NavyVet1959
New member
So, I'm not the only one who found his screwdriver collection somewhat lacking...
Pietta Pepperbox
- Thread starter DPris
- Start date
NavyVet1959
New member
Picked up a normal length cylinder to see if it will fit on the frame. Seems to have a slight amount of slop / wobble in it. Maybe the original bolt that the cylinder rotates around is slightly larger? Not enough of a difference that I could make a brass bearing to slide inside there. It would have to be less than paper thin.
The outer diameter of the cylinder is slightly smaller -- 1.532".
Created a spacer to make up the difference in length between the length of the pepperbox cylinder on my mini lathe. Basically a very thick aluminum washer 0.633"OD and 0.401" ID and 1.22" long.
The outer diameter of the cylinder is slightly smaller -- 1.532".
Created a spacer to make up the difference in length between the length of the pepperbox cylinder on my mini lathe. Basically a very thick aluminum washer 0.633"OD and 0.401" ID and 1.22" long.
I had done the same with a new cylinder and a sheriff .36 barrel. Was a perfect fit except for a slight gap in the arbor slot, like Ubertis have. I don't recommend fitting another cylinder and barrel to these pepperbox frames as the wedge will damage the threads cut into the wedge slot of the arbor.
NavyVet1959
New member
Is the bolt that the cylinder rotates around a different length on the non-Pepperbox vs Pepperbox models? Do the non-Pepperbox models not have a threaded section in the end where a screw can be installed like the Pepperbox has? If they are different, I have to wonder why there is the slot for the wedge in the bolt that is on the Pepperbox model.
I hadn't considered the wedge slot... Maybe that could be used to hold the spacer on instead of the screw. By the time you had it tight enough that the wedge wouldn't fall out though, it might cause the cylinder to bind and be more difficult to rotate.
It's called the "Arbor". They are the same length, but there can be a bit of variance based on date of manufacture of the frame. The gap, or even an extra length of the arbor is easily fixed, but a short arbor isn't really considered a bad thing because these guns aren't shot all that much. ALL Uberti open top cap and ball revolvers have a short arbor (from the factory). Piettas are a bit better from the factory, in that regard, but when you start mixing and matching pietta parts, sometimes luck is with you and sometimes it isn't.
No, they don't. None of them do from the factory. Some people drill and tap a small hole in the end of the arbor to hold a hex screw that can be used to put pressure on the wedge if it starts wearing from use, but the threads do not go into the wedge slot like the pepperbox screw threads do.
Because all Pietta did was grab a bunch of already assembled 1851 Navy frames, and used them for pepperbox models. They were made that way by default. They didn't do anything special for the pepperbox frames except drill and tap that hole.
Quite possible.
When I noticed the threads in the wedge slot of my pepperbox frame start to get boogered up by a wedge, I gave up on the idea of putting a barrel on it . Instead, I put the .36 cylinder and sheriff barrel on the frame I had for a 1851 .44 snubnose (the one I took the thunderer grip off of), and it was a perfect fit there also. In fact, like it was made for it. That one can now be swapped to be a .36 1851 Sheriff, or a .44 1851 snubnose.
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NavyVet1959
New member
Anyone tried Alliant Black MZ powder in the Pepperbox (or .36 revolvers in general)? I noticed that Sportsman's Warehouse has it for $9.99 per lb.
Probably should make this a new thread to get more input. I have not. I just use home made BP, Goex BP, and sometimes Pyrodex. To save $$, stock up on BP substitutes just after muzzleloader hunting season in your area. Walmart and other stores usually dump their stock at that time. I get Pyrodex and 777 for $10 a bottle, and less.
The reports about it for use in revolvers in general have been very good.
It's a coarse powder but seems to ignite fine in revolvers and burns fairly clean.
No problems have been reported with it besides that it can have trouble flowing from some powder flasks.
Keep the lid tight and don't let moisture get to it.
It likes to be compressed in the chambers.
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NavyVet1959
New member
I ordered 8 lbs of it. Assuming 30 gr per charge, that works out to be 1866 rounds. Only ordered 600 percussion caps though, so I might have had a "disconnect" in my thought process.
