Officer: Traffic stop lacked 'professional courtesy'

WC-
Is the glass half empty or half full?

I mean, for the sake of argument here, lets assume we have the whole story. Who should we be talking about the cop that demanded special treatment or the cop that was colorblind to blue; in the way Capt Charlie expresses it? For my money, if it went down as reported, Grube gets high marks in my book. That's who the story should be about. Well done, Officer Grube!

Rich
 
Wildcard:

What I'm about to say should not be taken as a "cops are bad" statement. It should be taken as a "bad cops are bad" statement.

I've met quite a few of them over the last couple years, and by and large they strike me as people doing their jobs properly.

But Brown's expectation of royal treatment that he goes so far as to put in writing gives his brethren, and himself, a severe black eye.

It isn't that I'm necessarily expecting each and every cop to treat others exactly like any other citizen.

If I meet somebody on the street (or on here) and somehow the conversation gets to physical chemistry I'm going to treat that somebody with a lot more skepticism than I am the guy who works next to me here in my office.

I'm sure every profession is like that. Doctors probably get little favors that others don't from other doctors.

"Professional courtesy" is everywhere. I doubt it's possible to behave any other way.

But I think Brown crossed the line between "anticipating a professional courtesy" and "demanding special treatment" when he WROTE that complaint.

Not only was it an affront to most decent ordinary people, but he applied a slap to his own face IN WRITING.

Arrogant AND stupid.
 
Stories like this one and others I have heard first hand from officers in NY only reinforce the fact that LEOs will always consider themselves superior to citizens and above the law. Sorry, but I cannot give unquestioned trust to any group who believes the law does not apply to them, be they politicians or LEOs.

If LEOs want people to trust and respect them then they should clean up their act. ZERO tolerance for corruption with corruption being the useo ftheir office for any service not in line with their duty. Plenty of people chastise muslims for not turning on the criminals in their society while at the same time we have a LEO society that considerres itself separate and above from the law. We ahve had enough cop corruption in NY that has been known and accepted to back this up. I lived in a town in AR many years ago where it was open knowledge that the sheriff had his own pot crops yet no officers turned on him. I have seen gun weilding off duty drunk officers held up by their buddies and carried along when a CCW holder woudl be striped of his permit. I knew a cop stopped for doing in excess of 105 mph yet he was let go with a slap upside the head and a warning.

As long as officers participate in and turn a blind eye to corruption I will never put my faith in them.
 
Musketeer-
There were TWO cops involved here. Did you even read how Grube handled it? If so, how can you paint the entire profession as being cut from the same cloth as Brown?

I'm sorry, but that strikes me as a conclusion is search of a story.
Rich
 
We know the driver's a moron from his complaint and statements of Birthright.
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I don't think "we know" that at all. Have "we" ever met him? As I said before, Brown was pulled over by a person he saw as a junior officer. Brown was with his family. Brown most likely has a large ego and is used to getting respect. Brown was probably dressed down a bit. Brown may even have been rude, at which point doing him any favors would likely go out the window, if he was a cop or not. To regain some of his lost pride Brown filed a pointless complaint that he almost certainly knew would go nowhere but might annoy Grube, who really did everything he was professionally required to do. He could have done more but he was under no obligation to do so. Brown was capable of taking care of himself.

I wouldn't dream of filing a formal complaint for a lack of "professional courtesy". I'd be embarrassed to tears to do so.
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100% agreed, If that got back to my chain of command, well, I would get a long Arse chewing by everyone in it at best.
 
Sounds like Officer Grube did honor to his oath, his Department and himself.

Sounds like Complainant Brown is a braying jackass who needs to go sit in the time-out corner. He clearly does not play nicely with others.

I'm reminded of a time on the Merritt Parkway in Connecticut late on a Sunday night. Dad, a federalista at the time, is piloting the Chevy Impala wagon back home at great dispatch with five somnolent kids in the back and wife at his side. Trooper lights him up. Dad makes sure to slide his credentials along with his driver's license out the window, and casually comments how, well, "being in law enforcement as you are . . . "

Without skipping a beat, the trooper cranes his neck into this scene of domestic bliss and deadpans, "On duty tonight, are we, Mr. James?"

