Norma 22lr Extra Long Range

[P35p]

BTW--I received notice from Midway USA that they have Eley's Ultra ELR ammo in stock--I ordered some of it to try out.

While I buy some things from midway usually ammunition isn't one of them. They have the Eley Ultra at championschoice at a substantial discount from midway. If you buy it by the case they have it down to $16.92 per box. By the individual box they get $18.75 a box.


I honestly don't shoot a lot of long range. Most of the 22lr I shoot is 50 to 100 yards and I seem to get my best accuracy out of ammunition that stays at or below the 1,100 fps speed. I've been lucky this year and am sitting on a bulk of Lapua and SK right now as well as about a half of case of R50.

 

[stagpanther]

I honestly don't shoot a lot of long range. Most of the 22lr I shoot is 50 to 100 yards and I seem to get my best accuracy out of ammunition that stays at or below the 1,100 fps speed. I've been lucky this year and am sitting on a bulk of Lapua and SK right now as well as about a half of case of R50.

Sounds like you're all set with good ammo choices. Shooting at 50 to 100 yds just doesn't interest me very much. Thanks for the tip of champion's choice.

 

[FrankenMauser]

Ordered some of the Eley "ULTRA Extreme Long Range".

Gonna see how it does. Might be useful for the "long bomb" local stages. (300-380 yd)
Probably a waste of money. $75+ for 3 boxes of 50.

 

[stagpanther]

Ordered some of the Eley "ULTRA Extreme Long Range".

Gonna see how it does. Might be useful for the "long bomb" local stages. (300-380 yd)
Probably a waste of money. $75+ for 3 boxes of 50.

They say it's subsonic. Mine should be here by Friday. I do want to try RWS's version--seems everyone has to have one. Be interesting to hear if any of them actually do anything better.

 

[P35p]

Sounds like you're all set with good ammo choices. Shooting at 50 to 100 yds just doesn't interest me very much. Thanks for the tip of champion's choice.

If you're looking for some Lapua Long Range, championschoice posted some this morning. They have just over a case left right now. Usually when they post the stuff it's gone in hours.

 

[stagpanther]

If you're looking for some Lapua Long Range, championschoice posted some this morning. They have just over a case left right now. Usually when they post the stuff it's gone in hours.

I have plenty of it left--thanks. It shoots "very good"--but not outstanding-- out of my 2 CZ's. But I still haven't been able to get out to 200+ yards due to heavy construction activity where I shoot, so who knows.

 

[stagpanther]

Here it is--Eley's Ultra. Specs are 40 gr @1100 fps. It looks like maybe a slightly higher angle round nose with stacked drive bands compared to the Lapua and Norma extreme range offerings. Looks a lot like Eley's High velocity hollow point--except without the hollow.

Interesting finish on the rim as well.

 

[stagpanther]

When I was looking up the R100 specs since I always shoot R50 I noticed they now list a long range RWS rimfire round they call the R Plus Long Range rated at 355 ms that also has the heavier 43gr bullet. Odd they used a Bergera in there promo advertisement for the round. Not sure how long they have produced it but it's the first time I had seen it.

I went out last night at dusk--here that's the time of day when winds are more likely to back off but is also more challenging in that it gets dark quickly, especially in the shade. Was able to set up at 170 yards since the longer range lanes are still closed. I shot Lapua long range, Eley's Ultra and Norma's Extreme--all of which did well and grouped right around MOA. Normally I do a "control check" to finish the session with Eley tenex; but decided to use some R-100 instead--it printed a ridiculously small 5 shot group compared to the others--I'd call it a fluke but I've seen it do that fairly often all the way out to 250 yards and beyond; provided there was little to no wind.

One thing that I've noticed that is kinda interesting when shooting the premium 22lr stuff is that the faster stuff does not necessarily mean flatter shooting.

 

[P35p]

Here it is--Eley's Ultra. Specs are 40 gr @1100 fps. It looks like maybe a slightly higher angle round nose with stacked drive bands compared to the Lapua and Norma extreme range offerings. Looks a lot like Eley's High velocity hollow point--except without the hollow.

Interesting finish on the rim as well.

