Parkland Shooting Time Line

I have no LEO experience or training. My only means of relating to this is to reflect on times when I had to immediately respond to a co-worker freezing in the headlights during a stressful moment. Is this reaction from an LEO (which seems predictable in a firefight) part of active shooter training?
 
My mistake then. Two minutes is more along what I'd expected. I think the time disconnect comes in between when the shooting started and when Peterson reported it.
 
I have no LEO experience or training. My only means of relating to this is to reflect on times when I had to immediately respond to a co-worker freezing in the headlights during a stressful moment. Is this reaction from an LEO (which seems predictable in a firefight) part of active shooter training?
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Training, active shooter and otherwise, is supposed to help soldiers/responders to be able to react and perform in an appropriate manner. Peterson didn't freeze up, per se. He remained quite active doing everything other than actually trying to stop the shooter.
 
Lots of unknowns, hard to make honest to gosh judgements. From my experience, most resource officers are not the "cream of the crop" of their department. They generally have the SRO position because it is basically a "PR" position where your biggest challenge is a food fight in the cafeteria. You deal with truancy, in school conflicts and generally assist when there is a canine search of the building/grounds. You report to Human Services if and when there is suspicion of abuse. IOWs, there's a reason they are not on the SWAT team. Over the years, I have seen several different SROs, in different local districts and have thought to myself "God help them if they ever have a school shooting". This shooting may(and I hope so) change the perspective of those in charge, of what a SRO really should be. We also do not know the protocol the school/school district has on active shooters. My district says no-one is required to re-enter the building(teachers and staff), altho many of us would do what we had to do to save innocent children. The evidence that the SRO actively tried to take command of the situation and did so calmly and with authority, makes me think, that while I don't agree, he thought it was the right thing to do. One thing many folks don't know is, most Schools have fire-doors that close automatically, so folks cannot re-enter the building once the alarm goes off. Most times there is only one entrance that can be re-entered once the alarm is pulled/activated. Schools don't care about the ease of saving the building by firefighters, only how easy it is for folks to get out and how hard it is for them to get back in during an actual fire. That entrance could have also been a city block away from where the deputy was.

That said, the school has an enrollment of about 3200 students. It is a newer school with high national academic ratings and probably had many of the most widely used security protocols implemented. Being the size of a small town, most students there probably did not know the shooter by name, or even by sight. The shear size of the school meant he could have made it to the other side of the building and in the panic, no one would have even suspected him as long as he acted the same as everyone else. Coming out of a building, a city block away from where the shootings happened while blending in with the rest of the escaping student body, would have been easy. Odds are it took that hour for him to be positively identified. Odds are we will really never know why he just stopped shooting and walked away. I'm just glad he did.

I'm not defending the deputy, only saying there are a lot of unanswered questions. I sit in school security meetings all the time. Teachers/staff claim they would act a certain heroic way every time and do so during drills. Funny tho, how when a real lock down is implemented for a legitimate reason, many of them act like deer in the headlights and are more concerned with calling their spouses on their cell phone, than thinking about the kids around them. The deputy has lost his job, his pension and his image. Odds are the best he can do after this is night security at Wal-Mart....if he's lucky. He will have to go over in his head everyday for the rest of his life if there was anything he could have done to save just one of those kids. It may be what he deserved, I don't know, but he didn't walk away unscathed.
 
Maybe I'm the only person who hasn't come across one, but can someone point me to a diagram of Deputy Peterson's position(s), the killer's positions, the layout of the buildings in which the shootings occurred?

Was he likely quickly able to identify where the shooting was occurring and didn't act to intervene?
 
Parkland Shooting Time Line Lesson Learned

Thank you for posting the facts, as well as the direction on comments. I see lots to improve in the communications area. The operation of multiple 911 systems impacted response time and command and control response significantly. Radio equipment not in good order, not able to share channels and the school system radios were totally independent. No one on site really had any idea of who what why when where and how was happening in real time. Hopefully all efforts will be focused not on arming the school and creating multiple hard points and scapegoating as many as possible. There should be an investment in the infrastructure so that there are not so many independent underfunded poorly designed communication entities. Active Shooter Training, 911, Radios, Phones, CCTV, Texting, and Social Media as starters need to fully integrated and shared with all agencies. The school, district, community, city, county, region, elected officials, professionals, law enforcement, state, and federal need to look at this and support it so that this does not happen again. The solution is in seeing what failed to work as planned and it needs to be balanced with our rights as Americans as guaranteed by the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. This is not about a blame game. It is about learning what went wrong and what needs to be done to prevent in the future. Perhaps the Uber Driver needed to know the the actual Shooter was unstable and that Uber needs to be held responsible for allowing the Shooter to arrive with his arsenal of destruction.
 
Great points. A relatively inexpensive wireless camera system inside the school that was tied to a competent school assigned LEO’s phone would have helped.
 
No one on site really had any idea of who what why when where and how was happening in real time.
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Peterson should have been fully up to speed in real time, but he chose to stay outside.

