New Walther, HK, and P226 today

[wild cat mccane]

Picked up a new Walther Q5 M1 (paddle release) and a new HK P30 V3 with night sights. Both were the same price and both with 3 mags. Both were lower than I’ve seen before.


Interesting observation on mags, the Walther mag is 15rnd and the HK is 17rnd. The mags are the exact the same height when you place them upright on a table. However, the HK mag is significantly more angled, and the Walther is rather straight upright. Just rather interesting observation for pistol given that both companies chased each other on and that the original P99 was 16rnd.


Walther Q5 – this is the second Q5 I own. I just like this set up and at the low price, it was worth getting a second. I also have the Walther Q5 Steel Frame. I admit I like both. BUT the SF does the knuckle rub that it’s known to have where they didn’t smooth part of the tang. I wouldn’t say one is more pleasant than the other, so the Q5 polymer is just a heck of a deal. If you're interested, gun.deals search (https://gun.deals/search/apachesolr_search/4063132855340) and is the current SKU starting in 284 and gets the free optic plate from Walther.


The SF feel nicer, but it is heavier and after a bit at the range I’m not sure that the heavy feel is a positive.


The Q5 polymer M1 is also in the better paddle mag release set up. Walther’s paddle is fantastic. HK has the same paddle release idea, but the Walther is just so much better in shape and function.


-I ordered a Dawson fiber to replace the red LPA 1.5mm optic. I’m learning LPA has a great rep, but I’m keen to see if I can burn the optic bulb smaller than the stock LPA optic bulb which is kinda large.


-I ordered the Overwatch Green and Red trigger springs, but don’t expect to use the comp red spring.


-I ordered 5 20rnd Walther M1 mags. I currently own a few and don’t know what the struggle is with the PDP 18rnd mag, but the Walther M1 20rnd mag has been rock solid for me.


HK P30 – I owned a P30L V3 and hated it. But that was years ago. Couldn’t shake the want again. I decided on the non L version this time. Comes with 3 mags and night sights. The DA is smooth but stacks horribly right at the end. The SA reset is just crazy bad. Thankfully my P30 does not have the slide release rattle. My P30L did. This great, but I’d already resided myself to putting something behind the levers to cushion. Great I don’t have to do that.


I have nothing really nice to say about the trigger, but I’m accepting it for what it is. I had a CZ P-09 too, but that trigger also was terrible. I figured I’d go with the P30 for my polymer trigger gun over the P-07 knowing full well that the P-07 probably could get a better trigger through Cajun works. Grayguns sent me their Reset Kit in 3 days of purchasing. So time to get to work on that.


-Though the description and SKU say the 3 mags are 15rnd, they all are the factory 17rnd with the red followers. Glad I was somewhat lazy on hitting purchase at BeeBe for their super low listed HK magazine conversion kits. Phew. I *bet* at this point that all current production HKs sell with the 17rnd mags regardless of the stock descriptions with 15rnd.


-Gray Guns has a sale right now that I didn’t know about and they aren’t advertising. In cart it showed up and knocked a bit off their short reset. Happy about that.


-I am considering the Lazy Wolf 11lbs hammer spring from hkparts. I am going to see what the Gray Guns reset kit does. They list that it cleans weight a bit, some say it does, but others say they saw nothing.




On my new P226 Elite, I bought it new but the barrel had a rather large hood wear mark. I called Sig and they exchanged for new without issue at all. I have had the P226 since November but let the wear mark sit with me for about a month before calling them and just got the new barrel. Shooting it soon.


Take care!

 

[TunnelRat]

The DA is smooth but stacks horribly right at the end.

The lighter firing block spring in the GrayGuns kit you bought should help. Be careful installing that spring. I find it tends to fold and bend much more than the factory light firing pin block spring.

-Gray Guns has a sale right now that I didn’t know about and they aren’t advertising. In cart it showed up and knocked a bit off their short reset. Happy about that.

If you sign up for the newsletter they've emailed about it a few times. Plus, there's a big red banner on the top of the website (at least from a PC).

I am considering the Lazy Wolf 11lbs hammer spring from hkparts. I am going to see what the Gray Guns reset kit does. They list that it cleans weight a bit, some say it does, but others say they saw nothing.

You can use the Wolff USP springs. They less than half the cost. They don't have an 11 lb. spring, but you could order both a 10 lb. and a 12 lb. For what it's worth I never had light strikes with the 10 lb., but then I don't use anything with harder primers. I tended to like the 12 lb. Wolff.
https://www.gunsprings.com/HK%20-%20HECKLER%20&%20KOCH/USP/cID1/mID26/dID136

 

[wild cat mccane]

I admit i dont know what companies have hard primers?

The problem with hkpro forum is there is no agreement. I thought 11lbs to be safe given that forum wasnt clear, so i appreciate hearing ten worked in your c
ase. I will go for both ten and twelve to try and skip the lazy wolf eleven. Thanks!

