No pissing contests but what are the differences between the Kimbers and the Wilsons?
- Thread starter vmaam
- Start date
Both of these are fine guns and unless you get a lemon (which could happen with either), both will be reliable firearms.
My experience is limited to full size models - specifically a Wilson Service Grade Protector and two Kimber Custom Classics.
Here are my reviews:
Wilson Protector: beautifully finished (2 tone), wonderful fit. It is obvious a lot of effort goes into assembly of Wilson's pistols. When the slide is racked, it is so smooth it almost feels like it is on ball bearings (no joke). Trigger is the best I have ever felt on any gun, 4 lbs on my trigger pull scale, not a bit of creep. All sharp edges are dehorned. Nice checkered front strap. Excellent night sights. It is the most accurate handgun I have fired - at 50 feet a mag of ammo goes into about 2 inches, and this is freehand, not rested. I have had 2 problems with it. The first, I managed to crack one of the coco bolo grip panels while shooting. I called Wilsons, and in 3 days I received a replacement set in the mail free. The other problem was that I was having about one failure to feed out of every 100-150 rounds. The round partially went in the chamber but the slide would not close all the way. I sent it back to Wilsons and 3 days later I got it back, and have had no failure to feeds since. They said the recoil spring was too light, and replaced it. Overall I am very pleased with this gun. If you want to spend $1600-1800, I would recommend it.
Kimber Custom Classic: This is the basic model Kimber. It would be unfair to compare it to a Wilson that cost three times as much. However, the Kimber comes pretty close really. Certainly, the Wilson isn't three times better, though it is three times more expensive. The slide to frame fit on the Kimber is as good as Wilson's. The finish is not as attractive, but still very nice, kind of a dull black parkerized look. It is dehorned. The slide is not quite as smooth when you rack it. The trigger is excellent - 4 lbs, no creep, but I looked at about 10 and tested the triggers extensively before I found this one. It doesnt have night sites, but wouldnt expect this on a $600 1911, and the sights it does have are very nice. The magazine it comes with is cheap, and I threw it in my junk pile right away. It is accurate enough, close to the Wilson, though not quite as good, but certainly it can do 2-3 inch groups at 50 feet freehand. I have had no malfunctions with the two I have played with.
If you have a bunch of money you want to spend, and end up with the nicest gun money can buy, go for the wilson. If you want a plenty-nice gun and still have some money in your pocket, go for the Kimber.
My experience is limited to full size models - specifically a Wilson Service Grade Protector and two Kimber Custom Classics.
Here are my reviews:
Wilson Protector: beautifully finished (2 tone), wonderful fit. It is obvious a lot of effort goes into assembly of Wilson's pistols. When the slide is racked, it is so smooth it almost feels like it is on ball bearings (no joke). Trigger is the best I have ever felt on any gun, 4 lbs on my trigger pull scale, not a bit of creep. All sharp edges are dehorned. Nice checkered front strap. Excellent night sights. It is the most accurate handgun I have fired - at 50 feet a mag of ammo goes into about 2 inches, and this is freehand, not rested. I have had 2 problems with it. The first, I managed to crack one of the coco bolo grip panels while shooting. I called Wilsons, and in 3 days I received a replacement set in the mail free. The other problem was that I was having about one failure to feed out of every 100-150 rounds. The round partially went in the chamber but the slide would not close all the way. I sent it back to Wilsons and 3 days later I got it back, and have had no failure to feeds since. They said the recoil spring was too light, and replaced it. Overall I am very pleased with this gun. If you want to spend $1600-1800, I would recommend it.
Kimber Custom Classic: This is the basic model Kimber. It would be unfair to compare it to a Wilson that cost three times as much. However, the Kimber comes pretty close really. Certainly, the Wilson isn't three times better, though it is three times more expensive. The slide to frame fit on the Kimber is as good as Wilson's. The finish is not as attractive, but still very nice, kind of a dull black parkerized look. It is dehorned. The slide is not quite as smooth when you rack it. The trigger is excellent - 4 lbs, no creep, but I looked at about 10 and tested the triggers extensively before I found this one. It doesnt have night sites, but wouldnt expect this on a $600 1911, and the sights it does have are very nice. The magazine it comes with is cheap, and I threw it in my junk pile right away. It is accurate enough, close to the Wilson, though not quite as good, but certainly it can do 2-3 inch groups at 50 feet freehand. I have had no malfunctions with the two I have played with.
