Question about sighting in a scope.

I'm a tech guy and I believe in technology.
I just have to use it correctly...
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I'm a tech guy too. I even wear a digital watch (:rolleyes:)
But rifles are like women.... They're analog systems.
They don't operate in straight lines -- or according to digital/quantum theory of electron energy levels for coherent action.
Your best bet to figure out what they do naturally when all the pieceparts react together... and make sure to simply point things that way and declare it was your plan to start with. ;)
 
I'm sorry I just can't forget
The laser.
I'm a tech guy and I believe
In technology.
I just have to use it correctly
In conjunction with other
Alignment techniques.
Click to expand...
The only way to use it "correctly" is to stop using it at all.
It's not needed when you can sight through the bore.

The "high tech" gadget didn't let you notice the low tech screw was loose.
Use the KISS principle.
 
For a bolt action gun they are pretty much as good as mamories on a bore hog.


Your best option is to bore sight on something at 100 yds. get the scope cross hairs on that object (smaller the better)

Put your target at 50, you will be damned close.

Really safe is 25.
 
Bytesniffer said:
I'm sorry I just can't forget
The laser.
I'm a tech guy and I believe
In technology.
I just have to use it correctly
In conjunction with other
Alignment techniques.
Click to expand...

your not using it correctly if your trying to sight in your rifle with it. A laser is just for bore sighting and nothing more. Its to get you on paper, somewhere, anywhere, for your first shot only, so you don't wast ammo finding the paper entirely. From there you sight in without the laser.

stop using the laser
 
That laser is only there to get you somewhere on the paper at 25 yards. That's all it is good for. There are all sorts of factors that come into play that the laser doesn't know about, and can't know about. There is only one way to accurately sight in your scope, and that is to shoot the rifle and adjust your fire from where the bullets impact. There is no substitute for the actual bullet impact. There is no magic tech that will predict exactly where the bullet will impact, because it varies from load to load and from rifle to rifle. Just shoot the rifle and let it tell you where the impact is. It isn't rocket science.
 
I've sighted in about 30 different scope/dot/rifle/revolver combos over the past 6 years and i've learned my efficient method to obtain my preferred 200 meter zero. I don't waste my sighting ammo at 25 yds. I go right to 50 yds first:

1) cheap bore laser. Dial elev and wind so the dot is about 2" low of bullseye at 65' target distance (I do this in my basement).

2) Use a 24"x24" cardboard target covered in your unused Christmas wrapping paper with a 9" paper plate and a 1" orange bull sticker @ 50 yds

3) Depending on my caliber and bullet weight i'm always well on paper. I fire 2 shots and dope right for bullseye. fire another 2 shots. I'm now well inside the 9" plate. I'm not concerned with pinpoint accuracy i'm simply getting on paper in preparation for the next distance.

4) move out to 100 yds and fine tune the windage. Usually only takes another 3 shots or so. Again, i'm not fussy at this point as far as poi because my final zero will be 200 meters.

5) Now I zero for 200 meters, and here is where I patiently will shoot to aquire my precision zero.

This method is what works for me as far as obtaining my desired zero and not wasting unnecessary ammo. It can quickly get very expensive if your shooting factory match ammo and chasing a precision zero at 25 yds...
 
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I've always used the Mark I eyeball and then gone to 25 yards. It's rare that it takes more than three shots to be dead-on.

Dead-on at 25 yards is usually about three inches high at 100 yards and within a couple of inches left or right of center. Easy enough to get sighted in for two inches high--which is right at dead-on at 200 yards. :)
 
If I haven't said before
I'll say it now. This is the first
Scope I ever. Im still trying to
Understand this scope.
Before I want
To the range for a few hours
Just iron sights.

Now I put rifle in vise.
Align crosshairs with some
Bullseye. If I want to move
Reticle let's say 3 inches high
And 3inches left. I have to adjust
Scope 3 inches down and windage
3 inched Right to move reticle to
That point without moving rifle
Then reposition rifle (reticle)
Back to bullseye.
 
Forget about moving the reticle/cross-hairs. I understand there is a communication issue here. Just think of moving your point of impact (POI).

You want to move the "POI" which stands for Point Of Impact. If you aim at a target (POA - Point Of Aim) and your shots are going low right. Adjust your scope to come up/left. I do not know of a scope that is marked L/R U/D that is talking about the cross-hairs. It is talking about your POI. (it is marked on your scope). If you adjust it too much, just "undo" adjust it back a bit.