Perhaps the Uber Driver needed to know the the actual Shooter was unstable and that Uber needs to be held responsible for allowing the Shooter to arrive with his arsenal of destruction.
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Sounds like you are scapegoating. Do you know how many "unstable" people public transportation carries on a daily basis? Are you suggesting making public transportation responsible for the actions of their patrons? That is sort of like blaming the airlines for 9/11.

We only have about 100,000 schools in the US. How much could retrofitting cost?
 
Doublw Naught Spy

I read T Clark.s last thought as provocatively sarcastic....in context of his sound advice to find all the failure points and improve the infrastructure, plans, and training
 
Sounds more like incompetence than anything else. How much training do the officers have to deal this type of events, what preplanning does the police department have in place.
 
IN Broward county apparently not a well designed or trained plan...but this is pure speculation and Monday QB

I know my Local sheriff and Police chief... I a long time ago after Columbine and other active shooter incidents in schools just casually asked.... Tax payer and kids long out of school...If I could see the written plan and review it from a been there done that perspective.... This was not some internet question where either man had some notion the request was from a loony wanting to see the system... to game it

They both got quite defensive and denied my simple request

I know I could force them some how but decided to drop it...

These more and more frequent (seemingly ) event make me want to press a bit harder

I think from all events there are MANY Lessons to be learned.... Why we did After Action Reports (AAR) and meetings after every Mock City Exercise....

I am not the guy who would get on face book and spout off about how the local plan is worthless... I AM the kind of guy who would read and re-read the plan and make margin notations and discuss my concerns with the PD chief and Sheriff

I am very retired and no kids in the schools... so too easy to plant head in sand....

I am also not a crusade type.... but in the Army had zero fear of letting my Uppers know what I thought and why... usually as diplomatically as possible but did manage to PO more than a few Officers who were being stubborn and stupid.... fortunately my been there done that seniority with credibility won the day...even with Butt hurt officers

I do not personally think a lock down paranoia stance for ever school is necessary... but a good proactive active AGGRESSOR....gun, knife, bat, hammer, bomb plan is imperative
 
buck460XVR said:
One thing many folks don't know is, most Schools have fire-doors that close automatically, so folks cannot re-enter the building once the alarm goes off.
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Wherever did you hear that? I've been an architect for over 40 years and a licensed building official for 25 years. I've lost track of how many school projects I've been involved in, either as an architectural specifier and code resource, or as the code official. I've NEVER heard of "fire doors" that close automatically and lock people out. First off -- the exterior doors on any building aren't "fire doors." Second -- they need to open to get people out in case of a fire. They probably have normal closers on them, but if they were unlocked before a fire alarm they'll stay unlocked after a fire alarm. If they were locked from the outside before a fire alarm, they'll stay locked from the outside after a fire alarm. Parkland is a multi-building campus. The grounds are (supposedly) secured with a fence and dates (that's a separate discussion) but the buildings are not locked because students and teachers move among the buildings.

The deputy has lost his job, his pension and his image.
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He retired, after more than 30 years on the force. How do you figure he lost his pension?
 
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Mainah said:
Great points. A relatively inexpensive wireless camera system inside the school that was tied to a competent school assigned LEO’s phone would have helped.
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The school has a complete video surveillance system. The problem is, it's not real time -- what you see on the screens is a 20-minute time delay. The first responders went to the system and were reporting where the shooter was in the school to the people in the building -- and nobody thought to tell them (or knew, or remembered) that what they were seeing wasn't "now," it was 20 minutes old.
 
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Fredvon4: I was actually serious that Uber has some responsibility in allowing people with guns to get in to the cars. I posted provocatively it is true because I am tired of listening to solutions from haters of guns and haters of haters of guns. If we are really serious about trying to protect everyone from every possibility, then a company like Uber has to share in the issue. The shooter had a lot of ammo with him when he took the car. We know that the shooter had lots of issues. If we are serious about gun registration and catching the mentally ill with gun registration then we should do the same with those using the internet to get a ride to someplace to do something evil. I think we need to not blame but look and seek answers. If mentally ill people are tagged electronically and not allowed to buy guns, they should not be allowed to use the Internet either, in my mind. We have the technology to do this right. Quit blaming and start looking at the good science in the timeline. If Uber had declined to transport the driver then this would not have happened. It is time for the NRA and others who are involved in banning guns and promoting firearms in schools and what not then it is time to demand that responsible folks sit down and look at the steps that could have been taken to prevent this from happening. The focus is on all the wrong parts.
 
I believe the gun and magazines were in a duffel bag. Do you expect Uber drivers to carry portable X-ray machines so they can conduct TSA scans on prospective passengers?
 
Uber has no responsibility here I don’t think.
But since they don’t want 19yo people to own guns, maybe they’re not old
Enough to take ride service.

