Pietta vs uberti quality?

J

JohnCB7

New member
I've been out of the C&B game for awhile now. My first was a Pietta brass frame Navy back in '98. Put about 100rds through it before the hammer spring broke. After replacing that the bolt broke. By that time the cyl stops where so worn that putting anymore money into it was worthless. In 2002 I got a Pietta 1860 Army. Put about 50rds through it with no issues and the cyl stops didnt seem to wear near as bad as the brasser. Just last year I bought my first Uberti, a factory "conversion" 45LC 1858. LOVED that gun, shot over 200rds including some plenty of +P ammo. Traded it for a AR, wish I didnt. Now, I want to get a few C&B revolvers to shoot and one to convert to cartage. Was thinking about anoother brass Pietta Navy as a shooter and a Pietta 1858 to convert as I like the look of its case harden frame vs the Ubertis. Also Plan on ether a 1851 or 1861 .36cal. Qustion is, has Pietta really improved there quality over the years or should I just stick with the higher price of Uberti? Fit and finish isnt high on my list, being able to shoot 100's or rounds with zero worries is. In my reserch, these two vids have me thinking, and thus I come here to ask the experts lol

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jHVdx-6djkg

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kKzbUisSUEE
 
I've handled and seen both in a Remington 1858. For me the Uberti seemed better put together, given that the Pietta's charging handle retaining notch fell put from under the barrel, leaving the handle flopping around.

Can't comment on shooting and longer term ownership, though.
 
I think the reliability

of five thousand Uberti's might be slightly better than the reliability of five thousand Piettas.

But I also think that you might easily buy a Pietta that lasts longer in your hands than an Uberti might (or might last long enough to convince you that there is little difference between the two pistols.)

Once Pietta's quality came up (I think at least partially because of changes in their manufacturing process) it may very well have become a Chevy-Ford thing.

I am not a fan of conversions. I will very likely get some push back and I certainly can't speak from long experience.

But to me the logic is flawed. Take a pistol that costs about 300.00 then put a conversion in at the cost of about 150.00 to 200.00 and you have a pistol that was not designed to fire cartridges converted to shoot cartridges. In some cases some modification is required that should really be done by someone who knows how to do it. This all happens at the same time you could just buy a pistol for BP cartridges that was designed to shoot the cartridges. And it might cost less money.

I do acknowledge that this logic ignores the most important reason for having a conversion pistol and that is; The buyer, for his own reasons, wants one.

I was once taken by the idea of a Cattleman with a Cap and Ball cylinder and hammer. I was so taken that I bought two. Then I applied the logic above and sold them both. I liked them. Liked the looks of them. Liked shooting them. But one day I realized that the logic of a cap and ball version of an 1873 Colt was inherently wrong.
 
I know that Pietta revolvers have gotten a bad rap over the years, but I own four Pietta Remington 1858 versions and two were made in the 1990s. Both are excellent guns and have given me good service with thousands of rounds fired through them problem free. I admit that a little work was done on the internals, smoothing the hammer and lightening the springs, etc.
 
Depends on what you want.
Conversions for Pietta open top '60s and Remington's (44. cal) will take factory length ammo. The '60s from Uberti are a reload affair, not sure about their Remie but I think it's reload only too.
Of course my favorites are the Dragoons and of course they take off the shelf length ammo as well.

Then again, since the '73 C&B was mentioned, I just went through one for a customer and as stated, it is a Cattleman set up for C&B. It is now a much better El Patron than any El Patron ever thought about being!! It is almost a match for my carry which is a 5 1/2" El Patron Comp (fixed of course!!!)! So, . . . . . thanks for commenting ?

Mike
www.goonsgunworks.com
 
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By the way, the original open tops and Remington's that were converted served their owners very well so unless you told the gun what it was made for, I doubt that it cared.
Likewise, today's open tops/ Remington's are made of the current modern stuff and both in converted form do very well!!
My Dragoons are very accurate as is my Remie.

Here's my flawed logic. Nobody offers a converted Dragoon. I wanted one. I bought two brand new 1st's (one's a Whitney). I then bought two Kirst Gated conversions for them. That's about $700.00 ea. I set them to very tight tolerances (basis for my service ) and have two of the finest revolvers I could have (at a bargain!!) To top it off, I did it. Doesn't get much better than that!!