If you have a bunch of money you want to spend, and end up with the nicest gun money can buy, go for the wilson. If you want a plenty-nice gun and still have some money in your pocket, go for the Kimber.
The Kimber and the Wilson are not exactly in the same league with one another. The price differce is the first clue.
The Kimber is a fine pistol. I recommend it. (Especially if you are not experienced enough with 1911s to appreciate the difference. The money saved could buy a lot of range time, or other toys.)
For about a grand more (and up), the Wilsons are great pistols, on par with the finest customs, from what I have heard. Which for at least a grand more, they should be...
The Kimber is a fine pistol. I recommend it. (Especially if you are not experienced enough with 1911s to appreciate the difference. The money saved could buy a lot of range time, or other toys.)
For about a grand more (and up), the Wilsons are great pistols, on par with the finest customs, from what I have heard. Which for at least a grand more, they should be...
It's tough to do a fair comparison between Kimbers and Wilsons. I've owned enough of both to know what I want in a 1911. However, I'll try to give you a comparison between the two.
Kimbers:
Kimbers are production 1911's. Bang for the buck, they are among the best value 1911's on the market. Springfields are a better value. However, I do not care for the boxy feel of Springfields.
When shopping for a Kimber, DRY FIRE them! In my experiences, many Kimbers have creep in their triggers. I don’t know what level of experience you have with firearms and whether creep bothers you or not. Personally, I cannot tolerate any creep whatsoever. Out of 3 high end Kimbers I bought, all three were sent to pistol smiths for trigger work.
As I stated above, a Kimber is a production 1911. Yet, you get a high ride beavertail (that’s blended nicely), a quality trigger, and excellent slide to frame fit, and good accuracy. However, you do get a lousy magazine with it. Unless you get one of their CDP’s or Super Match, you do not get the 30 lpi front strap checkering.
Wilsons:
The Wilsons generally cost 3x more then the Kimbers. However, you also get a lot of hand fitting and outstanding customer service. Those two items cannot have a price tag placed upon them. With a Wilson, you also get high quality parts, excellent sights, 30 lpi checkering (on most models), tight slide to frame fit, outstanding accuracy, match barrel, nice gun rug, the best magazines on the market, and an informative video.
Once you buy a high end 1911, there’s no going back. Currently in my safes, I have 3 Wilson Combats (KZ-45, CQB, and Sentinel), 2 Les Baers, 1 Ed Brown, and 1 Colt Series 70. I sold all my Kimbers and Springfields. From over 15 1911’s, I’m now down to 7.
What works for me may not work for you. I demand the absolute best for my money no matter how much I spend. I get that with a Wilson Combat 1911.
Kimbers:
Kimbers are production 1911's. Bang for the buck, they are among the best value 1911's on the market. Springfields are a better value. However, I do not care for the boxy feel of Springfields.
When shopping for a Kimber, DRY FIRE them! In my experiences, many Kimbers have creep in their triggers. I don’t know what level of experience you have with firearms and whether creep bothers you or not. Personally, I cannot tolerate any creep whatsoever. Out of 3 high end Kimbers I bought, all three were sent to pistol smiths for trigger work.
As I stated above, a Kimber is a production 1911. Yet, you get a high ride beavertail (that’s blended nicely), a quality trigger, and excellent slide to frame fit, and good accuracy. However, you do get a lousy magazine with it. Unless you get one of their CDP’s or Super Match, you do not get the 30 lpi front strap checkering.