Before you start worrying about a where your two zeros are (typically 30yds/200yds—trust me, there is not a third, I've looked) do this at 30 yards. Then go shoot your gun and you'll see that you are a bit high at 100 yards and then closer at 200 yards. However if you are shooting anything bigger than 2 inch groups at 100 yards, zero it for 100 yards and learn to whistle and walk away.
 
Now I put rifle in vise....
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No, NO, NO, NO.... ;)

Take the doggoned thing to the range.
One shot at 25yds
Adjust scope so predicted next shot would be 2" low.
Take it out to 100.
One shot at 100.
Adjust scope so predicted next shot is 1.5" high.
Take one more shot to confirm/fine adjust if necessary.

Walk away......
 
I'll add two other things to consider because I didn't see them here (I apologize if I missed them).
- since it is your first scope, remember that the scope is offset from the barrel and has a straight line of sight, vs the drop of the bullet, which means out to some distance the bullet actually needs to "rise" to hit the center of the cross hairs.
- Since you can't forget the laser, being a tech guy, have you considered the laser may have a very slight skew? What did the laser cost? A $35 laser is not a precision instrument. If you were to look at the relationship between your laser mark and the position of the cross-hairs, then rotated your laser 90 degrees, does the relationship change?
 
Ok, quit making it complicated, read and follow exactly.

Don't think, don't try to understand, just follow exactly.


Take gun, remove bolt, get in some kind of reasonably solid hold (gun vice, shooting bags, whatever)

find something small like a house number, fence post top, as far away as possible (100 yds good, 50 is ok)

Look through the BARELL, center it up on your selected object and make sure the gun is as solid as possible. .

Then look through the scope. Adjustment will be opposite the what the dials say, but just turn one dial.

Start with horizontal. If the line goes the wrong way move it back the other way.

When that is on, adjust the Vertical.

Make sure the BARELL continues to be on your target by looking through it each time after you adjust a dial (if its solidly locked it should be fine but CHECK)

Soon, you will have the cross hair point at where the barrel is pointing.

Take to range, repeat the pull bolt, look through barrel, point at a target, see if the cross hairs are close.

Set up target at 25 yds. Shoot once. Note where bullet hit. Adjust PER THE DIALS NOW if needed. If it at 1 inch leave it alone.

Move to 50 yards, same thing. This time it will be off double. Shoot and adjust until is within an inch.

Move to 100 yards. Fine tune it, get it horizontal dead on, 2 inches high.

You are now sighted in for out to 250 yards.

If you want to hunt, do not think about it, anything from 25 to 250 yards you just aim mid chest behind the front leg and shoot.

Find someone who is not technical to go hunting with you though.
 
If you're a "tech guy", how is it you can't format normal sentences so they don't look like bad poetry?
Click to expand...

I work as a computer tech for my local government and my boss who is 10 times smarter than me does the same thing!!
 
I'm sorry I just can't forget
The laser.
I'm a tech guy and I believe
In technology.
I just have to use it correctly
In conjunction with other
Alignment techniques.
Click to expand...

I've tried the laser thing and honestly, they didn't work any better than me removing the bolt and sighting though the barrel. Even then all I wanted to do was get the round on the paper at 25 yards. I knew I had to "walk in" the rounds from there.

We're dealing with unguided ballistics here and lasers wont help much in this application. We don't get nearly enough data from the laser to provide anything but rough information. The only data point the laser sight gives is a single point in straight line from the lens. It does not tell you where your point of impact will be. The two I tried didn't even give me any idea of the level of accuracy of the devices themselves.

In other words I didn't know how true the beams were with respect to the center-line of the device chassis or how tight they locked up in the muzzle or chamber.
 
Thanks guys for the info
Wish I had more experience
With rifle scopes
It is very frustrating for sure.
I just looked through my bore
Yesterday at target 25 yards
away. Rifle is in vise.
I can clearly see target
Centered through bore.
Set scope elevation and windage
To factory center.
This part drives me crazy.
If I want crosshairs to move
From high and right to where
Bore is pointing and poi
Should be, I have to adjust
Scope up to move down
And right to move left
When fixed in vise.

Let's say for fun the
Bullets hits dead center
In bullseye at 100 yds.

Now I dial in 300yds
With my strelok program
And it tells me to go up
3.6 mill. Do I follow scope
Which is not in a vise now.
My scope says up this way
Down the other way.
Didn't follow sighting the
Scope.
 
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