Now I'm Really Hot at Remington - A Rant

Get a grip Wallew! I never said anything about dropping my drawers and bending over for the antis. I'm just pointing out a fact of life for manufacturers in this day and age of the product liability lawsuit. If you don't cover every stinking little detail that could be construed as negligence, your are in deep doo doo. If a sharp lawyer can get a multi-million dollar award from McDonalds for a dimbulb who burns her thighs with hot coffee after placing the cup between her legs, it will not take much to convince a brain dead jury to decide against the evil gun company. How much money have gun owners donated to the legal funds of the different firearm manufacturers? I'll bet not enough to pay for a free consult with an attorney. Tell me, how can one firearm manufacturer fight the government over a "problem with our legal system" when 80 million gun owners can't seem to do anything about it? There is no law requiring driving lights on cars yet GM has them. Additionally, there is no requirement for side impact airbags in cars yet many cars have them. Why? Product liability lawsuits. My .02 worth.
 
I don't know enough about the new Rem system to comment.

I can say, however, that I am entirely behind gun manufacturers who provide optional locking systems on their firearms. My next handgun should be a Taurus.

We have enough enemies, indeed. I'm holding my fire until I see their colors.
 
If I may respectfully dissent, the mods that have me hot under the collar at Remington have very little to do with product liability lawsuits:

1. The magazine tube dimples on the non-Police 870 shotguns;

2. The non-sidesaddle compatible slides on the non-Police 870 shotguns; and

3. Remington's policy of not selling the shortened 870 Police-only slide to owners of non-Police 870 shotguns.

All of the above mods indicate to me that Remington does not believe us "regular citizens" need defensive capability in the form of an extended magazine tube or a sidesaddle -- not from a product liability standpoint. The integral locks and their "policy" (no matter how unsubstantial it is, it's still their official stance) on the "police sniper" rifles are just icing on the cake.

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Justin T. Huang, Esq.
late of Kennett Square, Pennsylvania


[This message has been edited by jthuang (edited November 01, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jthuang:

2. The non-sidesaddle compatible slides on the non-Police 870 shotguns; and
B][/quote]


Say what? I have a non Police Mod 870 ad I have a sidesaddle on it. It is only about 4 months old. When did this start?


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"Knowledge is a destination. Truth, the journey."
 
gun owners are doing the same thing anti-gunners do: bullying the industry....anti's sue them for control methods, we boycott them if they give in....

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speak now, or forever hold your peace
 
Ok I went and played with a Rem 700 with the new lock on it. It is placed on the side ofthe bold and is out of the way. Whoever said you had to reset it after every shot was either smoking some good stuff or just trying to get you pissed off. It is no different from the Taurus saftey. You unlock it and throw away the key. Never again to worry about it.

God people think before you blow up and yell for a boycott. THis is a nice feature if you ask me.

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"Knowledge is a destination. Truth, the journey."
 
I like the locks. You don't have to screw with a trigger lock when you want to lock it up when it's away from your safe. If you don't want it then unlock it and throw the key away as was suggested earlier.

George Hill,

AMEN!
 
Flaim,

On recent 870 Express and Wingmaster shotguns, the slide is too long to accommodate a six shell sidesaddle (the original model). You have to chop 1.75" off the stock slide to get it to clear the sidesaddle. I do not know if the 870 Marine Magnum suffers from this defect.

Remington makes a shortened slide for the 870 Police model only. I bought my dad a Remington 870, unknowing of Remington's PC crap, back in November of 1998. For Christmas, I wanted to get him a extended mag tube and sidesaddle. I found out that the Express slide was too long, so I called up Remington to order the shortened slide.

They wouldn't sell me the shortened slide unless I had an 870 Police shotgun. I did not know about their "policy" so I was stuck (told them outright that I needed the short slide for an Express, doh).

Tacstar (not Remington) solved this problem for us regular citizens. They now make a four shell sidesaddle which doesn't require any modification to the Express or Wingmaster slides. But all the same, it was Tacstar who had to come up with a solution -- Remington wouldn't sell me a shortened slide for use with a sidesaddle.