According to Josh at Pursuit of Accuracy he believed this to be the same bullet that is used in the Eley Target and Club ammunition. Here is a link to the video and he gets into the bullet specs around 1:20 of the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pCQf1ZJXXw

 

[stagpanther]

I have the same stuff. I paid a whole lot more than $18 a box, too!

 

[P35p]

I have the same stuff. I paid a whole lot more than $18 a box, too!

I don't know how big their lots are but with only 3 digits for the lot number I would assume they make larger runs.

 

[FrankenMauser]

I have a match tomorrow (Saturday) which includes a "long bomb" stage.
Gonna try the stupidly expensive Norma Ultra Mega Extreme Insane Unreal Long Range on the sighting target and see if it is worth it. (Long Bomb official entry requires 50 rounds -- 5 attempts with 10 rounds. )

 

[stagpanther]

What distance is the ultra long bomb? Good luck and let us know--I'm fascinated by long distance 22lr shooting.

P35p--I watched Josh's test--actually it seemed to me the 150 yd groups were not all that bad, hard to tell from splattering on a plate. Most of these newer super duper Kinzal hypersonic rounds still seem to be flirting with just a tad above supersonic which goes transonic soon after leaving the muzzle as far as I can tell. RWS's Plus is only 10 to 20 fps faster than R 100 from what I can tell--but other factors may make it fly better. One thing left out of the discussion in Josh's test is the effect of bullet lubricants--I suspect they play a role in the overall equation. I've been shooting recently in 90 degree+ temperatures and some of the ammo I've used was obviously "sweating" the lubricant as I was loading them into the magazine. In my personal tests for what smells the best upon firing--RWS's lubricants were the best cologne-grade smelling IMO.

 

[P35p]

P35p--I watched Josh's test--actually it seemed to me the 150 yd groups were not all that bad, hard to tell from splattering on a plate. Most of these newer super duper Kinzal hypersonic rounds still seem to be flirting with just a tad above supersonic which goes transonic soon after leaving the muzzle as far as I can tell. RWS's Plus is only 10 to 20 fps faster than R 100 from what I can tell--but other factors may make it fly better. One thing left out of the discussion in Josh's test is the effect of bullet lubricants--I suspect they play a role in the overall equation. I've been shooting recently in 90 degree+ temperatures and some of the ammo I've used was obviously "sweating" the lubricant as I was loading them into the magazine. In my personal tests for what smells the best upon firing--RWS's lubricants were the best cologne-grade smelling IMO.

In reality most of the new long range ammunitions are only 10-20 fps faster than current offerings. I know that from the center-x that I usually shoot to Long Range which I have several bricks of and have tried, the difference on average is about 25 fps faster. The R50 I shoot seems to fall right in between the two. It's faster than the center-x but slower than the long range. While the Long Range shoots very well in my Bergara's I try to shoot ammunition that is subsonic as I almost always shoot with a suppressor.

The lubes and amount of lubes do make a difference. While most RWS R50 is lubed it isn't over lubed like they do some of their Rifle Match. I still have some old Geco Rifle Match made by RWS that has so much lube on the rounds they literally stick to your hands when trying to load them. I usually keep a micro fiber cloth around and will give the top of the bullets a quick wipe before shooting. The Center-x I shoot most of the time is lubed but not to extremes. When you clean your suppressor you can tell which ammos are heavily lubed as it builds up quickly in the suppressor.

 

[FrankenMauser]

What distance is the ultra long bomb? Good luck and let us know--I'm fascinated by long distance 22lr shooting.

Correction: I was mistaken. I thought this was happening at our practice matches *and* our regular matches. But it is only the practice matches. (A week ago.) So, I'll have some time to test this Norma ammo a bit before the real thing next month.

It isn't actually all that long. A distance had to be set at the beginning of the season (June), and 300 yards was chosen as a compromise, just in case we had to change to the alternate venue where that is the maximum possible range.
So, 300 yards.

Two formats, depending upon time available:
Primary: Five 10-round strings, fired in a rotation with other shooters. $10 buy-in per string. Best single string score is used for the day's scoring, and overall total is used for season scoring. Unlimited mulligans for $10 each. But the last string fired is the one that counts for the day's score. (I do not know how they're handling mulligans for season scoring, nor do I really care.)