 

[TunnelRat]

In my experience (sample of one user) eastern European ammunition that tends to be used by militaries rather than commercial use can have "harder" primers than some others. A lot of what I shoot is Vista Outdoors in some form or another (generally marked Federal or American Eagle), or Fiocchi or Norma. I don't shoot a lot of PPU in pistols these days, or S&B. I did shoot S&B back when I was running the 10 lb. hammer spring, and I don't remember any issues. People use different ammunition and it's not easy to get a consensus at times.

Looking at my notes, the 12 lb. hammer spring gave me a DA around 8 lb. 6 oz., whereas the 10 lb. was 7 lb. 4 oz.

Good luck on your quest with the P30 trigger. I have had a P2000 or P30 in a cart at least a half dozen times, and on hold locally. Then I remember that I never like the P series trigger in HK and I move on. I get the desire. I put the GragGuns kit in a HK45 and it made a difference, but not SIG SRT level of difference. I'll be curious to hear what you think about putting it in a P30. GrayGuns has a guide on YouTube for the installation, if you want/need it. I think it's decent.

 

[wild cat mccane]

Exactly right. I didnt like my p30l for lots of valid reasons. Grip texture wears, rattle levers, bad trigger, vp9 just better in all ways... Those arent changed in this p30. I am just accepting it, but would never defend or suggest they arent better on other guns. Hk, you make a bad trigger for sure.

Dad has to wrap presents. Maybe tomorrow to get the reset kit in. Kinda want to document it. The factory install vid is on an lem trigger not v3.

Dawson optic should be here tomorrow for the Q5. First optic change for me and using the LPA sight.

Take care

 

[TunnelRat]

Dad has to wrap presents. Maybe tomorrow to get the reset kit in. Kinda want to document it. The factory install vid is on an lem trigger not v3.

FWIW it shouldn’t change the process too much. Wouldn’t hurt to document it for others though.

I actually like taking apart the HK P series pistols. Once you do it a few times it’s pretty straightforward and fewer parts than you might think.

 

[wild cat mccane]

You're probably right. When they start taking out the parts I'm curious what's holding them in that I can't see. I'm sure it will be obvious when I finally try it.

I bought the 10lbs spring from Wolf for 8 bucks shipped.

Strangely, it was the Sig forum that seemed to provided an answer that the P30L comes with a 12lbs spring, the P30 comes with a 14lbs spring, none come with the updated fpbs updated though some say it does, and they confirmed it with manuals and part numbers and with recent firearms. The Lazy Wolf guy was part of the convo of that thread, so I'll take that as a trusted authority. So I'll put the GrayGuns fpbs in that comes with the reset kit when I thought it was already updated by HK.

I've read the 12lbs Wolff spring is better than the HK 12lbs spring, so a difference can be felt. How that makes sense, I don't know. But 10lbs is on the way for me

 

[TunnelRat]

Yeah the Wolff 12 lb. spring ends up with a lighter pull than the HK 12 lb. spring. I bought both and I like the Wolff better, which was funny cause at the time I think HKparts was selling that HK spring as a “match” spring. The LazyWolf firing pin block spring (fpbs) is definitely lighter than the factory light spring when I compared the two (I still have a box of all my HK parts, they cost too much to just get rid of them).

There used to be a guy on HKPro, TooSixy, who since started his own website, hkproshop.com (I think he started it, he’s at least heavily involved). He has a number of guides on HKPro and was generally a source of reliable information. He was at times a bit full of himself and didn’t believe me when I first talked about pull weight differences with the two springs. It could be a function of how one company measures spring weight as opposed to the other, or even something as simple as the HK spring being designed for a metric measure that doesn’t exactly correspond to 12 lb.

There have been changes to the pistols over the years and even people with similar years sometimes found rolling changes or whatnot. That’s why I got in the habit of making all of them the same spring baseline when I bought them.

 

[wild cat mccane]

very interesting and helpful. Awesome

 

[wild cat mccane]

The Dawson 0.06" green optic came yesterday. Extremely bright. I can immediately tell it's brighter than the LPA red. It actually glows even in a dimly lit room. Can't wait to put it on.

 

[TunnelRat]

Green has always worked better for me than red.

Not all fiber optic fronts are created equally. Some shroud the optic rod more in an attempt to prevent it from breaking. In doing so they reduce the amount of the rod exposed to light and reduce the potential “glow”. I found this with Truglow TFOs. If I am using a fiber optic it’s because I want it to stand out and I’ll take the added chance of that front breaking.

 

[Ignition Override]

Such a very Cool trio of handguns.

wild cat mccane: your tastes are not only extremely polished but world-class.

Had I understood several years ago whether an average guy could replace a few components at home to reduce/ change the 'stacking' = somewhat abrupt 'tension increase' in a stock HK DA trigger pull, I might have bought either a USP 9mm Compact (or a .40 Compact), possibly a P30.

A German police officer in Nuremberg Train Station pointed to his P30 about three years ago, after I asked him how many years since they carried the Sig P6.