Spending is personal. A Saturn can get you from here to there . . . . but so can a Porsche!!!

Mike
www.goonsgunworks.com
 
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To me, the Pietta Remingtons are klunkier to wield. They are heavier with larger grips than the Ubertis. For beefy hands that is OK. I have no Piettas anymore but have 3 Ubertis and 6 Euroarms Remingtons. The Euros are even lighter with even smaller grips than the Ubertis.
 
Hellgate,
What barrel length? The El Patron Comp (5 1/2") is definitely lighter but my 5 1/2" Remie is my other carry and it's fairly handy. I have a Santa Barbara that is itching for a drop cyl conversion (.45 C) and it is the correct smaller size. Barrel is too long for it to be a carry though.

Mike
www.goonsgunworks.com
 
45 Dragoon,

4 Euros in 44 w/8" barrels (2 SS, 1 blued, 1 stripped of bluing)
2 Uberti Millennium 44s in 8"
2 Euro 36s in just shy of 6.5"
1 Uberti 36 " " " " "

I almost bought an unfired blued Santa Barbara about 6 years ago for $200 but passed 'cause I could get other Remmies for $125-$150. I regret the decision.
 
Well, I'm new to the whole BP shooting scene, but the Uberti 1858 Remington (2014 built) I recently bought is very well done. The important things which I heard sometimes plague BP revolvers (including Uberti revolvers) didn't show up on my gun. The barrel and cylinder are the same size, the gap between cylinder and barrel is very small, timing is perfect, and it is quite precisely machined. Action is smooth enough, but I wish it was lighter. Will have to take it to a qualified gunsmith for that.

Of course Pietta might be just as good - I do hear mostly solid things about Pietta from the few black powder shooters in my place. However I'm really satisfied with the quality of the gun.

I think the important part is that you buy a new gun, because both companies have improved in quality.
 
Branko,
Before you spend good money on a gunsmith to lighten the action, just back out that little screw on the front of the grip frame. It is the mainspring tension screw (I think that is what it is called). On my two Uberti Millenium Remingtons all I did was back the screws out all the way and then 1/4-1/2 turn back in order to lighten the hammer pull to perfect. Perfect means easy enough to pull back, reliable ignition, and no cap blowback. YMMV but do that first before having a smith mess with it. I never needed anything else done to them to make them reliable competitive CAS guns. The chambers are .448 though. .450 or .451 would be better.
 
Regarding gun smiths.but only some of the smiths in my area....

When I was working on my trapdoor, I was looking for someone who could rebarrel the rifle.

I went to a lot of shops that sell firearms but very few that work on firearms. The high volume shops including one pawn shop which does a lot of firearm business will take in your firearm and farm out the work to a smith which they have a relationship with.

When you ask if they have gunsmithing service, the universal response is an excited, "Of course we have gunsmithing service! What are you, CRAZY?! What do you need to have done?!" Then you tell them and you get the next universal answer. "Well I'm not sure if he can tune your SAA clone, or rebarrel your trapdoor. Just bring it in an leave it with us and we'll check with the smith. We generally hold firearms until there is enough work to call him in. That takes about a month."

The shops that say they have gunsmith service have at least a three month turn around once the work is started.

They even provide the name of the smith in most cases. This gives a person access to about four gunsmiths within driving distance.

I called every last one of them. The news was disappointing. I am repeating this from my memory but I am being relatively accurate.

One gent told me he could rebarrel the rifle but it would take a while to do the job. He is getting up in years and his eyes aren't so good any more. Fifty mile drive.

Another fellow acted like he wasn't interested in the work. Personality like a wolverine. Don't care how far away he is, he is not getting my business.

Another fellow said he was not doing smithing for money any longer because the liability was too great. 18 mile drive.

When you search the internet for gunsmiths in the area you get 17 returns. In the descriptions, only about half of those listings actually use the word "gunsmith". The rest are either CC permit trainers or Firearm instructors.

As this is the capital of the Navy one might expect a high population of retired Gunner's Mates. And that represents about half of the returns that actually say they are smiths. I am intimately familiar with the training a Gunner's Mate gets in small arms repair and some are quite good on the weapons they come into contact with.