UPDATE 4/6/2019 00:42 -- Sportsman's Warehouse's order fulfillment / tracking system leaves a bit to be desired though. I ordered it on the 1st and their system said that I would receive it on the 5th. I called them on the 1st to ensure that the caps and powder would go out on at the same time and I wouldn't get charge 2 HAZMAT charges for it. They said that it would go out the next day (i.e. 4/2). On the afternoon of 4/3, I finally got an email saying that the order was "shipped" and it had a UPS tracking number. When I checked on the UPS site, there was no record of it. It stayed that way for awhile until UPS finally said that a label had been generated, but the package had not been picked up. As of 4/6 at 00:42, it still does not show it having been picked up. So, either something is wrong with the Sportsman's Warehouse order fulfillment side or the UPS tracking system is not working right. Don't know which, but there is definitely a disconnect *somewhere*.
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NavyVet1959
New member
UPDATE 4/10/2019 18:24 -- Received the order today, but the tracking number that Sportsman's Warehouse (SW) sent me is still "Label Created; Order Processed: Ready for UPS". UPS's site says that there are two packages in the shipment and the 2nd package actually moved through the UPS system between Salt Lake City and here and the other package just seems to have never moved / been picked up by UPS. I've tried twice sending SW an email, through their online "contact us" page, but they never responded. The package took 5 days longer than the initial quoted time.
In the end, I received 2 packages (apparently one for the primers and one for the powder), but when I look on the UPS website, it only shows one package as having been delivered and the other one waiting for initial pickup by UPS in Salt Lake City. Not exactly the best tracking experience that I've had with a company over the years. It also took 5 days longer than the original estimate. It's not that I mind it taking longer, I just prefer that when they say it will be there by a particular date, it actually *is* there by that date. And the length of time that it takes SW to respond to an email is completely unacceptable. Of course, I'm assume that *eventually* they might get around to responding to my emails. So, good price on the powder, but crappy customer service so far.
On a side note, I think this is the first time that I ever received a package with a HAZMAT sticker on it that actually said "EXPLOSIVES" on it. UPS guy was walking up my driveway and he said, "Expecting a package?". To which I replied, "Yeah, got my explosives?" And his response was a smile and said, "Here you go..." Texas... Gotta love it... A place where UPS delivers explosives and thinks nothing about it...
And to top it off, I was drinking a beer, so when he asked me to sign for it, I said, "No problem, hold my beer." Explosives delivery and the recipient say, "hold my beer"... Classic...
In the end, I received 2 packages (apparently one for the primers and one for the powder), but when I look on the UPS website, it only shows one package as having been delivered and the other one waiting for initial pickup by UPS in Salt Lake City. Not exactly the best tracking experience that I've had with a company over the years. It also took 5 days longer than the original estimate. It's not that I mind it taking longer, I just prefer that when they say it will be there by a particular date, it actually *is* there by that date. And the length of time that it takes SW to respond to an email is completely unacceptable. Of course, I'm assume that *eventually* they might get around to responding to my emails. So, good price on the powder, but crappy customer service so far.
On a side note, I think this is the first time that I ever received a package with a HAZMAT sticker on it that actually said "EXPLOSIVES" on it. UPS guy was walking up my driveway and he said, "Expecting a package?". To which I replied, "Yeah, got my explosives?" And his response was a smile and said, "Here you go..." Texas... Gotta love it... A place where UPS delivers explosives and thinks nothing about it...
And to top it off, I was drinking a beer, so when he asked me to sign for it, I said, "No problem, hold my beer." Explosives delivery and the recipient say, "hold my beer"... Classic...
There's not many videos of loading and firing the Pietta Pepperbox.
But there's a video by Hovey Smith where one of the first things he says is that you're going to need to ground down a screwdriver to fit the cylinder retaining screw.
He loads and fires one cylinder with a variety of loads including a patched round ball, 2 patched round balls, 3 patched rounds, a conical which keyholes and 2 chambers with magnatite [iron] shot.
After shooting his very first cylinder full is over, he says that he wouldn't want to be facing that gun loaded with 3 balls in each chamber!