 

[101combatvet]

I had considered the P30 for some time and then the VP9. Ended up with the PDP with a 5" barrel. My only complaint is that at ten yards, I can't see where I'm hitting the target after the first round because all my bullets are going into the same hole.

 

[wild cat mccane]

Thanks Ignition! hahah I think!

Yes. I had the VP9 but think the PPQ has the better trigger and paddle release. It's said the VP9 trigger can be improved, but I looked into it and I don't think it's a small thing, if true at all. I will say the VP9 certainly is flatter shooting than the Walther. And like I mentioned in mags, HK gets 2 more where Walther had to build a new frame for the 18rnd mag. Was very temped for a new VP9, but the new OR 2020 models have strangely jumped $100 and old stock non OR versions/old sight set is the new normal VP9 pricing. lame.

PDP price just dropped a few days ago just like the Q5 I bought. The 5" compact and 4" compact are currently listed at 460, below the Canik Rival, so it makes it a no brainer to go Walther.

The P99 just dropped in price too. I hate the grip hump, but love that system. That and the P2000 might be the last polymer I need before a real 4" P365 comes out.

Now off to convince my self on the P210 next...

 

[wild cat mccane]

Still haven't gotten to the Dawson green replacement on the Q5, but it's simply incredible. It might be hard to see, but there is green being cast onto the paper below. I'm covering it from the light above and it is only picking up ambient light. In full uncovered light, it's the first thing your eye goes to in a view of the room.

Since it's my first optic replacement, I'm the least informed on the subject. But given what I'm seeing, the position that the human eye sees green better, and the performance of the Dawson fiber, I'm going with green here on out.

Pics when I get the guts to cut the factory LPA sight

 

[wild cat mccane]

It is done. Walther Q5 LPA red fiber changed to Dawson green. 1.5mm or 0.06". The camera isn't getting it, but significant improvement for color and brightness.

 

[TunnelRat]

Yes. I had the VP9 but think the PPQ has the better trigger and paddle release. It's said the VP9 trigger can be improved, but I looked into it and I don't think it's a small thing, if true at all. I will say the VP9 certainly is flatter shooting than the Walther.

When I shoot my PDP next to my VP9 I don’t find the VP9 to be that flatter shooting. The VP9 seems to have more of a violent recoil impulse compared to the PDP. That recoil impulse may be shorter than the PDP, but the pistol returns to the target easier with the PDP. I have done a day of steel challenge with each pistol, and I did well with both, but I did a bit better with the PDP. I waffle on selling the VP9, but I still have it for now.

 

[wild cat mccane]

I just looked it up. I bought the VP9 in 2016 and let if go in 2018. I trust I've just ingrained that opinion from that long ago.

I don't think anyone is off for liking the VP9. I just liked the Walthers better.

I'm hopeful that the PDP-F gets the next hit to the coin purse on price, but right now it is the only Walther that didn't seen to get this last two week $100 price dip. $460 for the Compact is tempting, $460 for the "F" and it would be bought without consideration.

 

[TunnelRat]

I just looked it up. I bought the VP9 in 2016 and let if go in 2018. I trust I've just ingrained that opinion from that long ago.

I don't think anyone is off for liking the VP9. I just liked the Walthers better.

I'm hopeful that the PDP-F gets the next hit to the coin purse on price, but right now it is the only Walther that didn't seen to get this last two week $100 price dip. $460 for the Compact is tempting, $460 for the "F" and it would be bought without consideration.

I find recoil can be more subjective than people credit, and that perceptions differ between people. I also seem to recall that HK changed the VP9 recoil spring at some point and went to a stronger one for more reliability. Sometimes stronger recoil springs actually make perceived recoil worse by having the slide go back into battery with more force, so it could be my perception is based on a different recoil impulse than you experienced.

When I have brought both the PDP and the VP9 for others to shoot they generally like the trigger on the PDP more, but the grip shape of the VP9 better. I don’t mind the grip shape of the VP9, I just find the texture a bit lacking.

The only PDP Compacts I used to see for $460 on gun.deals were the ones with the cerakote slides. I got the impression that price was because those models were less desirable. Now I am seeing what you mentioned, where even the black slides are listed for around $460 at some online sellers. In brick and mortar stores locally I still see prices around $600. I wonder if these prices online will hold after the holiday.

I got my F series for around $560 online. I remember you mentioned having smaller hands. To that extent you probably would like it, but as someone with stubby fingers when I shot the regular PDP versus my F series I don’t really find the difference as noticeable as when holding them (handling ends up similar). My F series also has a heavier trigger and the lighter recoil spring, like mentioned above, does create a different recoil sensation. I don’t mind it, but it’s there. Honesty if you still don’t want an optic I think you’re fine with your PPQ, but as someone that likes to try new firearms I can understand if you want one just for that.

I just put a P2000 on hold btw. Back down the rabbit hole I go.

 

[Fishbed77]

Hk, you make a bad trigger for sure.

And yet my USP45 and P30 (V1 Light LEM) are both remarkably accurate and fast shooting. Just goes to show there is much more to making an effective handgun than just the trigger.