Alternate, time limited: One to three 10-round strings for $10 buy-in. Buy as many mulligans as you want, until the MD cuts you off.

.22 LR only
Or air guns that meet NRL22 rules.

It was planned to be 10" round plates, but some of our better shooters showed that that size was too easy during testing. (Not me. )

Must call your target and hit to move on. But you do not have to move on. If you miss, you go back to the previous target.
8" target. 1 pt
6" target. 2 pts
4" target. 3 pts
Max possible is 27 points per string, I believe, and 135 pts for primary format daily total.

Highest score so far is 10, set in June, with an air gun that just stuck to the 8" target.
(Some of our guys should be able to get close to 20 pts, but June and July stages were very windy.)

Day-of the stage, the final round has two shooters 'racing' on two sets of plates, to be the first to hit the smallest target they can. But a miss sends you back to the 8" plate and you *must* fire all 10 shots. I still don't understand those rules fully, but it was set up to allow some strategy - like a dueling tree.
The same head-to-head format will be used for the season finale in December or January.

I've shot the targets and shot at that distance plenty of times; but I missed two months and I am just not that good (and always using questionable gear). So I will likely not be in the season finale. But I still want to have some fun with a small chance of winning a pot.

 

[stagpanther]

I've shot 22lr out to 350 yards--I found that even in perfectly calm conditions the slightest change in the rifle's balance from one shot to the next could throw the impact by 4" or more--almost like even batting an eyelash could throw the shot. I'd stick to the 6 and 8inch plates unless I felt I was really "on" and totally on top of both the gear and conditions. But I have zero experience with competitive shooting.

December or January finale? That cold air density I bet will confound those who dial in for summer conditions.

 

[stagpanther]

So, I'll have some time to test this Norma ammo a bit before the real thing next month.

I shot some tonight at 204 yards--at that distance it started showing significant efficiency advantage at velocity over the other ammo when it sailed clean over the target that I had centered for the other stuff.

I just watched Norma's promo video for the extreme and a new hunter cartridge. What caught my attention was the velocity numbers on their box--significantly different/faster than what's on my box. A bit of a mystery.

 

[FrankenMauser]

I think the early labels were a misprint. Seems to all be the higher velocity since then.

December or January finale? That cold air density I bet will confound those who dial in for summer conditions.

Indeed.
A shooter from Ohio was asking for some advice on acquiring and recording dope.
As part of our discussion, I showed him a few screenshots of my google drive directory, where I have spreadsheets full of dope for about 8 rifles. And, of course, a screenshot of some of the spreadsheets and what different colors/numbers/markers meant.

Files are named:
22 LR 30F or colder DOPE
22 LR 50F or warmer DOPE
22 LR HOT AS BALLS
22 LR GO HOME ITS TOO COLD (Jan/Feb 'highs below zero' dope)

(For 30-50 F, I look at the weather and just guess at which will be more appropriate.)

 

[Unclenick]

That bullet doesn't look too far different from the bullet in the old Federal Ultra-Match, other than the graphite color.

The bullet that has shot best from one of my rifles, including at a distance, is one I can't get anymore, so the few rounds I have left are hoarded for an emergency. You can see it on the right. Hard to believe Remington once knew how to make world-class 22 LR ammo. Forgotten knowledge now, alas.

 

[stagpanther]

The bullet that has shot best from one of my rifles, including at a distance, is one I can't get anymore, so the few rounds I have left are hoarded for an emergency. You can see it on the right. Hard to believe Remington once knew how to make world-class 22 LR ammo. Forgotten knowledge now, alas.

They also made some amazing rifles to shoot it. I can't remember the model number off the top of my head; but a friend found one in a family home attic that was rusted and molded over; it had a straight push-feed bolt type arrangement with a peep sight built in. I approached it as a lost-cause lark that was probably ruined but managed to get it cleaned and oiled pretty well. If I recall correctly it dated to around the WW2 era. I shot it at 50 yds using the peep sight and I was amazed how well it shot.