Wilsons:
The Wilsons generally cost 3x more then the Kimbers. However, you also get a lot of hand fitting and outstanding customer service. Those two items cannot have a price tag placed upon them. With a Wilson, you also get high quality parts, excellent sights, 30 lpi checkering (on most models), tight slide to frame fit, outstanding accuracy, match barrel, nice gun rug, the best magazines on the market, and an informative video.
Once you buy a high end 1911, there’s no going back. Currently in my safes, I have 3 Wilson Combats (KZ-45, CQB, and Sentinel), 2 Les Baers, 1 Ed Brown, and 1 Colt Series 70. I sold all my Kimbers and Springfields. From over 15 1911’s, I’m now down to 7.
What works for me may not work for you. I demand the absolute best for my money no matter how much I spend. I get that with a Wilson Combat 1911.
PT-Partners
New member
vmaam
As one who retails the Custom 1911 (Ed Brown, Wilson Combat, Novak, Les Baer and one man shops) and the Production 1911s (Springfield, Kimber and Colt). I get asked the same question as you have asked about once a week.
The best way to compare the two is this.
Kimber is the best Chevy out there
Wilson is a Rolls Royce period.
Both will do the job it is just how you want to get there.
If you research the archives of the Firing line and the 1911forum.com you will find the question you have asked listed several times and responded to in many ways. Mostly the comments say what has been posted above. Kimber is a production gun made at rate of 30 to 40 thousand a year. Wilson is custom gun made at a rate of 900 to 1000 a year ( I don't what to get into what is true "custom" here that would fill another ten threads). These figures came from the 1998 Shooting industry reports.
With that take the time and figure how one business spends multiple minutes to assemble a gun and how the other business spends multiple hours to build a gun.
Any custom gunsmith out there will tell you it takes about 40 man-hours to "build" a gun.
I recommend you go to the 1911 Forum (www.1911forum.com) and ask the same question. Many of the posters here hang out there but the majority of the folks on that forum are primarily 1911 afficionado.
I get complaints on Kimbers at a rate of 1 out of 5 to 7 guns. Mostly it is a mag or a MIM part braking. At a price of $600 to $700. So What. Call Kimber, get another or replace it with a better grade part for $30 or so. That is part of the production gun game. There have been about 7 to 8 hundred Kimbers pass through the retail operation I work in.
Wilson, the major complaint is the cost (not fit or function) and to justify the expense of the gun to the spouse. I had a couple of the grip emblems falling out of the grip. I did have a rear sight shift. The set screw was not locktited (made up a word here). Whether that was so the new owner could adjust for windage or a builder goof the problem was nothing. In two years I have had one gun returned as the owner was disatified with it. Wilson built him another. Never had a part break. There have been about 150 Wilson pass through the retail operation I own.
With Wilson, Yes, you pay for the name but Wilson Combat did not earn the reputation the company has by selling garbage and giving $#!+ customer service.
Kimber is the best buy out there for a production gun.
Wilson, You get what you pay for front end or back end.
Is the additional cost worth it. You the owner will answer that. Once you go forward and go custom whether it is a gun, knife, car, dress suit or whatever it is real tough to go back.
Hope this helps with your quest for information
Be safe and keep the brass flying
Terry Peters
http://www.pt-partners.com
As one who retails the Custom 1911 (Ed Brown, Wilson Combat, Novak, Les Baer and one man shops) and the Production 1911s (Springfield, Kimber and Colt). I get asked the same question as you have asked about once a week.
The best way to compare the two is this.
Kimber is the best Chevy out there
Wilson is a Rolls Royce period.
Both will do the job it is just how you want to get there.
If you research the archives of the Firing line and the 1911forum.com you will find the question you have asked listed several times and responded to in many ways. Mostly the comments say what has been posted above. Kimber is a production gun made at rate of 30 to 40 thousand a year. Wilson is custom gun made at a rate of 900 to 1000 a year ( I don't what to get into what is true "custom" here that would fill another ten threads). These figures came from the 1998 Shooting industry reports.
With that take the time and figure how one business spends multiple minutes to assemble a gun and how the other business spends multiple hours to build a gun.
Any custom gunsmith out there will tell you it takes about 40 man-hours to "build" a gun.
