Newbie questions
- Thread starter Dano4734
- Start date
Assuming the case in question is your 454 Casull, and assuming your "carbon" die is a "carbide" die, then no. You don't need lube with straight walled cases and carbide dies.
I have carbide dies for all my pistol calibers; but I still lube. But that's just me. It's not required. Sure makes the ram pull easier though; and that can't be a bad thing.
I don't load 454 Casull (or 45 Colt; or 460 XVR, etc.); so I can't recommend components.
I have carbide dies for all my pistol calibers; but I still lube. But that's just me. It's not required. Sure makes the ram pull easier though; and that can't be a bad thing.
I don't load 454 Casull (or 45 Colt; or 460 XVR, etc.); so I can't recommend components.
disseminator
New member
There are a lot of good options but if you want to keep it simple, get yourself a box of Hornady 240 grain XTP-MAG and use some Hodgdon H110 powder and go to town.
Make sure you get the XTP-MAG and not just the plain XTP bullets (which are made softer for 45 Colt use) The regular XTP will not perform well in the Casull or 460 Mag.
Make sure you get the XTP-MAG and not just the plain XTP bullets (which are made softer for 45 Colt use) The regular XTP will not perform well in the Casull or 460 Mag.
Any of the 240gr. to 300gr. 45 caliber bullets can be used on deer in the Casull. However due to the power (velocity) available with the Casull, you must choose a bullet compatible with the intended load for good hunting performance.
The bullet makers generally provide loading data suitable for hunting with their bullets in the Casull. About half of the 300gr. bullets can be used in full power Casull loads. But those high power 300gr. loads are more than needed for deer. Bullets in the 240gr. to 260gr. range were designed for 45 Colt loads (both standard pressure and the higher Ruger/TC/Dan Wesson pressure loads) and are also suitable for deer if their velocity is limited to levels below full power. The Hornady 240gr. XTP-MAG is an exception and is designed to work at full power Casull levels.
The tough 300gr. and 240gr. XTP-MAG bullets are really intended for game tougher than deer. They can be used on deer, but they may not expand much. Of course, when you start out at 45 caliber, expansion is not as important. Unless you really enjoy and prefer to shoot the full power loads, I would suggest something a little lighter.
Good deer loads can be assembled with the standard 240gr. to 260gr. bullets from Hornady, Sierra, and Speer. As suggested above, HS-6 makes an excellent medium power powder for the Casull. I've used 15.5gr behind Sierra's 240gr. JHC and it makes a very manageable load that could be used for deer.
True Blue is another powder that can be used to assemble nice manageable loads for the Casull. Sierra's 240gr. JHC ahead of 14.0gr makes another load suitable for deer hunting that's fun to shoot. Both this and the HS-6 load above can also be increased some if desired. Check the data available from Hodgdon's and Western Powders' websites for further details.
If those loads aren't exciting enough, 2400 can be used for more recoil and muzzle blast. You can start out at about 24gr. and work up from there with the 240gr. to 260gr. bullets.
The Casull uses small rifle primers and I see the CCI SR, WSR, Federal 205, and Remington 7 1/2 suggested most often. The Remington 6 1/2 should not be used. It is designed for lower pressure cartridges.
The bullet makers generally provide loading data suitable for hunting with their bullets in the Casull. About half of the 300gr. bullets can be used in full power Casull loads. But those high power 300gr. loads are more than needed for deer. Bullets in the 240gr. to 260gr. range were designed for 45 Colt loads (both standard pressure and the higher Ruger/TC/Dan Wesson pressure loads) and are also suitable for deer if their velocity is limited to levels below full power. The Hornady 240gr. XTP-MAG is an exception and is designed to work at full power Casull levels.
The tough 300gr. and 240gr. XTP-MAG bullets are really intended for game tougher than deer. They can be used on deer, but they may not expand much. Of course, when you start out at 45 caliber, expansion is not as important. Unless you really enjoy and prefer to shoot the full power loads, I would suggest something a little lighter.
Good deer loads can be assembled with the standard 240gr. to 260gr. bullets from Hornady, Sierra, and Speer. As suggested above, HS-6 makes an excellent medium power powder for the Casull. I've used 15.5gr behind Sierra's 240gr. JHC and it makes a very manageable load that could be used for deer.
True Blue is another powder that can be used to assemble nice manageable loads for the Casull. Sierra's 240gr. JHC ahead of 14.0gr makes another load suitable for deer hunting that's fun to shoot. Both this and the HS-6 load above can also be increased some if desired. Check the data available from Hodgdon's and Western Powders' websites for further details.
If those loads aren't exciting enough, 2400 can be used for more recoil and muzzle blast. You can start out at about 24gr. and work up from there with the 240gr. to 260gr. bullets.
The Casull uses small rifle primers and I see the CCI SR, WSR, Federal 205, and Remington 7 1/2 suggested most often. The Remington 6 1/2 should not be used. It is designed for lower pressure cartridges.
