Hi there , I'm new to the site. I recently came across a pair of 20mm mk bullets that look pretty old and I had some questions. I found these buried under a bunch of clocks in an old box wrapped in newspaper. I'm not sure if they are dangerous are not but 1 of them looks live to me. I wanted to know how to handle them and if they are live or not. Of the 2 one has a hole in it and the other does not. They are about 7 inches in length. Where are these from? Are these collectible? I'm pretty sure they are from either different countries or makers. One has marking on bottom of the shell the other doesnt also the tips are different color. Any info would help thanks.
Old 20mm mk Bullets found need info
- Thread starter whitman75
- Start date
Mike Irwin
Staff
In the first picture, the top one, the one with holes in the case, is a training dummy. It's inert.
The second one?
I'm not 100% sure, but that one looks like it could be a live round.
You need to be careful with that one.
Edit in -
My mistake, they are both 20x102 Vulcan shells of post WW II vintage.
The second one?
I'm not 100% sure, but that one looks like it could be a live round.
You need to be careful with that one.
Edit in -
My mistake, they are both 20x102 Vulcan shells of post WW II vintage.
I have a few of these and as Mike stated, the 1st. one is a training round and I have other calibers that are drilled in this manner.
Now then, the second one should be considered fully loaded, both in the case and projectile. On the unloaded ones that I have, you can unscrew the tip on the projectile where there is a cavity, I assume for holding powder or whatever they put in them. I know what I would do with the loaded one but might suggest you bury, throw it in the river or take it to the police. Just don't know how stabile this one might be. I know a fella who is informed about this stuff.
As far as collector values, I'd say it would not be worth your time, effort or safety factor. ......
Be Safe !!!
Now then, the second one should be considered fully loaded, both in the case and projectile. On the unloaded ones that I have, you can unscrew the tip on the projectile where there is a cavity, I assume for holding powder or whatever they put in them. I know what I would do with the loaded one but might suggest you bury, throw it in the river or take it to the police. Just don't know how stabile this one might be. I know a fella who is informed about this stuff.
As far as collector values, I'd say it would not be worth your time, effort or safety factor. ......
Be Safe !!!
Clifford L. Hughes
New member
Whitman75:
Call you local police department and they will send out trained explosive experts to dispose of what looks like a live round.
Semper Fi.
Gunnery sergeant
Clifford L. Hughes
USMC Retired
Call you local police department and they will send out trained explosive experts to dispose of what looks like a live round.
Semper Fi.
Gunnery sergeant
Clifford L. Hughes
USMC Retired
Last edited:
Contact the police and with a bit of luck they will panic, close the schools, evacuate the county, and send twenty SWAT teams. The governor will demand at least the death penalty for the terrorist who had those dangerous nuclear explosives, etc.
Fun. Fox and MSNBC will be ranting about it for weeks.
Jim
Fun. Fox and MSNBC will be ranting about it for weeks.
Jim
The LAST thing you want to do is call the local police, for all the reasons stated above. That would be truly foolish. The training round has an inert projectile, and even if loaded with a live primer, it is not dangerous to you. Hey, these things were made tough and expected to withstand lots of tough treatment. If you're worried about it, bury it in a deep hole or throw it off a bridge. No need to make a federal case out of it...literally!
Mike Irwin
Staff
There are two rounds.
One is a training round. Those generally had either a blind "primer pocket" or a hollow recess.
The other round is NOT a training round.
It appears to be live, and could very well contain an explosive projectile.
Contacting the local police, explaining to them that it was found in a box of junk, origin unknown, and asking for assistance/advice is a fairly prudent thing to do.
This round won't go off on its own (or at least it shouldn't) but it shouldn't be handled and absolutely should not be dropped.
Burying it and/or throwing it off a bridge into a waterway would be the height of irresponsible.
One is a training round. Those generally had either a blind "primer pocket" or a hollow recess.
The other round is NOT a training round.
It appears to be live, and could very well contain an explosive projectile.
Contacting the local police, explaining to them that it was found in a box of junk, origin unknown, and asking for assistance/advice is a fairly prudent thing to do.
This round won't go off on its own (or at least it shouldn't) but it shouldn't be handled and absolutely should not be dropped.
Burying it and/or throwing it off a bridge into a waterway would be the height of irresponsible.
Mike Irwin
Staff
Jonny,
Are you sure that's an inert projectile? I can't find anything on the web telling me what an inert projectile looks like for the 20x102.
Are you sure that's an inert projectile? I can't find anything on the web telling me what an inert projectile looks like for the 20x102.
Gunplummer
New member
Give it to the cops. I don't know where you other paranoid people live, but around here that kind of find is common. Pennsylvania: Land of the Veterans is where I live. It is not out of the ordinary to see a tiny article in the paper about a couple of grenades or shells that were found in an attic and had to be disposed of.
dreamweaver
New member
there are over 30 types of ammo for the vulcan, from a dozen manufacturers in the world.
the "live " round looks to be a practice round, possibly a practice tracer. so, live, but not explosive. i'm basing this on what looks to be a pressed in aluminum nose on the projectile.
give me the complete markings on the bottom of he case and i can tell you what it is. maybe.
the "live " round looks to be a practice round, possibly a practice tracer. so, live, but not explosive. i'm basing this on what looks to be a pressed in aluminum nose on the projectile.
give me the complete markings on the bottom of he case and i can tell you what it is. maybe.