I recommend you go to the 1911 Forum (www.1911forum.com) and ask the same question. Many of the posters here hang out there but the majority of the folks on that forum are primarily 1911 afficionado.
I get complaints on Kimbers at a rate of 1 out of 5 to 7 guns. Mostly it is a mag or a MIM part braking. At a price of $600 to $700. So What. Call Kimber, get another or replace it with a better grade part for $30 or so. That is part of the production gun game. There have been about 7 to 8 hundred Kimbers pass through the retail operation I work in.
Wilson, the major complaint is the cost (not fit or function) and to justify the expense of the gun to the spouse. I had a couple of the grip emblems falling out of the grip. I did have a rear sight shift. The set screw was not locktited (made up a word here). Whether that was so the new owner could adjust for windage or a builder goof the problem was nothing. In two years I have had one gun returned as the owner was disatified with it. Wilson built him another. Never had a part break. There have been about 150 Wilson pass through the retail operation I own.
With Wilson, Yes, you pay for the name but Wilson Combat did not earn the reputation the company has by selling garbage and giving $#!+ customer service.
Kimber is the best buy out there for a production gun.
Wilson, You get what you pay for front end or back end.
Is the additional cost worth it. You the owner will answer that. Once you go forward and go custom whether it is a gun, knife, car, dress suit or whatever it is real tough to go back.
Hope this helps with your quest for information
Be safe and keep the brass flying
Terry Peters
http://www.pt-partners.com
PT-Partners
New member
vmaam
It suddenly dawned on my coffee/sleep starved brain something you have a "bug" about. Pure money. Do you want to spend money or not. You have mentioned several times 3 times the cost of a Kimber.
(If you notice the date/time of this post Yes, I have no life, I just got off of my other full time job, full-time LEO in Dallas, after one long overtime shift.)
First question I would ask is what is the gun for. Target, protection, both, plinking, or what. If it is for primary self defense or protection add this to the mix. What is you life worth. Personally considering my other full time job I want the best or most reliable piece of equipment I can get or allowed by department policy and law.
Second question: I would figure how much I have to spend.
Now for some more thoughts on spending the available money:
If you are going to compare a $600 Kimber to a $1700 Wilson you forgot to add the options to the Kimber or subtract the same from the Wilson to get some kind of comparison. Other than that there is no comparison.
Right now you are trying to compare as I have mentioned before two total different items other than they are 1911.
At least when you add the cost of checkering the front strap, protective coating (armortuff/hardchrome), tactical dehorn, tritium sights, steel checkered mainspring housing instead of plasic as on the Kimber, then add the cost of you (your time and experience), one of your friends (if you trust him) or a reputable gun smith (who will warrant the work) installing all of the above plus a reliability package (Not all kimber's need it, but some do), add the cost of a no $#!+ customer service policy (Yes, I know Kimber will send you new small parts when asked, but here is a reason they break). Now you get a little closer to what a comparison should be. Other wise you have a before and after.
With the cost of the options added there is no 3 times the cost. It is closer to even depending on who does the work, (tritium sight, coating, checkering, etc.) and how you farm it out.
The decision boils down to one thing. How much do you want to spend.
Do you want spend your money for the options. If so, spend the money and get them. If you don't keep the difference, Buy the Kimber and use the difference to find out if you want the options and buy ammunition to learn to use the gun you bought. (Most of the trade guns that come in are less than 200 rounds fired)
If you do not like the Kimber and decide later to trade.
Trade.
That is part of the production gun game. You are not out that much when you trade off you Kimber (Buy for $600 resell for $500). If you are satisfied with the Kimber, keep it and tell everyone on the forums how great your Kimber is.
Hopefully, this is a slightly different perspective to look at your decision.
Be safe and keep the brass flying
Terry Peters
http://www.pt-partners.com
Do the research but you get what you pay for front end or back end.
It suddenly dawned on my coffee/sleep starved brain something you have a "bug" about. Pure money. Do you want to spend money or not. You have mentioned several times 3 times the cost of a Kimber.