One return is "Ron Hess Guns". This guy has a great shop but he is another one who no longer takes work because the insurance was killing him.

D&R Fire Arms was one of the returns but they were indicted in 2010 for illegal trafficing and while they are listed, they must be doing the work from the penitentury.

"Revolver Armorer" is a great shop. Very good reputation. Prices are high and they don't work on rifles.

When I completed my search I was left with essentially one viable option. Send the rifle out with a cost of about 250.00 plus shipping.

I sent out my Belgian Centaur some years go to a fellow who was perported to be a Centaure expert. After 260.00 in work the pistol was little better than it was when he started. He reblued it (cold blue) but the first cold blue job I ever did was better than his.

My experience can't possibly be the norm. My comments are in no way intended to criticise those of you who are professional gunsmiths. I know there are those among you who are gunsmiths and darned good ones. I know I am at risk of offending you and I don't mean to. It is just that the pickins in this area are slim.
 
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There are a few folks out there that "tune" revolvers for competition use.

Charlie Hahn
http://hahnmachineworks.com/html/RevolverAccuracy.html

Tri-L Machine - Rob Lewis possible phone number is (937) 252-1978 (from 2012 internet post)

Ball Accuracy
http://www.ball-accuracy.com/

The above guys have a reputation in the N-SSA for setting up stock reproduction revolvers for competition use. Generally you get a test target back with the gun that shows what it will do with the correct load.
 
Doc Hoy,
I don't blame you!! (And no offense taken !!!)
I am a tuner and not a gunsmith per se. I don't make handguns out of rifles or rifles out of handguns. My interest is in making S.A. revolvers run easy, precisely and reliably. The less you have to fight and worry about your weapon, the more you can concentrate on the target.
An easy handling S.A. instills confidence and prolongs the life of the action because you aren't having to overpower it.
Much too heavy springs break / cause parts to wear prematurely. I set the revolvers to perfect timing.
Specially tuned/set up S.A.s are purpose built to meet a customers demands such as fanning or CASS shooting .

Since you asked, the prices are on my website on the services page.

Thanks.
Mike
www.goonsgunworks.com
 
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Thank you for the advice. I didn't know about the screw - I tried the same and it's just perfect now. My chambers are .448, but the bore is .448 too.

As for tuning, well, can't really send it to you as I'm in Croatia. Besides, everything else (except the trigger pull being a bit heavy) worked just fine out of the box, without complaint there (except having to file the front sight a bit, it shoots low out of the box).
 
Thanks 45

I figured it would NOT be you who got offended. You seem to have a pretty thick skin.

I am earnestly hopeful that no one got offended.

So as to my second question; How many times does a shooter come back to you and say, "Hey, I now have "X" rounds through this thing and it has worked a little loose (or words to that effect). Can you touch it up for me?"

How long does the effect last?

My sense is that it must be a fairly long turn around since wear is reduced through lower spring force and smoothing of the interface between parts.
 
Doc,
I haven't had any sent back and don't expect to. I have told everyone that they can send theirs back for an update. My service has" morphed" over time an I have now, just recently, figured out the last piece of the puzzle to make my tuning my own tuning. I truly believe that I have the very best action setup available period. I know that probably sounds conceded and is a big statement but I have been focused like a laser on my action work.
Just in the past 3 weeks I have made huge strides in reducing friction , contact points and surface angles that make such a big difference in the total package it amazes me!! It's not about me, like I always say, the numbers are the numbers. The spring weights, the clearances, the surfacing . . . . they all add up to my standards and I adhear to them.

The action of a Walker and a '60 should feel the same if the numbers are the same and as of now, they do!! Crisp, accurate, solid but light (3 1/2 lb. hammer draws), no detectable friction in the lowering of the hammer (big reason for mis-fires), 100% reliable ignition!! This service will give the owner the utmost confidence in the revolver!!

So, to answer your question, its a lifetime setup. There is no time limit. You can plink with them, target shoot with them or go shoot CAS with them! They are ready to do whatever you want to do!! That's the way it should be.

Mike
www.goonsgunworks.com
 
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