Having properly deflated the Feeb, the Trooper actually let him off with a warning.

:D
 
As I said before, Brown was pulled over by a person he saw as a junior officer. Brown was with his family. Brown most likely has a large ego and is used to getting respect. Brown was probably dressed down a bit. Brown may even have been rude, at which point doing him any favors would likely go out the window, if he was a cop or not. To regain some of his lost pride Brown filed a pointless complaint that he almost certainly knew would go nowhere but might annoy Grube, who really did everything he was professionally required to do.
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OK, you're right. He isn't a moron. ;)
OK, they were both acting reasonably and it's only the LEO bashers that have it wrong.

I swear, sometimes I can't win for losing! :D
Rich
 
I have to say that I am not against, some, professional courtesy. I understand it if a police officer is a little more lenient with someone who he knows, or is family, or whatever. This is just practical reality. If I was a LEO (and I am not) and I, by some freak occurrence, pulled over my grandmother for going 80 in a 55 I would not ticket her. Sorry. Further, if I pulled over another officer for an offense that I might normally have reserved the option of writing a warning for I would cut him or her a break too.


What I would not do is let other cops slide on DUI, assault and battery, etc. Oftentimes I will ask a buddy of mine if he has ever seen another officer get too aggressive (obviously so) in an arrest. He has related incidents where kicks or punches were delivered after a particularly obnoxious and violent person was detained. Of course, that is human nature--but so is hitting a cop when you are being aggressively detained. I often ask him whether he sought a warrant for battery, or arrested the cop on the spot? "Yeah right" is the usual response. Why the double standard? That is the kind of professional courtesy that annoys me, not the occasional warning on speeding.

Greg
 
You know, I run traffic everyday just about when I'm on duty. As many cars as I stop for various violations, I run into just about everyone. The truth of the matter is, off duty officers NEVER ask for courtesy. In fact, many times I've written an officer, and later on they appear in court in uniform due to being on duty or what not, and are paying the ticket... I walk up to them and say "Hey sir, you didn't ID yourself?" And they simply say "Well I don't expect courtesy..." So I explain "Well neither do I, but I do ID myself to say there are weapons in the vehicle..etc."

Now you know who DOES ask? Judges, teachers, politicians, and MOST of all, military, ex and current. Especially dependents of those in the service. I always am handed their dependent military ID card instead of a driver's license. I say "Sir, can you please hand me your driver's license instead of this?" and their response "Well can't you cut me a break because of that?" This happens almost on a weekly basis for me. I run into it so often, I am no longer surprised.

And Musketeer, by your silly definition and prejudices, I should not trust ANY citizen and should abhor all people because well, due to my job I run into a citizen who lies and breaks laws everyday. Actually, I run into many. Sorry Musketeer, but your cop-bashing, anti-govt, tin foil hat wearing attitude is absurd. To say "As long as there are any LEOs out there I will not trust the whole profession" is no different than me saying "Musketeer must be a felon because less than 5% of the population in his state commit felonies."

But oh wait, as an LEO I have to treat everyone equally. This must not be a requirement of being a regular citizen. My parents raised me to believe all people are created equal. I wish more parents properly raised their kids. :rolleyes:
 
I treat everyone i stop or have dealings with - "professional courtesy."

Yet another lame attempt by wildcard to cast a disparaging light on law enforcement...... yawn.

12-34hom.
 
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Regardless of whether he was a police officer or not, most cops won't be dickwads and after explained the situation, will most likely let them be on their way to make it home okay. At most a warning. Doing a background check and prolonging the situation is just straight up a dick move. Screw politics in this situation, and it's not even professional courtesy, it's common courtesy.
 
Any of us who have not received more breaks from LEO's than hassles needs to question their approach to the situation.

OS and 12-34:
Your assessment of the vast majority of Traffic Stops fits perfectly with my rather extensive experience....in my younger years, God made my buy a 911 Porsche. You don't rack up 131 points against your license in 3 years without some LE interaction. :eek:
Rich
 
There is a third possibility here. Both officers could have been rude and horse's patooties.