(If you notice the date/time of this post Yes, I have no life, I just got off of my other full time job, full-time LEO in Dallas, after one long overtime shift.)
First question I would ask is what is the gun for. Target, protection, both, plinking, or what. If it is for primary self defense or protection add this to the mix. What is you life worth. Personally considering my other full time job I want the best or most reliable piece of equipment I can get or allowed by department policy and law.
Second question: I would figure how much I have to spend.
Now for some more thoughts on spending the available money:
If you are going to compare a $600 Kimber to a $1700 Wilson you forgot to add the options to the Kimber or subtract the same from the Wilson to get some kind of comparison. Other than that there is no comparison.
Right now you are trying to compare as I have mentioned before two total different items other than they are 1911.
At least when you add the cost of checkering the front strap, protective coating (armortuff/hardchrome), tactical dehorn, tritium sights, steel checkered mainspring housing instead of plasic as on the Kimber, then add the cost of you (your time and experience), one of your friends (if you trust him) or a reputable gun smith (who will warrant the work) installing all of the above plus a reliability package (Not all kimber's need it, but some do), add the cost of a no $#!+ customer service policy (Yes, I know Kimber will send you new small parts when asked, but here is a reason they break). Now you get a little closer to what a comparison should be. Other wise you have a before and after.
With the cost of the options added there is no 3 times the cost. It is closer to even depending on who does the work, (tritium sight, coating, checkering, etc.) and how you farm it out.
The decision boils down to one thing. How much do you want to spend.
Do you want spend your money for the options. If so, spend the money and get them. If you don't keep the difference, Buy the Kimber and use the difference to find out if you want the options and buy ammunition to learn to use the gun you bought. (Most of the trade guns that come in are less than 200 rounds fired)
If you do not like the Kimber and decide later to trade.
Trade.
That is part of the production gun game. You are not out that much when you trade off you Kimber (Buy for $600 resell for $500). If you are satisfied with the Kimber, keep it and tell everyone on the forums how great your Kimber is.
Hopefully, this is a slightly different perspective to look at your decision.
Be safe and keep the brass flying
Terry Peters
http://www.pt-partners.com
Do the research but you get what you pay for front end or back end.
I don't own a Wilson, but I do have two Les Baer Concepts (VII and IX), a S&W Performance Center 945 and an SV Infinity, all top line 1911 type guns on a par (IMO) with Wilsons. I also have a Kimber Classic. The Kimber can be as accurate as any of them - at least with me shooting 
- but the feel (intangible I know) is not in the same league. That's even after spending a couple hundred dollars on custom work on the Kimber. Terry has given the long (and accurate) answer - the high end guns are definitely worth the money.
- but the feel (intangible I know) is not in the same league. That's even after spending a couple hundred dollars on custom work on the Kimber. Terry has given the long (and accurate) answer - the high end guns are definitely worth the money.I agree with jfrancis there is an intangible difference between these guns.
I am a huge fan of my Classic Custom Kimber. It is the basic model Kimber, black finish, no extras except I did replace the plastic grips with coco bolo. This gun is wonderful -- no jams, very accurate.
When I compare it to the Wilson Protector, though, I can tell it is not fit as well. This is not a derogatory comment about the Kimber, it is a complimentary comment about the Wilson. All moving parts on the Wilson are smooth as silk. The Kimber feels great til I start messing with the Wilson.
I agree it all boils down to money and what you are willing to spend. You will not be unhappy with a Kimber. After you get your Wilson paid for, and your checkbook recovers, you will be fanatically in love with it.
I am a huge fan of my Classic Custom Kimber. It is the basic model Kimber, black finish, no extras except I did replace the plastic grips with coco bolo. This gun is wonderful -- no jams, very accurate.
When I compare it to the Wilson Protector, though, I can tell it is not fit as well. This is not a derogatory comment about the Kimber, it is a complimentary comment about the Wilson. All moving parts on the Wilson are smooth as silk. The Kimber feels great til I start messing with the Wilson.
