Pietta Pepperbox

DPris

Member Emeritus
Should have foreseen this, but didn't even think about it while waiting weeks for it to get here & taking care of other business. :)

Now that it is, how to load the critter becomes the question.

Don't have a press-style cylinder loader, would one accommodate a 3-inch cylinder?

Otherwise, looks like a dowel rod & mallet, with cylinder rear resting on the bench.
Denis
 
Make One

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Ram Balls Home to Complete Loading
 
Very ingenious. :)
Unfortunately, no ram on the gun to use, so I'd still be looking at a dowel & mallet.
Denis
 
Smoking Joe-
Nice setup. I like simple and practical. Some folks on here build some very nice loading stands. As attractive as they are, I've never wanted to build one. Think I may have to make up a tool like you made. :cool:
 
That's pretty cool. Nice idea. The only downside I see is a possible gap between the ball and powder if you are not careful, or are you going to ram them in further with the dowel you were talking about?
 
Was there a manual with it? If so, it should give loading instructions.

The original pepperboxes were made for "close up" work. I would imagine that the balls were pretty close to bore size? or else a little under and patched? I would also think that probably a wooden "palm rod" may have been used. To me, it would make more sense that a patched ball was maybe used which would be easier to load. The intended target would not be more than a few feet or several yards away. I'm not implying that an oversize soft lead ball couldn't be used much the same way one is in a C & B revolver but I really don't think they were intended to be loaded that way.

If the pepperbox is say a .36 and the barrels measure .360 smoothbore, I'd look at using a .350 or .355 ball with a lubed patch which would be much easier to load and would not necessitate using a mallet. Not unlike loading a smoothbore rifle or pistol - same principal only five or six barrels instead of one.
 
The patch idea is one to keep in reserve, might even chase down a shortstarter rod.

Trying to keep it simple, and a press seems the simplest & easiest way to go without having to pound on things. :)

I have .375 commercial & .380 home cast balls, also have some commercial .350 balls on the shelves.
Seems like the .350s would still be undersized even patched, wouldn't they?

No papers included specifically for this pepperbox, no loading tool.

It's not a real one, just the back half of a .36 Navy Pietta with a 3-inch cylinder held on by an arbor screw.
No barrel, no ram.

Denis
 
I had heard of those Pietta Pepperboxes, didn't think they'd ever come out. Where did you get yours? What're your thoughts. I'm admittedly not much in love with them, but the fiancé seems to be a big fan.
 
Total toy. :)
No way to aim, no target or plinking utility, reduced velocities, no leather, not a pocket pistol.

EMF sent mine earlier this week, they finally got a shipment in.
Seems well done.
Denis
 
Thanks for the info! I had been wondering about them because, well, they're just so odd. I think I'll grab a pocket pistol for her to play with instead, something a little more user friendly.
 
They are a curiosity & if you buy on that basis it can have some appeal & some fun. :)

I'd expect SOME degree of ability to hit a man-sized target out to 15 feet or so, but with no sights it's a point & shoot deal, and it's not especially practical for real defensive use.
Denis
 
The problem I see with the bolt press is that as the washer presses the balls home and shaves lead the washer will bottom out on the lead shavings. This means the nose of the balls will be a few thousandths of an inch over-flush of the face of the cylinder. This could cause binding/jamming on cylinder rotation.

It might be possible, after the ring is shaved, to pluck/rip the shavings out with a pocket knife before completing the drive-home process.

Steve
 
"This means the nose of the balls will be a few thousandths of an inch over-flush of the face of the cylinder. This could cause binding/jamming on cylinder rotation."

Not in a pepperbox. But there would be a big gap between the powder and ball, and low power. The only feasible way to load a pepperbox is with a palm type rod (wood will do but brass is better), but I get a bit nervous hoping I never have a charge go off while ramming it. Patches are not used; the ball is only a bit bigger than the bore, just tight enough to keep rammed balls from jarring loose from recoil.

At home, with the barrels off the frame, a drill press, or a loading tool could be used but those are not very practical to take to the range.

Of course, accuracy is a joke with a pepperbox; they were made for fast, DAO firing at very close range. I once fired my Allen & Thurber and got about an 8" group at six feet; maybe I could have improved on that with practice, but I really didn't want to win any matches with it.

Jim
 
Hoping to find a press that can accommodate the long cylinder.
Simplest solution.