That made me chuckle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbXVk2ehK24
But there's a video by Hovey Smith where one of the first things he says is that you're going to need to ground down a screwdriver to fit the cylinder retaining screw.
He loads and fires one cylinder with a variety of loads including a patched round ball, 2 patched round balls, 3 patched rounds, a conical which keyholes and 2 chambers with magnatite [iron] shot.
After shooting his very first cylinder full is over, he says that he wouldn't want to be facing that gun loaded with 3 balls in each chamber!
That made me chuckle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbXVk2ehK24
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NavyVet1959
New member
Found someone locally that has a few Uberti BP handguns for sale -- Walker, Patterson, and 2nd Model Dragoon... The Walker has supposedly never been shot and is $300. We're going to meet later this week for the sale. The Paterson models are $750 and I was surprised at that. I would have thought them to be closer to the price of the other BP revolvers.
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Since loading pepperbox cylinders seems to be such a pain, would it be a good solution to use slightly smaller diameter conicals? I have the Pietta pepperbox and a like-caliber old Classic Arms pepperbox kit I'm tinkering with and was planning to do that rather than try to ram balls down the barrels. I realize this is even less kinetic energy than the things already have, but would it work?
If the smaller diameter conicals are not "swaged" into the cylinder during the loading process, the bullets will move away from the compressed BP charge after the first shot, leaving the powder charge uncompressed in those chambers.
Personally, I would use an off-the-gun cylinder loading press like the Tower Of Power or similar.
I have several Pietta Navy .36 type revolvers, but the Pietta pepperbox is an answer to a question that should have not been asked in the first place. One needs a carefully fitted screwdriver bit just to remove the cylinder from the arbor.
Just my $.02 worth.
Jim
Personally, I would use an off-the-gun cylinder loading press like the Tower Of Power or similar.
I have several Pietta Navy .36 type revolvers, but the Pietta pepperbox is an answer to a question that should have not been asked in the first place. One needs a carefully fitted screwdriver bit just to remove the cylinder from the arbor.
Just my $.02 worth.
Jim
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Inactive
Many thanks for a lightning fast response; more importantly for such a wise response. You've just saved me from myself.
I think that a pepperbox would be a candidate for loading with patched round balls.
More often than not folks do not load bare balls into smooth bore pistols.
There is no cylinder gap to be concerned about causing a loss of velocity.
I fail to see enough of a difference between a pepperbox cylinder and a single shot pistol to warrant loading bare balls unless that's the shooter's preference.
Generally speaking, a patched round ball can provide as tight of a fit as a bare rammed ball.
Swagging a ball may only be practiced because that's how a C&B is traditionally loaded.
But it's not a traditional C&B.
Also there isn't any rifling to help stabilize a conical, although I realize that it's only intended for short range.
I would at least experiment with patched round balls and try to load them tight enough to stay in place during firing.
That would also help negate the need to use a loading press.
Perhaps a loading stand would be sufficient.
I'll admit that due to not owning one this is only speculation.
Track of the Wolf sells .358 and .360 round balls which should work with a ± .015 patch.
There's shouldn't be a need to remove the cylinder for loading using a push dowel of some sort if enough care is used.
More often than not folks do not load bare balls into smooth bore pistols.
There is no cylinder gap to be concerned about causing a loss of velocity.
I fail to see enough of a difference between a pepperbox cylinder and a single shot pistol to warrant loading bare balls unless that's the shooter's preference.
Generally speaking, a patched round ball can provide as tight of a fit as a bare rammed ball.
Swagging a ball may only be practiced because that's how a C&B is traditionally loaded.
But it's not a traditional C&B.
Also there isn't any rifling to help stabilize a conical, although I realize that it's only intended for short range.
I would at least experiment with patched round balls and try to load them tight enough to stay in place during firing.
That would also help negate the need to use a loading press.
Perhaps a loading stand would be sufficient.
I'll admit that due to not owning one this is only speculation.
Track of the Wolf sells .358 and .360 round balls which should work with a ± .015 patch.
There's shouldn't be a need to remove the cylinder for loading using a push dowel of some sort if enough care is used.
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