I agree it all boils down to money and what you are willing to spend. You will not be unhappy with a Kimber. After you get your Wilson paid for, and your checkbook recovers, you will be fanatically in love with it.
I may be mistaken but, I read somewhere that Wilson uses Jericho Arms/Kimber manufactured slide and frames. Not to say the Wilson is not fit and finished to a higher level than the Kimber however, with the starting points being equal, you could probably rationalize purchasing a Kimber to later have customized. Or you could spend a lot more and get what you want right now. Not exactly a dilema.
JJCII
JJCII
Gopher .45
New member
As already said, the major differences are the amount of hand fitting and customer service. Wilson is supposed to be way ahead of the rest.
Just for thought, I also understand Wilson uses Kimber slides and frames, only according to American Handgunner, some of Kimber's slides come from Smith and Wesson!
Just for thought, I also understand Wilson uses Kimber slides and frames, only according to American Handgunner, some of Kimber's slides come from Smith and Wesson!
MIM - Metal Injection Molding
Metal Injection Molding is used for cost effective manufacturing of complicated small components. It cuts the costs of Kimber 1911's down. When done properly, a MIM part will hold up as well as a forged or machined part. However, if done improperly, it may break.
Metal Injection Molding is used for cost effective manufacturing of complicated small components. It cuts the costs of Kimber 1911's down. When done properly, a MIM part will hold up as well as a forged or machined part. However, if done improperly, it may break.
Kimber does make the major parts. S&W may make overflow for them.
You can buy the Kimber, then send it to Wilson later, pending $$$.
I also think that there are custom smiths out there who can do better than Wilson, possibly for less money, such as Brian Bilby.
You are really only buying a semi-custom from Wilson, and I've seen things in his catalog I could do w/o for either money or aesthetic reasons that are standard to his packages.
You can buy the Kimber, then send it to Wilson later, pending $$$.
I also think that there are custom smiths out there who can do better than Wilson, possibly for less money, such as Brian Bilby.
You are really only buying a semi-custom from Wilson, and I've seen things in his catalog I could do w/o for either money or aesthetic reasons that are standard to his packages.
B Shipley...not to be insensitive but you should do a little more research before you make a gunsmith recommendation. Brian Bilby passed away several weeks ago.
Please keep in mind that the compact versions of the Wilson guns are more expensive than the full sive. The Stealth even more so, as it is a custom grade. Also, a kimber worked over by Wilson will never have the resale value of a true Wilson (if that matters to you). I have a Wilson and box stock guns do not compare.
Please keep in mind that the compact versions of the Wilson guns are more expensive than the full sive. The Stealth even more so, as it is a custom grade. Also, a kimber worked over by Wilson will never have the resale value of a true Wilson (if that matters to you). I have a Wilson and box stock guns do not compare.
Is the Wilson worth 3x the price of the Kimber? I agree with Terry--it all depends on the use of the gun. One friend owns LOTS of guns. He doesn't shoot that often, but when he does, he shoots a lot of different guns. Is it worth for him to spend $1,800-$2000 on a Wilson? That's his decision, but I wouldn't. A 1911 is like a good wine--it takes time (and a commitment) to appreciate the often subtle differences in quality and smoothness. For most people, Kimbers or Springfields are a good choice. The connisseur may want better, but then, there are differences even in connisseurs -- some will argue that a Wilson is a semi-production gun, and if you want "real" quality, plunk down a big roll of money and hunker down for a few years until a one-man big-name smith builds your gun. Getting into high-end 1911s is a game you can't win. Once you develop a taste for them, it's hard to go back to box-stock guns. The problem is that there is always the next high-quality 1911. It's a damn expensive taste and I sometimes wish I'd stayed with my Glock 19--I'd certainly have more money in the bank. BTW, be careful about advice regarding customizing a stock gun. It's usually not worth it. Either get a stock gun and shoot the hell out of it (maybe do some minor modifications) or get a high end gun that is what you want. The sucker turf is the land in-between--buying a $600 gun, spending $1,200 to customize it and then having a gun that's worth less than $1,000. Actually, depending on what you want, the higher end guns are a better value than Kimbers. For a $1,400 Baer PII you get a NM barrel and bushing, tool steel not MIM parts, checkered front strap, wood grips, and a tight frame-to-slide fit. You'd be spending a whole lot more to get that done to a stock Kimber.
