No go for me on buying a P322

angel71rs

New member
Check out this guy's experience with the pistol and Sig customer service:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2VY4N3GCxM

The P322 looked interesting, but the stench of the Mosquito lingered. Then I started reading some negative stuff, now this. I decided to go with a Taurus TX 22 for inexpensive practice with a pistol about the size of a compact 9mm. Original barrel on it was keyholing, but Taurus customer service was outstanding! Called, they immediately emailed me a return label. From the time I sent it in to it returning to my hot little hands was about a week!

All manufacturers will have problems, how they take care of the customer is the difference. With this and the Mosquito mess, I can't trust Sig, so I won't touch any of their products. JMO
 
If one or even a number of bad reviews online was enough to stop me from buying a firearm, I don’t think I would have many of the firearms I have now (and I would have given up on a number of brands from my own bad experiences). You can find negative reviews of just about every firearm out there. That’s not to say that the number of negative P322 reviews out there is comforting, but what percentage of the whole is the question.

I’m not discrediting this person’s experience, but this post reads like you went looking for a bad review, found one, and your confirmation bias is now happy. That’s human, it happens to me too. But there also a number of negative reviews of the TX-22, you yourself had a not great experience, and I’ve read a number of horror stories when it comes to Taurus customer service (some on this forum). I think each of these pistols has some asterisks at this point.

For the record I have 500 rd through my P322 with no issues. That said I don’t particularly like the pistol as it has a mushy and long trigger pull and combined with the pistol’s light weight that makes it not overly easy to shoot well, and I bought it mainly for my family who don’t shoot as much as I.
 
I Have had my P322 for a year now with about 1500 rounds through it. Have not had one issue with it. It just works.
 
Wrong. Didn't go looking for bad reviews, I subscribe to this guy's channel for his "jelly contraption" ammo reviews and this came up for me today. As for the other things I've read about the 322, that was just in the course of my wanderings on the internet.

I was actually interested in this pistol when it 1st came out, but held off due to the Mosquito mess. I too have read bad stuff about past Taurus customer service, but better newer reviews gave me more confidence in them.

And I was not disappointed by their lightning fast service. Contrast that to how Sig customer service treated this guy.
 
I don’t disagree that this person had poor customer service. But you yourself have acknowledged people with Taurus firearms have also had poor customer service, yet you yourself did not. How indicative is this person’s experience of all SIG customer service interactions? That’s the bigger question, and that’s not easy to answer.
 
I cannot speak directly to this "complaint". This is just a reflection on how a BAD product can diminish a reputation. As has been mentioned, I bought a SIG Mosquito based solely on the SIG name and positive experience with a P220. I was SO disappointed. How SIG could let that Mosquito carry their name still confounds me. Having been "bitten" with the now discarded Mosquito I am highly suspicious of SIG Arms products.
 
You mischaracterize what I wrote about Taurus CS. I specifically said I read bad stuff about PAST service, but that newer reviews were better.

That they treated this customer so shabbily is unacceptable to me. 9 months of runaround!?! I'll say it again, all manufacturers will have problems, how they take care of the customer is the difference.
 
angel71rs said:
You mischaracterize what I wrote about Taurus CS. I specifically said I read bad stuff about PAST service, but that newer reviews were better.

I don't really see what I wrote as a mischaracterization and it certainly wasn't my intent. You acknowledged that there have been bad reports and that's what I mentioned. I didn't claim that newer reviews weren't better. I know we've had some poor reports here on this forum in the last few years. To be fair I'm also not sure what your definition of "newer" means exactly, because the timeline we use for evaluation varies person to person. When a person says "newer" they might mean the past year or the past 4 years. Taurus has been selling products in the US for some time.

angel71rs said:
I'll say it again, all manufacturers will have problems, how they take care of the customer is the difference.

I don't think anyone here disagrees with this or would claim differently.
 
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No company knows to reach out without the customer contacting them. I fully acknowledge that this guy has done that, but in all the companies to which I have sent firearms in for repair unless I contacted them and kept contacting them they wouldn't respond. The onus, and this is not me saying this is fair, is on you.

You state this as taking 9 months (though in the video it's April til December, which is 8 months and he didn't start contacting SIG until July). SIG returned on their dime the pistol and sent him back the pistol with a new barrel in 12 days from the original phone call. Then per him that barrel had similar issues. He contacted SIG again, had to email a form, then became frustrated when in 3 hr he hadn't gotten a response to that form, called again, then did get a return letter at end of day. At multiple points in this video the gentleman mentions how he had sent them links to the videos and no doubt they were mad because they had watched the negative videos and that's why he didn't get a response until the end of the day (rather than the seemingly more likely reason being they were busy).

