Point Shooting

I've read several articles about civilian gunfights, and seen a couple of videos from Stop & Robs, and one thing I noticed is that in the real world, people look at the threat and not their sights.
Click to expand...

Have you also noticed how many people miss while not looking at their sights, even at very close range? Many of those folks don't look at their sites because they don't have proper training. Others know how to use their sights just fine, but don't know how to point shoot. Both types of shooting work can work very well, but tend to work best when implemented by someone who knows when to point shoot, when to use sights, and is appropriately proficient with the required method.
 
Why would you do that for close ranges when you can get better results faster with point shooting?
Click to expand...

Cause it's no faster and may very well not give as good a 'results'. And it surely is no easier to learn.

david, you are assuming one adjust the sights before firing. You are assuming you pause before firing. You are assuming all sighted fire is the same.

Your sights are verified, not adjusted. You shoot just at the end of the extension with the sight verification being instantious.

Just like there are several ways to point shoot, there are several ways to use your sights.
 
Several of the better IPSC shooters at our club have told me they point shoot the close targets, the modern technique doesn't always work even in competition. And IDPA? Sights? I don't need no stinking sights!
Seriously, the main thing that is needed to learn to point shoot is feedback; you have to see where your shot went. Dirt seems to work better for this than paper; easier to see a splash than a little hole, and previous hits don't distract you.
I once had to shoot a wild dog (the pack had been guarding a pig carcass on the route my 3rd grader took to the bus stop); I heard it coming before I saw it, I was waiting when it cleared the bushes 4' from me and a PPK. I looked at it's chest and watched the round hit almost before I could think. I also got a pig earlier this year with my H&K P7: walked up to it with a red light spotlight (this is in my garden--no I'm not poaching), the aimed shot at 10' didn't drop it, but I hit it 4 more times (1 handed) before it could get is s*** together enough to run, and then it only got about 50'. If I didn't know I could hit it, I wouldn't have had the nerve to walk up to a pig in the middle of the night. I'm glad point shooting is coming back; I sometimes feel like a voice in the wilderness.
 
David..thank you for the kind words.
I have adjusted my lesson plan to include a lot of two handed point shooting for police, since I have seen that it is best to keep them in their comfort zone at first.
If I have enough time I will gently work them into the one handed methods, since at close range that is where it's at.
At a recent two day class for armed citizens by the end of the first day the 20 students were very eager to learn the one handed methods, such as close hip, half hip and 3/4 hip--combat proven methods that some may think to be unnecessary.
You have my utmost respect and I hope that you will not be drawn into a stupid debate with, "you know who".
Sometimes the best response is no response.
Double Naught Spy...I could not have said it better myself.
 
I practice with an airsoft clone of my carry gun. Several hundred rounds per week. I try to not look at the sights and shoot from 21 feet to 2 or 3 feet. Strong hand, weak hand and two handed.
When I do get to the range, I have found much improvement in my live fire point shooting gained from practicing with the airsoft.
 
Have a buddy suit up so you can actually shoot him with the airsoft.
Then you will really see the advantages of point shooting, especially when the lights are low and both you and he are in motion.
 
I will have to try that Matthew. I have one of Gabe Suarez's force on force DVDs and how it plays out on the video sure looks different than a Hollywood movie set gunfight.
 
Cause it's no faster and may very well not give as good a 'results'. And it surely is no easier to learn.
Click to expand...
Well, maybe you have these problems, deaf, but it seems that most everybody else finds their results disgree with yours. Maybe if you would get some actual training in this area so you could know what you are talking about?? You seem to be about the only person around that finds sighted fire to be as fast as point shooting, and also the only one that seems to find point shooting dificult to learn. For the rest of the world that has been one of the selling points, that point shooting was easier to learn.
david, you are assuming one adjust the sights before firing. You are assuming you pause before firing. You are assuming all sighted fire is the same.
Click to expand...
deaf, you are assuming you know something about what I think/believe/assume. I assure you that you do not, and to post such assumptions as fact are dishonest at best. I've been well trained in MT shooting, deaf, in fact I believe I've had more training in it than you have. So I'm quite familiar with the doctrine and how it works.
 
This is a bold statement, but I'll make it anyway:

Sometimes, even if you can look at you sights, you should look at the threat instead.

Call it natural, or instinctive, or whatever...the point of point shooting is that in real life, you won't take your eyes off the threat, and you shouldn't take your eyes off the threat. What if there's three of them? I know I can make clean head shots out to 3yds or so, and good COM hits at 7yds just by looking at where I want my bullets to hit, so I can be watching the whole scene and not just my front sight.

Aimed fire is important too, but I agree that point shooting should be learned first; it is by far the most important skill to have for civilian self-defense scenarios.
 
Just a quick reminder, guys: on a contentious topic like this, it is especially important to remain polite in disagreement. Threads about point shooting and related topics have an unfortunate history of spiralling downwards as time goes on. It does not have to happen, and I hope it does not here.

Thanks, carry on.

pax
 
From 3 to 7 yds, practice alot of "double-hit" (BTW, Cooper hated the term, "Double-Tap"), slight crouch, arm/point finger extended or close to the hip in close encounter..
After awhile, one can be quite proficient....:)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top