9mmepiphany
New member
les baer vs wilson ?
i am having the same diliema.
the wilson and kimber both start from the same frame/slide, Mccomick CDM/CNC product, with the difference being the amount of handwork and the addition of wilson's parts. i had originally considered springfield but have "odd feelings" about frames from brazil.
if i could see spending 1k+, i would tip the scales toward the les baer priemer II, which "feels better" for me than the wilsons.
the deciding factor might be time out here in calif...the kimbers will be for sale next year, the others won't.
i am having the same diliema.
the wilson and kimber both start from the same frame/slide, Mccomick CDM/CNC product, with the difference being the amount of handwork and the addition of wilson's parts. i had originally considered springfield but have "odd feelings" about frames from brazil.
if i could see spending 1k+, i would tip the scales toward the les baer priemer II, which "feels better" for me than the wilsons.
the deciding factor might be time out here in calif...the kimbers will be for sale next year, the others won't.
PT-Partners
New member
9mmepiphany
As one who retails the custom 1911 as well as the production 1911 there please consider the following.
One more thing to consider in your purchase decision is the quanity of guns built by each shop yearly, number of employees per shop (which equates to how many man-hours per gun) and the customer service reputation of the companies.
I would want the hours to build a gun to be commensurate with what most of the gunsmiths say it takes to built a custom gun.
You should not need the customer service but for $1500 I had better speak to someone if I want to and not get a runaround.
Again I recommend going to the 1911 Forum (http://www.1911forum.com I think that is the right link) and go to the individual forums for Baer and Wilson and ask your questions. Also ask on the general forum
You get more answers from all of the 1911 owners, many gunsmiths, holster makers, as well as one manufacturers rep who is a moderator.
Sometimes you get some very strident opinions as well as information from reputatable gunsmiths. For example: <BEGINNING OF RUMOR CONTROL. Smith and Wesson sent some 1911 frames to Kimber to build guns. A very short time later Wilson combat rejected a large order of frames sent to them from the supplier which was alleged to be the frame folks from Kimber, Gee, Did Kimber send those frames to Wilson who said these do not meet spec and sent them back. END OF RUMOR CONTROL> (I call this rumor control to not point any fingers at the source of the information, I will send that off line.)
Be safe and keep the brass flying.
Terry Peters.
http://www.pt-partners.com
Do the research but you get what you pay for front end or back end.
As one who retails the custom 1911 as well as the production 1911 there please consider the following.
One more thing to consider in your purchase decision is the quanity of guns built by each shop yearly, number of employees per shop (which equates to how many man-hours per gun) and the customer service reputation of the companies.
I would want the hours to build a gun to be commensurate with what most of the gunsmiths say it takes to built a custom gun.
You should not need the customer service but for $1500 I had better speak to someone if I want to and not get a runaround.
Again I recommend going to the 1911 Forum (http://www.1911forum.com I think that is the right link) and go to the individual forums for Baer and Wilson and ask your questions. Also ask on the general forum
You get more answers from all of the 1911 owners, many gunsmiths, holster makers, as well as one manufacturers rep who is a moderator.
Sometimes you get some very strident opinions as well as information from reputatable gunsmiths. For example: <BEGINNING OF RUMOR CONTROL. Smith and Wesson sent some 1911 frames to Kimber to build guns. A very short time later Wilson combat rejected a large order of frames sent to them from the supplier which was alleged to be the frame folks from Kimber, Gee, Did Kimber send those frames to Wilson who said these do not meet spec and sent them back. END OF RUMOR CONTROL> (I call this rumor control to not point any fingers at the source of the information, I will send that off line.)
Be safe and keep the brass flying.
Terry Peters.
http://www.pt-partners.com
Do the research but you get what you pay for front end or back end.