Are you saying that some of these noses were pressed in rather than being threaded. I ask this because I have two, that are threaded. If so, looks like they made these in a variety of projectiles. .....
Not too far from here, is and old Army Ordanance Depot and the folks in that community are always finding this stuf, big and small. Sadly, some have been found in homes of retired workers and long forgotten. The local LEO's are always being called on these and they sometimes call in a dealer friend of mine, for an opinion.
Be Safe !!!
dreamweaver
New member
exactly. the threaded ones are generally live (explosive etc). the pressed in were were not. live fire w/o the incendiary
Mike Irwin
Staff
"I don't know where you other paranoid people live, but around here that kind of find is common."
Yep. And sometimes, it doesn't end well.
Late 1970s, early 1980s, a couple of kids in Harrisburg found what they apparently thought was a practice grenade or a toy. IIRC it killed two of them and wounded two others.
Someone had brought it back from World War II or Korea, and it was later thrown out in the trash.
Yep. And sometimes, it doesn't end well.
Late 1970s, early 1980s, a couple of kids in Harrisburg found what they apparently thought was a practice grenade or a toy. IIRC it killed two of them and wounded two others.
Someone had brought it back from World War II or Korea, and it was later thrown out in the trash.
dreamweaver
New member
mike isn't kidding about these rounds.
many were loaded with red thermite, some with white phosphorous and other nasty stuff.
there is a particular round that had a ball being at the base of the projectile. when the round hits the target the ball bearing continues fwd and sets the fuse on the secondary charge. these were used for light armor and ballistic aluminum.
point is, if you were to drop one on a hard surface.............
all of these rounds should be handled as if unstable.
jmho
tom
many were loaded with red thermite, some with white phosphorous and other nasty stuff.
there is a particular round that had a ball being at the base of the projectile. when the round hits the target the ball bearing continues fwd and sets the fuse on the secondary charge. these were used for light armor and ballistic aluminum.
point is, if you were to drop one on a hard surface.............
all of these rounds should be handled as if unstable.
jmho
tom
Here are 4 different factory dummy rounds with projectiles very similar to that of the OP. Mine have been painted a few different colors to simulate different loadings in training. Factories do not load dummy rounds with anything but inert projectiles.
And sorry to say, but here in my part of SE-PA, our police know very little about the ammo they carry, let alone any type of foreign or military ordnance. Only a fool would invite the local police, or even their appointed "experts" into their home to examine and remove an item that has been sitting safely in their house for many years. Their reaction is always to cordon off the neighborhood and do a thorough search for any other "dangerous" items. Military ordnance was made to withstand rough, wartime treatment, it is not that sensitive. Invite them to your house to help...not me.
And sorry to say, but here in my part of SE-PA, our police know very little about the ammo they carry, let alone any type of foreign or military ordnance. Only a fool would invite the local police, or even their appointed "experts" into their home to examine and remove an item that has been sitting safely in their house for many years. Their reaction is always to cordon off the neighborhood and do a thorough search for any other "dangerous" items. Military ordnance was made to withstand rough, wartime treatment, it is not that sensitive. Invite them to your house to help...not me.
Mike Irwin
Staff
'but here in my part of SE-PA, our police know very little about the ammo they carry, let alone any type of foreign or military ordnance."
They don't need to.
They just need to know who to call.
In years past, police in Pennsylvania called the Army EOD unit that was stationed at Letterkenny. I don't know if they still have one at Letterkenny or not.
Once again, we're talking about proper disposal of possible live munitions, which does not include burying them or chucking them into a river.
As has been proven time and time again, buried or submersed munitions can remain live and dangerous for well over 100 years. Every few years someone digs up a live shell from the Civil War and it goes off.
And munitions from World War I and World War II are a constant threat in Europe.
They don't need to.
They just need to know who to call.
In years past, police in Pennsylvania called the Army EOD unit that was stationed at Letterkenny. I don't know if they still have one at Letterkenny or not.
Once again, we're talking about proper disposal of possible live munitions, which does not include burying them or chucking them into a river.
As has been proven time and time again, buried or submersed munitions can remain live and dangerous for well over 100 years. Every few years someone digs up a live shell from the Civil War and it goes off.
And munitions from World War I and World War II are a constant threat in Europe.
overkill0084
New member
Worth noting, 20mm ammo designed to be used in the M-61 Vulcan cannons is electrically primed, not percussion. If it is indeed a live round, bear this in mind and do not expose it to static electricity. Get it inspected by an EOD troop to verify what it actually is.
Sure...I'm sure you guys are right and I will defer to your obvious wisdom and expertise on this issue...as I completely disagree. I will continue to watch and read about police "EOD experts" saving neighborhoods as they remove from homes "dangerous" items that anyone with any experience knows are inert/dummy training devices. Keep in mind that police personnel deal with these issues, military EOD are rarely called for these types of things.
Gunplummer
New member
Right on time, there was a small article in our local news paper this week. Ordinance found in Allentown. The Bomb Squad picked it up, no big deal. It happens all the time around here. There were two dynamite factories with in a 30 mile radius of me and a little farther north an old impact area that is now a state park. The cops usually don't get out of hand, but the fire departments do sometimes. Liston to the people here and give it to the cops. A lot of that stuff gets unstable with age.