"Perfect" Military Handgun

B

Badger Arms

New member
In terms of what is the 'perfect' weapon for combat, I noticed in a recent thread a tendancy to belittle and even mock the use of a handgun in modern warfare. While I'll admit that a LAW would be much more effective at clearing a room than a 1911, reality sets in and situations present themselves where a handgun is required.

What a soldier SHOULD carry in battle is a matter of opinion. Opinions agains the handgun mostly center around those who would rather have another weapon. Sure, I don't want to be stalking the hedgerows with a pistol, but likewise I don't want to be 'clearing' an attic with a BAR. I believe in todays warfare, I'd opt for a good M-14 and perhaps a Glock 19 for good measure. I'd want the full-auto option on the M-14 of course, but the Glock would be strictly a backup gun. You know, BACKUP.

I do believe some people have watched "All Quiet on the Western Front" a few too many times. A spade or knife is fine in a pinch, but I want some lethal, lightweight, and quick firepower in close quarters. If injured, I want to be able to operate a gun one handed. If I'm in water, I want to be able to still fight.

My choice for a military pistol: The Glock 19. Light, high capacity, reliable, and proven. Must have threaded barrel for the odd times one would want a suppressor. Best feature, you pull the trigger it goes BANG.
BTW, the M-4 is NOT replacing the M-16 in any capacity.
 
My choice as a military pistol: Glock 21. Excellent accuracy and big bullet! The G21 should be somewhat durable too. The 9mm is a great round, but when push comes to shove I would rather defend myself with a .45!
 
HK USP. Either a 9mm, .40 or .45. Pick the variant. Glock, of course, if you are on a tight budget. My favorite is still the 1911, but it isn't for everyone.

Erik
 
And although I really love the M1A (couldn't imagine a fully auto version of .308 in the M14 - yikes) I would have to go for the G36.

The G36 is an awesome one indeed. I would still take the .308 over the .223 in almost any environment where semi is enough, but in full auto I would rather have the .223. In places where CQC is more apt to occur, say in an urban environment, I'd also rather have the .223 as a longarm.
 
Uh, will I seem moronic if I recommend a 9mm Ruger?

Don't care........that's the one.

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"All my ammo is factory ammo"
 
Browning HP-35. Perfect for the past 65 years or so, and should be good for a few more. ;) Add in those SA 17 rnd mags and you can run with any high capacity new polymer pistol.

Mike

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"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein
 
Yep 5.7 is the new backfield round of choice, both the 5.7 pistol and the p-90 bullpup will be shooting this LEO & gov't only ammo!

FN's Five-seveN® Pistol

The First of a New Generation

In 1935, the FN-made Browning Hi Power was revolutionary. The market quickly adopted this high-capacity 9mm
pistol accordingly, and it has since been fielded by over 100 countries.

FN's newest contribution the handgun's evolution is named the Five-seveN®. This 20-round pistol fires a 5.7mm
bullet that will defeat most body armor in military service around the world today. Essentially, the Five-seveN®
represents a quantum leap forward in the handgun's suitablity for close engagements by delivering the type of
performance that was previously confined to rifles or carbines. Elements of this performance include:

High magazine capacity: The Five-seveN®
comes standard with 20-round magazine.

High stopping power: The Five-seveN® fires
the 5.7x28mm SS190 Ball round which reliably
penetrates Kevlar helmets and vests as well as
CRISAT protection.

High hit probability: The Five-seveN's®
extremely low recoil impulse results in virtually
no muzzle climb, thereby facilitating fast and
controllable follow-up shots.

Yet, the Five-seveN® is:

Light and ergonomic: Weighing 30% less
than most 9mm pistols, the smoothly-contoured
Five-seveN® is comfortable to carry and quick
to deploy.

Fully safe: Due to its double-action firing
mechanism, the Five-seveN® offers no inherent
risk of accidental discharge during
transportation. Furthermore, all of its safety
devices are automatically reengaged following
each firing cycle.

The Five-seveN® fires the SS190 5.7x28mm ball round. This projectile will perforate any individual protection on
today's battlefield including the PASGT kevlar helmet, 48 layers of kevlar body armor and the CRISAT target
(titanium and kevlar). The SS190's conventional design allows it to be manufactured on existing production lines,
and its lead-free composition eliminates range contamination.
http://www.remtek.com/arms/fn/57/index.htm
 
What's the Glock that can be fired both semi and fully auto?

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Rob
From the Committee to Use Proffesional Politicians as Lab Animals
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She doesn't have bad dreams because she's made of plastic...
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bad Kiki! No karaoke in the house!
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Larry Flynt is right. You guys stink!!!
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Peter McWilliams - Murdered by the DEA
 
Glock 18 is the select fire jobbie. I got to shoot two of them at once, a few years back. Like holding a nervous cat.