As far as the police response goes: I don’t even know what to think anymore. I feel the sheriffs response must have been wrong, even if it was done by the book. The system we had in place, the trillions spent so these things won’t happen... all failed us
 
Aquila, I believe that what needs to come out of the Parkland Active Shooter investigation is a broader understanding of the solutions that need to be explored to better deal with Active Shooters in the future. Everything I have seen on this so far is narrow and not inclusive of all the factors apparent in the timeline. Uber is obvious as it is the first link in the chain. I am an ardent supporter of the Second Amendment. The leadership in this debate needs to be directed to communications including social media, which includes Uber. Our legislators, community leaders, Law Enforcement, communications infrastructure builders, 911 systems designers, handheld communications makers like Motorola all need to be included in the discussion and solutions. The time line tells us what links need to be corrected.
 
Aquila, to be direct there are wands available that would have disclosed the guns and ammunition in the duffel bag. These are not regulated and not as costly as a Glock 19. The training is easy and with the proper notification would have disclosed this threat much earlier. These handheld units can be very effective.
 
Thomas Clarke said:
Aquila, I believe that what needs to come out of the Parkland Active Shooter investigation is a broader understanding of the solutions that need to be explored to better deal with Active Shooters in the future. Everything I have seen on this so far is narrow and not inclusive of all the factors apparent in the timeline. Uber is obvious as it is the first link in the chain. I am an ardent supporter of the Second Amendment. The leadership in this debate needs to be directed to communications including social media, which includes Uber. Our legislators, community leaders, Law Enforcement, communications infrastructure builders, 911 systems designers, handheld communications makers like Motorola all need to be included in the discussion and solutions. The time line tells us what links need to be corrected.
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Thomas Clarke said:
Aquila, to be direct there are wands available that would have disclosed the guns and ammunition in the duffel bag. These are not regulated and not as costly as a Glock 19. The training is easy and with the proper notification would have disclosed this threat much earlier. These handheld units can be very effective.
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So you want to turn all Uber drivers into unsworn law enforcement officers? And what are they supposed to do if the magic wand pings on something -- demand that the passenger empty his/her luggage on the street and empty his/her pockets or purse on the hood of the car? Those wands don't know if they're detecting a gun in my right front pocket or the mass of keys and pocket change I usually carry. All they know is "metal."

So the wand pings -- what authority does the Uber driver have to do anything? We all love the TSA, don't we? If Uber drivers start going all TSA agent on us, they'll just drive business to Lyte or back to regular taxis. If they do happen to get a shooter on his/her way to a school, trying to do anything is just asking to get an Uber driver added to the victim count.

IMHO, asking Uber drivers to start screening passengers is several orders of magnitude dumber than arming teachers (which I support)
 
Aguila Blanca said:
Wherever did you hear that? I've been an architect for over 40 years and a licensed building official for 25 years. I've lost track of how many school projects I've been involved in, either as an architectural specifier and code resource, or as the code official. I've NEVER heard of "fire doors" that close automatically and lock people out. First off -- the exterior doors on any building aren't "fire doors." Second -- they need to open to get people out in case of a fire. They probably have normal closers on them, but if they were unlocked before a fire alarm they'll stay unlocked after a fire alarm. If they were locked from the outside before a fire alarm, they'll stay locked from the outside after a fire alarm.
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Don't know where you were doing all of that, but it ain't been around here. The fire doors are not the exterior doors, they are generally inside the exterior doors or in hallways leading to the exterior doors. They are generally always open and most folks don't notice them. They cannot be locked from the inside, even when closed(think panic bars), like most commercial exits and are generally held open for travel in both directions, by magnetic catches that automatically release when the fire alarm goes off. This is tested every time a school does a fire drill along with the time it takes to get the students effectively outta the building. The alarm system in our school has sensors on the firedoors and will give us a code(and a alarm) if and when there is a failure in the firedoor system. There are also consequences if there are items in the way that will impede those doors from automatically closing(and locking) if and when the alarm goes off. They are specifically designed to get folks out, and not let them back in during a fire or other lockdown. They are a tool that can also be used to prevent entry between other areas in the building by an active shooter. We can close specific firedoors from the alarm control panel to do so. That said, most exterior doors on school buildings are also locked from the inside during normal school hours. Again, panic bars allow folks to go out(it's code, like any commercial building), but lock behind them so no one can get in. While a SRO would have a key/swipe for those doors, they may or may not have it for the firedoors. I'm not saying this is why the deputy didn't go in. But it is how it works.


Aguila Blanca said:
He retired, after more than 30 years on the force. How do you figure he lost his pension?
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He resigned with enough years to qualify for retirement. According to his superior...
The sheriff’s office opened an internal investigation into Peterson after seeing video of the school and after interviewing witnesses and Peterson himself. Israel suspended Peterson without pay on Thursday morning, he said, and Peterson then chose to resign. Because the deputy had enough time with the force to meet the requirements of retirement, Israel said he “resigned slash retired.”
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I was mistaken, I was told he lost his pension. Actually, He will get $52-70,000 a year plus the taxpayers will cover half his medical insurance premiums till he dies.
 
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