on the quantity.
 
I don't know but....

....In Napoleonic times, cavalry was more often used for the shock that attached to a heavy rider on a heavy horse or a long weapon like a lance used by a smaller man on a smaller horse. So shooting the horse effectively neutralized the trooper. It was pure convenience (and, of course, bad luck for the horse) that the horse made a better target than the man.

By the time of the civil war, the tactic of dismounting the cavalry and using them more like infantry was popular, so I have read. So shooting the horse may have reduced the mobility of the formation while doing little to the effectiveness of the firepower.
 
Hello, Doc Hoy, The most famous horse killer was no other than George A. Custer, who after riding out ahead and alone except for his hounds from a hunting party, he came upon a buffalo and gave chase, horse stumbled just as he was about to fire his Colt 1860 army, hitting horse in head. It's a wonder he didn't break his neck, going full tilt like that. Had to walk several miles through hostile territory, carrying saddle. Just another one of his ill thought out schemes.
 
I don't know about you guys, but it sounds to me like Doc is considering buying a horse . . . . but then, who can blame him. I'd want something to help carry the weight of his new Walker too if I were him. I just hope the SPCAA doesn't hear about it . . . . unusual cruelty . . . expecting a hoss to carry a man AND a Walker besides! :D

Actually Doc, I think you've brought up an interesting subject in regards to the horses and possible injuries. When you consider the level of noise that a battle during the Civil War produced . . . not only musket fire but artillery fire as well, I'm sure that more than one horse suffered from "shell shock" the same as men. I'm in AZ and my books are back in MI, but I do remember that there is a period photograph showing a well trained cavalry horse laying down to provide cover for its rider. Cavalry horses were trained the same as Troopers. Unfortunately, Troopers were "human" and I'm sure that more than one horse was wounded as a result of the excitement caused by battle. I can't even begin to imagine what it must have been like for a man on a horse - a man much smaller than we are today - trying to control his horse and aim and fire a pistol the size and weight of a Walker. You told me a while ago that you had to buy the .36 Remmie because you'd purchaased a .36 mold. I think you should tell your better half that now that you have the Walker, you need to get a horse to do some scientific experimentaqtion. An added plus is that you could keep her well supplied with fertilizer for her flowerbed! :D

In regards to the comments by the gentleman about Custer . . . . unfortunately for the horses AND his men . . . . his quest for glory and adventure cost a lot of men (and horses) their lives. My g-g-uncle was in the 7th Michigan - he survived Gettysburg - was taken prisoner on July 6th in pursuit of Lee's army in Maryland - imprisoned and paroled - returned to the 7th and was killed near Winchester, VA in October of 1864. He was shot in the chest and suffered for 10 days before dying. He and my g-g-aunt were married on Jan. 1, 1863 in Tecumseh, MI - they had one day together as man and wife before he left to be mustered in - she never saw him again. I had another relation who also was in the 7th Cav. but a number of years after the Civil War - he died at the Little Bighorn. I guess you could say that when it came to my family, Custer wasn't much of a good luck charm. An interesting man to study though, as is his brotheer, Tom. :)



















a
 
I read that during the assault on Aqaba Lawrence of Arabia accidentally shot his camel.
I saw a picture of a mid to late 19th Century British cavalryman taking cover behind his prone horse, the caption mentioned that a big part of the training
was getting horses used to gunfire and I suspect a horse that was too skittish
and who could not be accustomed to loud noises would be relegated to wagon only use.
 
Good coupla posts here.

Thanks for the info guys. I did a little surfing and found a 1938 version of a U.S. Army field manual that spoke about horses in cavalry units. A 1943 version spoke only of vehicles in the cavalry.
 
I have or used to have a few books about cavalry published by the Military Service Publishing Company that were quite thorough.

Cavalry changed a lot over the years and, except in the US, came in a big variety. Some cavalry were dragoons, who in theory dismounted to fight. Cavalry who fought from horseback were call "horse." Infantry was called "foot." The various kinds of light cavalry came later. American cavalry (on both sides) during the Civil War was supposedly highly thought of by Europeans and that tended to be what cavalry was from then on. Around the turn of the century there arose a form of horse soldier called "mounted infantry," which was basically an on the spot response to the Boers, who were mostly mounted and made up all their own rules about how to fight a war. But the concept of mounted infantry was apparently confusing to the old soldiers and it faded.

The 7th Cavalry was not formed until after the Civil War, I think.

Good stories, Doc Hoy. Here's another one. It has to do with drinking (by officers!).

One British cavalry unit captured a coach belonging, I think, to either Napoleon or one of his relatives that he had installed as a monarch. Among the loot was a silver chamber pot. The descendent army unit today retains possession of said silver chamber pot who use it for drinking toasts on appropriate occasions, which ones I do not know. But for this reason, they have the nickname "the Emporer's Chambermaids." Naturally, this is in the officer's mess.
 
Last edited:
I don't know about you guys, but it sounds to me like Doc is considering buying a horse
Click to expand...
Certainly wouldn't put it past him and keep in mind that he is Ex-Navy. ... :eek:

A Buckskinner friend of mine really wanted to get into the "Thing" so he bought himself a horse. Had and the horse all decked out in the garb of the day and trained the horse to accept him shooting his sidelock on his back. Trained the horse for side shots and loads up to about 70 grains and all was well. Then one day he decided to take a front shot. Muzzle was well ahead of the horses nose and when My buddy woke up, he was on the gound, looking up at his horse. He may but, I sure hope he doesn't read this reply.. .. :)


Be Safe !!!
 
Thats a good'n Pahoo

Guys,

I have been on a horse two times in my life. Both of those times turned out bad. I would rather have a sister working in brothel than ride a horse. To me, horses are almost as bad as chickens which have to be the dumbest animal (apart from a California politician) on the face of the earth.
 
I visited Gettysburg recently and in conversation with a tour guide I found out the horses could be trained to accept the noise of battle but mules could not. Mules were used to draw supply wagons and not much else. Cav horses were carefully selected to screen out those which may be skiddish.
A horse is a large target but also an animal that can take a great deal of punishment including several musket minie balls before going down. A WALKER is a big gun but it will not take down a horse with one or two rounds unless it is head shot. The best way to take down a horse is a well placed round to a front leg which will break it and the horse is down.
During a charge two things come into play, first is the herd instinct which tends to keep them together and second the fact that the formations were usually tight and that kept the from breaking to the side.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top