This gentleman has 33.8k subscribers, which is 33.8k more than myself, but I'll be honest and say that I don't see how that matters and there seems to be an attempt from what this man describes to exert some additional leverage against SIG by suggesting more bad press if this isn't resolved. I'm of the opinion customer service should treat you the same if you have 33.8k subscribers or 0 subscribers. Having a YouTube channel doesn't make you special or skip everyone else having issues themselves. He's not the only person with whom SIG is dealing.

He then doesn't get a response by 9/8 and starts calling and recording his interactions. He speaks to someone he admits was polite who admits the pistol is still in process and SIG doesn't have a solution as of yet. When he does get the pistol back again in a month or so he makes the point in the video how they note on the repair form that he had YouTube videos on the pistol, which to him is proof they are "mad as hornets and can't stand him calling them out and they're getting an attitude about it." Or it could be them acknowledging something that he specifically admits to making a point to tell them when he called before. He is then mad that they report rear sight damage and seems to regard it as lying, when frankly firearms can get damaged in shipping or in the factory itself as it makes it's way to the tech doing the service (especially as the rear sight is polymer in this case). SIG never appears to claim the rear sight was the cause of the issues he experienced, so I don't quite see the concern.

At this point in the video he's angry and getting visibly upset. He admits to pulling the "YouTuber card", which goes to my earlier point of how I personally find that objectionable, and promising SIG more bad YouTube videos that will be seen by "tens of thousands of viewers" if he doesn't get a refund. In the end they agree to refund the pistol, he sends it in, they inform him it may take multiple weeks for the refund to be issued. Two months go by, an admittedly long time (I agree with him that it's too long), he doesn't receive the check, then emails them. He gets a response saying the check was misplaced and they will mail him a new one in a week. The fact that the check could be sent that fast this time is apparently evidence to the creator of them lying the first time because they were mad at him because of his videos and so deliberately did not send or delayed sending him the check (the creator says the service rep is a "mad little liar"). This seemingly ignores that in times customer service will expedite certain requests to try help a customer out. SIG trying to be faster to respond becomes a bad thing.

The letter then gets destroyed, admittedly by the USPS per a cover envelope from them (although he does ask "if it was the post office..." in the video). He ends the video saying he will never buy another SIG and that the P322 is "absolutely terrible, every single one of them" and has leading issues (I guess those of us here who haven't had bad luck are in denial). He states that SIG as a company is "absolute trash" and everyone he dealt with is either a "liar or completely incompetent". This seems disingenuous to me, as he mentions two customer service reps by name with which he mentions having good experiences.

I think everyone is entitled to an opinion. Do I think this gentleman was completely reasonable? Honestly, no, even though I am willing to believe the P322 may well have/had production issues. Why do I care? That's a fair question. My wife worked customer service for a number of years. The number of people that would call and be rude to her, including swearing at her, insulting her, and even threatening her life on occasion, was mind blowing to me and I've seen that attitude all over the place. More often than not that behavior was unnecessary and counter-productive. So do I always believe the customer over the company? Not anymore and this video doesn't seem objective to me. YMMV.
 
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I have had a couple of bad experiences with new model pistols. Now I let others beta test new models for me.
 
No company knows to reach out without the customer contacting them. I fully acknowledge that this guy has done that, but in all the companies to which I have sent firearms in for repair unless I contacted them and kept contacting them they wouldn't respond. The onus, and this is not me saying this is fair, is on you.

You state this as taking 9 months (though in the video it's April til December, which is 8 months and he didn't start contacting SIG until July). SIG returned on their dime the pistol and sent him back the pistol with a new barrel in 12 days from the original phone call. Then per him that barrel had similar issues. He contacted SIG again, had to email a form, then became frustrated when in 3 hr he hadn't gotten a response to that form, called again, then did get a return letter at end of day. At multiple points in this video the gentleman mentions how he had sent them links to the videos and no doubt they were mad because they had watched the negative videos and that's why he didn't get a response until the end of the day (rather than the seemingly more likely reason being they were busy).

This gentleman has 33.8k subscribers, which is 33.8k more than myself, but I'll be honest and say that I don't see how that matters and there seems to be an attempt from what this man describes to exert some additional leverage against SIG by suggesting more bad press if this isn't resolved. I'm of the opinion customer service should treat you the same if you have 33.8k subscribers or 0 subscribers. Having a YouTube channel doesn't make you special or skip everyone else having issues themselves. He's not the only person with whom SIG is dealing.

He then doesn't get a response by 9/8 and starts calling and recording his interactions. He speaks to someone he admits was polite who admits the pistol is still in process and SIG doesn't have a solution as of yet. When he does get the pistol back again in a month or so he makes the point in the video how they note on the repair form that he had YouTube videos on the pistol, which to him is proof they are "mad as hornets and can't stand him calling them out and they're getting an attitude about it." Or it could be them acknowledging something that he specifically admits to making a point to tell them when he called before. He is then mad that they report rear sight damage and seems to regard it as lying, when frankly firearms can get damaged in shipping or in the factory itself as it makes it's way to the tech doing the service (especially as the rear sight is polymer in this case). SIG never appears to claim the rear sight was the cause of the issues he experienced, so I don't quite see the concern.