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Carbide die doesn't need lube , I'm sure the instruction that came with the die will explain. Just clean your brass , will make life easier. If you don't mind taking extra time then you can lube , makes sizing smoother. Adds another step in cleaning the lube off. Never bothered me, easier on the press, die & brass.
As far as the loads , I would look through the load books . Start mid range for hunting loads. That's what I did only for a 44 Mag. S&W 29 8 3/8" barrel.
As far as the loads , I would look through the load books . Start mid range for hunting loads. That's what I did only for a 44 Mag. S&W 29 8 3/8" barrel.
I definitely use lube with carbide dies in some larger calibers-- .44 Mag, .460 & .500 Magnum, I use Imperial and it makes the sizing work -SO- much easier, smoother, better. I'd never go back to doing it dry.
Lots of recommendations for XTP-Mag bullets for .454 Casull, but it isn't simply about performance, it's about the potential for damage to your revolver. The ballistics techs at Alliant explained to me that the XTP-Mag bullets were developed to combat the distortion of the bullet in the jump from cylinder to forcing cone.
So when you are picking bullets, consider performance for sure but keep in mind that you don't want to wreck your revolver.
Lots of recommendations for XTP-Mag bullets for .454 Casull, but it isn't simply about performance, it's about the potential for damage to your revolver. The ballistics techs at Alliant explained to me that the XTP-Mag bullets were developed to combat the distortion of the bullet in the jump from cylinder to forcing cone.
So when you are picking bullets, consider performance for sure but keep in mind that you don't want to wreck your revolver.
ShootistPRS
New member
The manufacturer include direction for use with the dies. Some tell you not to lube because lube attracts dust which will scratch the die and your brass. Other will tell you to use clean brass with very little lube.I have never lubed my RCBS carbide dies and they work with little pressure. i always clean my brass before sizing and decapping. It keeps the dies in good condition.
This is my process.
But with my loading process, after the cases are flaired, they get a wet tumble with SS pins for a good thorough cleaning. Since I'm going to do the tumble - lube or not - I figured why not lube? It only takes a few seconds to put the cases in a bag and give 'em a quick spray of lube. This extra 30 seconds is well worth the time. IMO
Really good advice.
I'll admit to being a hypocrite about load data. I like reading what other folk are using but I just flat out will not tell you what my loads are. Why? Because I'll fumble finger the numbers and post a load that will turn you gun into scrap metal or maybe fail to get the bullet all the way out of the barrel.
Oh, and when I find some body advocating a load that seems to be just what I'm after? I check with one or two of my reloading manuals just to be sure.
I don't have yet a cleaning tumbler but I have a jewelry cleaner that I put soap and water and let it go for an hour or so.. The cases come out sparkling clean so I guess unless you guys say no, I will keep doing that. It's a sonic cleaner. I can't get a lot of brass in it but it's enough for me each time as I am in no hurry
Dano4734
Cleaning your brass that way is fine , straight wall cases clean up very nice . I wet tumble my brass also only with stainless steel pins added. Look into a pocket uniformer , only have to do it once , cuts all the primer to the proper depth . Will never have a problem seating primers . Just another tool in the shed . I use a ram primer by RCBS , all my primers are seated to the same depth , bottomed .
Cleaning your brass that way is fine , straight wall cases clean up very nice . I wet tumble my brass also only with stainless steel pins added. Look into a pocket uniformer , only have to do it once , cuts all the primer to the proper depth . Will never have a problem seating primers . Just another tool in the shed . I use a ram primer by RCBS , all my primers are seated to the same depth , bottomed .
The 454 Casull, along with the 460 and 500 Smith & Wesson and a few other cartridges operate at high pressures normal associated with rifle rounds. As a result, the bullets suitable for use at these high pressures need to be constructed somewhat differently than the bullets used at more typical handgun operating pressures.
Using Hornady's XTP MAG bullets is a straightforward way of ensuring good results with the Casull. Hornady also makes a regular 250gr. XTP (non-MAG) bullet but does not list any 454 Casull loads with that bullet in their 9th Edition reloading manual (perhaps to avoid confusion and potential problems).
Speer and Sierra make bullets suitable for full power or nearly full power Casull loads, along with bullets intended for 45 Colt and/or 45 Colt (Ruger only) loads. Their reloading manuals list the appropriate 454 Casull loads (full or reduced power) for each bullet.
Nosler does not currently make a bullet suitable for full power Casull loads and does not provide any reloading data for the Casull in their 8th edition reloading manual. Some earlier Nosler reloading manuals contained loading data for the Casull using their handgun Partition bullets (which are no longer made).
I enjoy practice with the Casull by loading and shooting reduced power loads. I've used bullets designed for 45 Colt and 45 Colt (Ruger Only) without incident by following the guidelines and published loads given in the Speer and Sierra Manuals, as well as on the Hodgdon website.