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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
 
Jim V: Isn't that the new single stack .45 (2 x 18 = 36)??? Sorry, I couldn't resist. Seriously, though, that must have kicked you know what!
 
can't fault the FN five-seven ... but as for the P90 ... when it gets dropped with a partially emptied magazine the rounds in it scramble about and seriously jam the weapon? or so i've heard? love the silhouette on it though, but not being able to put a taclight, grenade launcher, or bipod kind of limits the weapon as a long arm, doesn't it?

the wehrmacht had a good sidearm way back when ... http://www.gunsworld.com/mauser/c96_parts_us.html ... at any rate even for a pistol, hi-cap magazines and a full auto option seem to be de rigeur. maybe that's where weapons like the Steyr TMP and the HK PDW come in. personally i'd rather be passed a Micro Uzi than a Glock.

[This message has been edited by dragontooth73 (edited August 25, 2000).]
 
Since this is the handgun forum - I'll limit my opinons to handguns.

The perfect handgun for the military is the 1911. It has served honorably in the US Army since introduction up to today... I know of servicemen who STILL carry it in the field. 1911 to 2000.
I have YET to see a pistol that marks high enough to justify replacement. The M-9 certainly wasn't it.
The pistol that comes closest would be the HK USP .45 and even it remains #2.
The FN? Please. I have fired a few .22 Hornets - the ballistic equal to the FN round... I found it to be COMPLETELY unacceptable.

Oh, what the heck... Rifles too - the DOD should drop the M-16 like a rock and adopt the HK G36 system. (Well - if they are determined to stay will .223 caliber that is)
The G36 is developed with built on duel optics, changeable barrel lengths, underslung 40MM thumper, a much improved gas system, and its not self polluting like the M-16. Its a PERFECT rifle for the military in its modern form of police/peacekeepers.
 
A 1911. The other options are accceptable, with the exception of the FN, IMO. But... The 1911 is all that is necessary and so much more.
 
Any Glock.

I say this after using the M15 revolver, M1911A1, M1935, M9, M11 in uniform (and out) from 78-98.

K.I.S.S.

A Glock in 224 Boz beats the FN 5.7 like a drum. :)

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>>>>---->
http://home.att.net/~brokenarrrow/
 
The "perfect" military handgun is the one you have in your hand when it is needed most. It doesn't matter who made it or what the caliber is, if it works and you don't end up daid, it is the perfect handgun.

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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
 
I'll put my two cents worth in about the Five Seven. I think it's a 'neat' idea to be able to punch through flack vests but you are only punching little holes. There is the absolutely rediculous argument afoot that since the FN round has X amount of energy at the muzzle which is equal to the .223 at X range, then it's an superior round. Who the hell ever said the .223 was anything more than adequate? I think the .22 hornet analogy says it best.

And, hey, if you want a real .22 wondergun, check out what our friends in Germany have come up with: http://www.hkpro.com/pdw.htm

I do think that the 45 ACP is the perfect military caliber if we are talking people my size, trained IPSC competitors, or a minority of small-statured enlistees willing to listen to proper instruction. However, for the real world most are unable to use the 45 effective enough to make the cut. If it were I, I'd love to have a 400 CorBon Glock 21 on my hip. Were I to equip an army, give me the Glock 19 any day.

George. So far as rifles go... I'd have to echo what you said about the G-36. It needs a 40mm Thumper and a decent set of backup iron sights. Without the thumper, it would need a more serious heat-shield inside the handguard. From what I understand, they heat up pretty quick.
 
I've got an M1A and a Glock 21. Those would be my choices in war. But you may be in a situation where you may not want to be noticed or pointed out as a trouble maker, dissident, etc., such as in a fascist totalitarian state. In that case, the handgun would be the only choice. I'll keep mine a .45.
 
There are lots of reasons why a "rifleman" doesn't need a sidearm. Weight of the gun and ammo, maintenance, logistics of keeping the gun and ammo servicable. The M-16 is designed as a carbine and as such is more effective than a handgun for most applications. The M-16 uses lightweight ammo, so you can carry more rounds for the same weight as the 7.62 NATO. The Army issued handguns to the troops in WWII and then decided that the 30 cal. carbine was much more reliable.

When it comes to clearing tunnels, rooms, etc, there are a couple sidearms in the squad. (Just like there are machine guns and grenade launchers.)

I guarantee you that soldiers with Glocks would result in a lot of accidental discharges and related casualties.
 
I would probably opt for the Glock 19 these days. The M1911 is still a venerable choice.
I carried a Ruger Speed Six .357 when I was in the Army, but this was in peacetime. In wartime, I would probably rather have another couple of mags for the M16. I carried the revolver to use against the packs of wild dogs that you encounter in the field in Germany. Rabies is rampant there.
 
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