At this point in the video he's angry and getting visibly upset. He admits to pulling the "YouTuber card", which goes to my earlier point of how I personally find that objectionable, and promising SIG more bad YouTube videos that will be seen by "tens of thousands of viewers" if he doesn't get a refund. In the end they agree to refund the pistol, he sends it in, they inform him it may take multiple weeks for the refund to be issued. Two months go by, an admittedly long time (I agree with him that it's too long), he doesn't receive the check, then emails them. He gets a response saying the check was misplaced and they will mail him a new one in a week. The fact that the check could be sent that fast this time is apparently evidence to the creator of them lying the first time because they were mad at him because of his videos and so deliberately did not send or delayed sending him the check (the creator says the service rep is a "mad little liar"). This seemingly ignores that in times customer service will expedite certain requests to try help a customer out. SIG trying to be faster to respond becomes a bad thing.

The letter then gets destroyed, admittedly by the USPS per a cover envelope from them (although he does ask "if it was the post office..." in the video). He ends the video saying he will never buy another SIG and that the P322 is "absolutely terrible, every single one of them" and has leading issues (I guess those of us here who haven't had bad luck are in denial). He states that SIG as a company is "absolute trash" and everyone he dealt with is either a "liar or completely incompetent". This seems disingenuous to me, as he mentions two customer service reps by name with which he mentions having good experiences.

I think everyone is entitled to an opinion. Do I think this gentleman was completely reasonable? Honestly, no, even though I am willing to believe the P322 may well have/had production issues. Why do I care? That's a fair question. My wife worked customer service for a number of years. The number of people that would call and be rude to her, including swearing at her, insulting her, and even threatening her life on occasion, was mind blowing to me and I've seen that attitude all over the place. More often than not that behavior was unnecessary and counter-productive. So do I always believe the customer over the company? Not anymore and this video doesn't seem objective to me. YMMV.

If it happened to you... you would be angry as well and if he hadn't resorted to the ''I'm a YouTuber'' card then he would never have got his refund.
 
If it happened to you... you would be angry as well and if he hadn't resorted to the ''I'm a YouTuber'' card then he would never have got his refund.


Would I have been upset? Sure. Would my actions and words be the same as the man in the video? No, and that’s detailed in the response I took the time to write. As to them not fixing it unless he mentioned how he was a YouTuber, that’s an assumption on his part, and given he doesn’t appear unbiased I am not necessarily inclined to believe him.
 
Would I have been upset? Sure. Would my actions and words be the same as the man in the video? No, and that’s detailed in the response I took the time to write. As to them not fixing it unless he mentioned how he was a YouTuber, that’s an assumption on his part, and given he doesn’t appear unbiased I am not necessarily inclined to believe him.

How can someone be unbiased in a situation like this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTRKCXC0JFg
 
I actually do know what the word means (though I appreciate you for the second time today making sure I am aware of these things).

You just made my point. If he's admittedly biased, then why would I believe him that they wouldn't have taken the pistol back had he not mentioned his YouTube channel?
 
I actually do know what the word means (though I appreciate you for the second time today making sure I am aware of these things).

You just made my point. If he's admittedly biased, then why would I believe him that they wouldn't have taken the pistol back had he not mentioned his YouTube channel?

How can someone not be biased in purchasing a gun for their hard earned cash that has something wrong with it and getting the runaround from the manufacturer rep?
 
I have a long post above you where I go over the video in detail and why I disagree with certain points in the video. It’s all there to read. If you disagree that’s your call.
 
I have a long post above you where I go over the video in detail and why I disagree with certain points in the video. It’s all there to read. If you disagree that’s your call.

I still don't think that you understand the concept of bias.

If you in your car get hit by another car how can you be unbiased towards the driver who claims that it was your fault and his insurance company that demands payment from you?
 
I still don't think that you understand the concept of bias.

If you get clipped by a car how can you be unbiased towards the driver who claims that it was your fault and his insurance company that demands payment from you?

First, I don’t think your metaphor is a good fit for this situation. But secondly, I already said I understood the person being upset. My point is, if all I have to judge a disagreement between two parties is the opinions of those two parties, then I don’t trust either of them out of hand because both of them are inherently biased. The best I can do is listen to both accounts and try to gauge some truth based on the evidence they present. When it comes to needing to use his “YouTuber” card to get the pistol returned he’s admittedly biased and him just relaying his impressions, when at that point in the recollection he’s annoyed in the video, doesn’t convince me. If it convinces you that’s your call.
 
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