The point is, if you want to shoot reduced Casull loads, there is suitable information available to do so, and you can save a little money by using “normal” 45 caliber revolver bullets. Of course, “reduced” is a relative term. In the case of the 454, “reduced” is not far below 44 Magnum/Ruger Only 45 Colt level loads. Which means they are also suitable for deer sized game. And more importantly, the are just plain fun to shoot.
Using Hornady's XTP MAG bullets is a straightforward way of ensuring good results with the Casull. Hornady also makes a regular 250gr. XTP (non-MAG) bullet but does not list any 454 Casull loads with that bullet in their 9th Edition reloading manual (perhaps to avoid confusion and potential problems).
Speer and Sierra make bullets suitable for full power or nearly full power Casull loads, along with bullets intended for 45 Colt and/or 45 Colt (Ruger only) loads. Their reloading manuals list the appropriate 454 Casull loads (full or reduced power) for each bullet.
Nosler does not currently make a bullet suitable for full power Casull loads and does not provide any reloading data for the Casull in their 8th edition reloading manual. Some earlier Nosler reloading manuals contained loading data for the Casull using their handgun Partition bullets (which are no longer made).
I enjoy practice with the Casull by loading and shooting reduced power loads. I've used bullets designed for 45 Colt and 45 Colt (Ruger Only) without incident by following the guidelines and published loads given in the Speer and Sierra Manuals, as well as on the Hodgdon website.
The point is, if you want to shoot reduced Casull loads, there is suitable information available to do so, and you can save a little money by using “normal” 45 caliber revolver bullets. Of course, “reduced” is a relative term. In the case of the 454, “reduced” is not far below 44 Magnum/Ruger Only 45 Colt level loads. Which means they are also suitable for deer sized game. And more importantly, the are just plain fun to shoot.
It's highly dependent on the cartridge shape, pressure developed during firing, and the cartridge chamber. Straight wall cartridges like 38 Special and 45 Auto can be loaded dozens of times with lighter target loads. Bottle neck high pressure cartridges like the 220 Swift or 8mm Magnum loaded to full pressure may need to be trimmed back to length after only a few firings. It's often suggested that cases be discarded after a few trimmings (3 to 5).
Of course split necks often end the ability to reload the case. This can occur anytime, and is affected by the brass hardness and the fit if the cartridge in the chamber neck.
So the range is quite wide. Perhaps as few as a half dozen, to several dozen or more. Some 45 Auto shooters end up reloading cases beyond when you can read the headstamp, if they don't loose them first.
Of course split necks often end the ability to reload the case. This can occur anytime, and is affected by the brass hardness and the fit if the cartridge in the chamber neck.
So the range is quite wide. Perhaps as few as a half dozen, to several dozen or more. Some 45 Auto shooters end up reloading cases beyond when you can read the headstamp, if they don't loose them first.
Thank you, I better invest in a case trimmer also.. I don't have one yet. I hit a junk store and found a new in the box rcbs power measure, stand and scale along with bottles of lube and lube pad and brush for75 bucks .. It was from an estate.. Never used I think I got a great deal. The scale is an rcbs mechanical never used.. Now if I can find a case trimmer. Fun spending my kids inheritance 
I'll admit to being an RCBS acolyte.
I've used the Uniflow powder measure and RCBS 5-0-5 scale for many years with good results. I tried a digital for a while but didn't like it and went back to the 5-0-5. If I ever decide to try a digital again I'll get one of the more expensive ones and hopefully have better luck (or more probably I'll just stick to my tried and true scale until it gives up the ghost).
Measuring devices, like calipers and scales and powder measures, I've come to think you really should pay the extra money once and get a quality item.
I've never reloaded for Casull .454 but for straight wall handgun cases I'm in the camp that never trims them. There's folk that do and we just agree to disagree.
I've used the Uniflow powder measure and RCBS 5-0-5 scale for many years with good results. I tried a digital for a while but didn't like it and went back to the 5-0-5. If I ever decide to try a digital again I'll get one of the more expensive ones and hopefully have better luck (or more probably I'll just stick to my tried and true scale until it gives up the ghost).
Measuring devices, like calipers and scales and powder measures, I've come to think you really should pay the extra money once and get a quality item.
I've never reloaded for Casull .454 but for straight wall handgun cases I'm in the camp that never trims them. There's folk that do and we just agree to disagree.
Dano4734
Shooting a 454 trimming you brass to the same size is the only way to go , when your brass is trimmed to the same length your roll crimp will be the same , without trimming the crimp could be lighter or heavier . Some shooters skip trimming every time , keeping brass length exact will turn out trouble free reloads . Especially with a flame thrower like yours.
Shooting a 454 trimming you brass to the same size is the only way to go , when your brass is trimmed to the same length your roll crimp will be the same , without trimming the crimp could be lighter or heavier . Some shooters skip trimming every time , keeping brass length exact will turn out trouble free reloads . Especially with a flame thrower like yours.