I have recieved courtesy from some officers due to my military status at the time. However, I didnt ask for any. The officers usually spotted the DoD Decal on my vehicle and asked. I was also courteous and when asked if I knew why I was being stopped told the truth. Every time I have been stopped by an officer I was guilty of the infraction. I did have an officer try to bust my chops onetime, he must have had a bad day at home. His partner put the stop to it PDQ and told him to go sit back in the car. I can say that at all my stops the officers have been courteous and respectful with the exception of that one officer, but that was handled by his partner.
 
If we read between the lines on this story, I think it is clear that the Sgt. was already aggravated his vehicle was acting up and he was trying to get his family home safely and quickly.
In this situation, he as well as anyone pulled over, would not be happy if the cop did anything but look at his license and send him on his way. After all he was in a hurry; he knew his electrical system was failing. Notice he wasn’t pulled over for speeding, though.

If I put myself in Browns position, I can understand his anxiety and aggravation. However, I don’t understand his complaint.

I know most civilians, like me, here who have been pulled over can probably remember instances where the cop was good enough to give you a verbal warning and send you on your way. This is what I would have hoped for in this situation, However, more times than not, when pulled over, the officer takes my license back to his car to check me out. I am sure this is routine and part of a traffic stop procedure.

With that said, I would be willing to bet that the average guy in this situation would also be aggravated and a smaller percentage of them would also file some type of complaint against the officer as stupid as it may have been.

Let’s talk about professional courtesy. I wonder if a civilian had filed the complaint would the officer have called them to try and resolve the issue unofficially. No way.
I think Sgt. Brown WAS extended professional courtesy by his fellow officer with the phone call.

In my opinion professional courtesy would also include writing the citation and letting me get on the road as quickly as possible before my electrical system failed. And if you really want to be nice, escort me to a safe place. But should I be upset because the cop did his job, HECK NO!
I would be happy if I didn’t get a lecture AND a ticket. (One or the other, please)

I travel from one end of Texas to the other regularly, if you live here you know that spans over 800 miles. And I will admit I have been pulled over many times. Every time I was breaking the law and the stop was justified. Maybe, it is just Texas, but I have never been treated disrespectfully or unprofessionally by any officer.
 
Maybe its just Texas but i have never ben treated disrespectfully or unprofessionally by any officer.
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That's the way it should be.

After reading your last post it reminded me of Sammy Haggars little diddy - I can't drive 55....:)

12-34hom.
 
Funny Professional Courtesy Story

Guys,

A few years ago my car was in the shop and I was given a loaner car. I was driving down the road when I noticed police lights behind me. The deputy asked me for my license, which I quickly realized I had left at the VW shop when they asked to copy it for their records (when they gave me the loaner). I happen to a lawyer, and I had one of the Assistant Solicitor's cards in my wallet. This Solicitor used to work in my office, and is an acquaintance of mine. I meekly explained the situation to the deputy, but showed him the Solicitor's card and said that he was a friend of mine and said he would vouch for me if the officer wanted to call him (100% bluff). Basically I was insinuating that he could write me a ticket, but the Solicitor would surely toss it (1,000,000% bluff). The officer told me that the Solicitor was a buddy of his too, and let me off with a warning.

Funny postscript: After he indicated to me that he wasn't going to write me up for speeding, failure to show license, etc, I stupidly told him that I had recently bragged to my boss that I had never gotten a speeding ticket (still true). The deputy, annoyed, said "HEY, I CAN STILL WRITE YOU ONE IF THA...." I was like, "Uh, I'll shut-up. Have a nice day.":D
 
nscale said:
Maybe, it is just Texas, but I have never been treated disrespectfully or unprofessionally by any officer.
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I've been pulled over before and its never been a bad experience.

And yes, it is normal procedure to check your license, tag, insurance all in the patrol car. Some of us have computers in the car to check them with, others use the radio and have dispatch do it. Either way, its just safer and more logical to sit back in the car.
 
Officer Brown should be eliminated from the police force, and any benefits/pension should be null and void.

Office Grube should get an accomodation.
 
Human courtesy

Capt's right, plain old human courtesy was called for here. Police should have free tows or something especially when there are kids aboard. I can hear it now, Dad he was a policeman too, why didn't he help us? Bad PR. I hope I never meet Officer Brown.
 
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