If not, I may try a short starter rod or a mallet & dowel.
I'd prefer brass in that case, but I'd have to find a section of brass rod & cut to length, unless somebody knows a pre-made brass short rod.
Denis
 
My screw type press has served me well for many years. It's a two step process because the balls must be rammed home with loading lever after cylinder is installed in the frame. A similar two step process could be utilized with a pepperbox design. Simply cut six lengths of the proper diameter wooden dowel and use them under the pressing washer to ram the balls home. Or you could attach rammers to the pressing washer as I did for my Wells Fargo clone. I have never seen a cheaper or more portable yet reliable loading press than this design.

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That is a great idea! I have a Black Dawg press, but for taking out to the range, the homemade bolt and washer press is way more portable. I believe I will be making one of those for my .44 snubbie, and another for my .31's. Thank you sirs for the great idea and the informative pictures!
 
by the way, DPris, i knew when i saw the pics of those pepperboxes they would be for fun purposes, lol! Just the thought of it brought a smile to my face. Sometimes, you have to get a gun that is in no way practical, but has fun and conversational value. And.... seems to me i've seen holsters for a gun of that style in various "steampunk" photos. You may have the ultimate sleeper concealed carry gun there, lol! Pull that thing out, and the look of it alone will more than likely send miscreants scattering!:D
 
I came across one of these recently and bought it on a whim. From what I've gathered with respect to the Texas gun laws, they don't apply to the muzzleloaders / blackpowder / antique replica type of guns like this. For example, the 30.06 and 30.07 signs are only for people carrying under authority of a CHL/LTC and the same goes with our 51% signs for bars.

Don't have a mold for it yet though, so will probably just use a round ball that I use for .38 / .357 and tap it slightly with the arbor press to increase the diameter. Either that or a 105 gr 0.358" bullet similarly widened.

First test was with just a percussion cap on it and the cap pretty much gets shredded. They definitely do not stay together like you see with normal centerfire primers. Is this how that always end up?

Second test was with a couple of grains of Alliant Promo with a 1" square of paper towel on top of it to hole the powder in place. I am well aware of the disclaimers about using smokeless powder in a blackpowder gun, but I'm curious to see what can be done safely and intend to pursue this a bit. I am using a rig to remotely fire the weapon and there is concrete filled cinderblock wall between me and the gun. If it blows up, I'm not concerned from a safety aspect. I'm also only doing a single chamber at a time, so in the event of a catastrophic failure, the other chambers will not be firing.

With respect to a holster though, I have found that the belt slide holster that I use for my M1911 fits it very well and it makes for a very concealable rig. The cylinder fits right through the opening in the bottom of the belt slide holster and is just snug enough that it would probably not fall out even if you were completely inverted.

I'm pretty sure that there are some safe smokeless loads that can be used in blackpowder guns. All you have to do is look in the smokeless reloading manuals and find ones with pressure as low as would be generated if you were using blackpowder. Of course, you also need to ensure that you seat the bullet to the correct depth since if you seat it all the way down to the top of the powder, you're probably going to end up with an overpressure situation. From the Lyman Black Powder Handbook, 2nd Edition, blackpowder pressures can vary from 13,500 to 23,400 psi, so choosing a smokeless load that is that low should be safe. Of course, start low and work your way up, just like when you are trying to develop a load for a new powder that does not have any data for your particular caliber. Starting with .38 special loadings might be a good choice. For example, Hodgdon shows that for a 90 gr LRNFP seated to and OAL of 1.325", 2.5 gr of Clays will give you 705 fps and 7900 psi and 3.0 gr will give you 938 fps and 11,400 psi. Considering the fact that the .36 chamber is slightly wider than the .38 special, the pressure will be slightly reduced from those values.

Now, what would be really nice is if Pietta would make nipples for the Pepperbox (and their other handguns) that could take either 209 or small/large pistol primers so that they would stay intact after firing. Combine this with making the Pepperbox chambers so that it could handle .357 magnum pressures and you would have an impressive gun that would avoid all the ATF rules. To reduce the chance that someone might load a bullet too deeply and thus increase the chamber pressure, they could make the chamber "stepped" (i.e. the part where the powder normally sits would be a smaller diameter than the part where the projectile sits). Kind of the opposite of a bottlenose cartridge chamber.
 
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