Possible straw sale entrapment attempt?

I'm with white eagle. THis REEKS of LEO sting. Not all LEOs know anything about guns. His apparent lack of knowledge is a red flag to me.
 
You did the right thing in declining the proosition made by the guy. I doubt it was a sting. Though the guy offered to break the law. I am not sure how I would have reacted. I have not bought a gun from Walmart since 1995. I am one of the wierd people that will pay a few dollars more to deal with a local shop with people that know me when I come through the door.(Kinda like Norm on Cheers at the local gun srore.:o) They know who I am, and besides I put my CHL down with the form 4473. No back ground check. I pay, and walk out the door with the gun.
 
I'm with white eagle. THis REEKS of LEO sting. Not all LEOs know anything about guns. His apparent lack of knowledge is a red flag to me.
 
"selling illegal guns", or "selling guns illegally"? There is a distinction.
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Do you even pay attention to the media in this country? They don't use factual info in headlines. They distort the facts and make the most sensational headline possible.
 
i thought a strawman buy was when a person bought a firearm for a person who is disabled from buying it himself and knowing it. if both are legaly able to buy or sell a firearm,does it fall under the strawman law? eastbank.
 
I have serious doubts on the validity of this story. I don't believe for a minute there was any LE sting.


Nobody who is not wearing a tin foil hat would ever believe that this was a LE Sting. Even the most incompetent LEO in the USA would understand that this would be entrapment and that it would never stand in court. It would require the straw buyer to approach the "bystander" and freely ask for them to assist in a purchase, with that "bystander" being a LEO for it to be a good case. The chances of this occuring "freely" approaches zero.


Media sting... probably not.

Poorly socialized nutcase trying to be helpful? Most probably.


"When I hear hooves behind me in Arizona, I think horses, not zebras"


The simplest explainations are usually the right ones.

Willie


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eastbank said:
i thought a strawman buy was when a person bought a firearm for a person who is disabled from buying it himself and knowing it. if both are legaly able to buy or sell a firearm,does it fall under the strawman law? eastbank.
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The 4473 has a specific question regarding "Are you the actual purchaser/transferee of the firearm?" The FFL may not transfer the firearm to one who is not the actual purchaser/transferee of the firearm. There are some examples on the back of the 4473: http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf
 
"I have serious doubts on the validity of this story. I don't believe for a minute there was any LE sting."

Like a previous poster said, maybe not a LEO sting for the buyer, but a set-up for the gun shop.
 
While it could be a sting, it could also be an attempted theft.

"give me the money & I'll buy it & meet you over in the food court in 15 minutes".

Guy takes your money and leaves by another exit. Good luck calling the police and saying you were trying to make an illegal gun purchase and the person ran off with your money. The only thing that will net is a possible court date and an appearance on Americas Dumbest Criminals. Something like this was actually reported on News of The Weird. Someone bought some cocaine they found inferior and took it into a police station to complain they were ripped off and gave the LEO the sub par cocaine.

In short you were right not to take his offer.:)
 
Entrapment is the LEAST understood concept in law enforcement. What most civilians believe to be entrapment is NOT.
 
Entrapment is the LEAST understood concept in law enforcement. What most civilians believe to be entrapment is NOT.
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Only because courts quit defining things the same way the dictionary does. It's the same with the second amendment or the commerce clause or whatever, they don't mean what they say, but what some court says they say.:mad:
 
I find it conceivable that the guy could have had a hidden cameraman, and may have wanted to be the next Geraldo.

Why worry about facts when you could get air time?
 
I don't understand something...

If I fill out the paperwork in an acceptable manner, the store (in this case WalMart) calls in for the background check and then completes the sale, possibly with even an escort to the door before receiving the gun, and then once outside immediately I sell the gun or pass it to a ineligible person, How can the original vendor (WalMart) be held responsible?
 
OP here.

Let me assure anyone that doubts the story, the story IS true.

100% true.

Now what or who the guy was is another question.

The way he was hanging around the counter off to the side was weird.
The way he was dressed was weird.
The information he was freely sharing was weird, that had AR's for sale, that his brother was into them.
That he didn't know a thing about Feinstein's proposed bill was weird, at least to me considering his being so into guns and ARs. The bill info was out at that time even though it had not been officially introduced.
Offering to buy the gun for me and in the same sentence acknowledging it would be a straw buy was weird.

Now he may have been up to any number of things or none at all.
Regardless I know I made the right decision.
 
^^ Absolutely. You did the right thing. it woild have been illegal to have done otherwise.

It's very unlikely that he was a LEO of any sort.

Media sting.. nutcase... who knows. Who cares?


Willie

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Maybe he was undercover LE and maybe he was just some odd duckling who really had no clue; either way you did the right thing. We've had a few undercovers snoop around the gun shops around here before, and they're generally much as you described the gentleman in your account. Dresses the part, tries hard to fit in and join in conversation, but it's always a little off. Generally, they're easy to spot if you are a local. Never seen one attempt to initiate a straw sale around here (far less likely to fly in a small LGS than in a Walmart), they usually stay around until a transaction takes place and then they're in the wind and you never see them again. Of course, I can't prove they were LE, but you sometimes just know.
 
I believe the story but I doubt it was a sting. In any case the OP did the right thing by walking away. There are plenty of simple minded people in the gun culture who just want to help out. Coulda been one of those, or a scam of some sort. We'll never know.
 
It doesn't have to be LE or even legit set up to make waves with it ala 20/20 or Geraldo type of crap. They could air it and legit or not it would make waves and cast a poor light on gunowners. You were right to listen to your spidey sense tingling and leave.
 
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