Note to all you 870 Express and Wingmaster users: a Surefire Responder will also solve the above problem, if you have $200-300 to blow on a tactical light.

Justin

------------------
Justin T. Huang, Esq.
late of Kennett Square, Pennsylvania
 
WHINERS!

There are half a dozen mfgs out there making after market Remington 870 slide grips in the shorter "Tootsie Roll" configuration.

Besides, whats the big deal about cutting off some the excess material on the one that comes with the gun? Literally a five minute job, even if you oil or varnish up the cut and finished end.

You want a shorter barrel on your rifle?
Got to a gunsmith and have him cut and recrown the damned thing.

Also, gun dealers are now REQUIRED to sell "Gun Saftey Locks" in any facility where civilian/over the counter sales are made.
ATF did this to us.
I know, becuase I just had to sign a document to this effect when I applied for my new FFL license.
Remington just made this easier for all of the dealers by including the lock with the gun.
NOTE: I am NOT saying that I like the idea of a lock on the Gun, I am not saying that the locks are any good because I have no personal experience with them. I am just saying qwitcherbitchin and get on with trying to SAVE our industry rather than ruining it.
Do something constructive, like come out with a drop in remington 870 trigger group without the lock.
Offer a "police" version of the 700 that you have cut, fluted and crowned yourself.

Anything but the whining...
Geez.
 
All it takes is money, Mad Dog. The idea is to get what you want from the factory without playing silly assed games to get it the way it should be. I don't have any 870's right now. I've spent my money on Win 1300's and a Benelli Nova, and a beater Mossberg 500 w/rifled barrel for deer hunting . Don't have a whole lot of use for shotguns anyway. I have several 700VSS and PSS's and a 40X, and the VSS's needed to have the barrels re-floated after you put a bipod on them. Nothing a rasp couldn't fix. I haven't played with the new Rems yet, can't say as I have any interest in them, not when I can get Model 70's for the same price. But for those who like the 700,confused though they may be :), they should be able to get it the way they want it without having to play themselves off as LEO's or pay outrageous, artificially inflated prices. Same reason Clintoon cutting off a bunch of FFL's pisses me off. It just jacks up the price. If you're gonna have a smith do all this silly work on a gun, might as well scrap the stock barrel, get a Mcmillan stock and a Kreiger, Obermeyer, or Pac-nor tube and get yourself a real tactical rifle. But now you're talking $1200+. And that defeats the whole purpose of the Remington, they're good enough for most and they were cheap. Hoplite lists 'em at $700($750 for the 20" barrel), plus most dealers are gonna get you for at least $20 plus shipping. So you're looking at $740-$800. I bought two of them six years ago for $500 per. Inflation? I doubt it. Semper Fi...Ken
 
I too would rather have a model 70. :D

The point of my last diatribe was to get people thinking about doing something FOR the industry, rather than help to drag it down.

I hate all of the BS about "police only" sales, and whatever other PC crap has to be done to stay in business.
The FACT is this:
Gun/weapon related businesses and pursuits are heavily regulated by the Feds and Local agencies, are subject to a lot of spurious lawsuits, and suffer from a generally bad perception in the eye of most of the public.

By increasing the number of people that are actively involved in promoting guns, creating new products, and otherwise assisting the industry, we become stronger and just that much more difficult to assault.
TFL is just such a positive example of one Citizen's quest to educate and serve the gunowners of America and the World. (Thanks, Rich!)

The reasons for rising weapons costs are not just inflationary. They have to do with the huge $$ needed to CYA when you get insurance for all of the liabilities involved with making and selling them.
My bet is that Remington actually kept their weapon costs DOWN by adding the locks and some of their other PC moves, thereby making them more litigation resistant and able to get insured at a much lower rate.

Granted, it SUCKS that we have to be witness to the decline of American civilization, but we can also be the ones that survive the end if we are united in our goals and beliefs.

Who knows what we can build from the ashes?
 
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