Need to stop using the word weapon. What's more appropriate?

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Certainly not accusing the folks engaging in civilized discussion here of militarized machismo. And as far as our gun rights growing...that had a lot of ground work laid and political work done before the YouTube types I'm calling out for making us look bad came to popularity.

Who do you think does us more good? Someone discussing/handling/shooting firearms in a civilized manner including defensive use(without viola in the background kind of civilized) or someone running around the range blasting with his weapon from behind a skull ski mask?
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Did you just change the argument on us? I though the argument was about the usage of the word "weapon?" You mentioned a red herring earlier, you just laid one out yourself here.

To reiterate. Guns are weapons. Is this true or false? If an anti-gunner asked if you carried a weapon, would you lie and tell him no? These are pertinent to the topic. Not FPS Russia and his vendetta against watermelons. If you'd like to discuss that, I'd suggest starting a new thread with that as the topic.
 
RULE II: NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO DESTROY

Conspicuously and continuously violated, especially with pistols, Rule II applies whether you are involved in range practice, daily carry, or examination. If the weapon is assembled and in someone's hands, it is capable of being discharged. A firearm holstered properly, lying on a table, or placed in a scabbard is of no danger to anyone.

http://thefiringline.com/Misc/safetyrules.html

Target firearms are target weapons. Hunting firearms are hunting weapons. Self Defense firearms are self defense weapons. ALL firearms are weapons, every single one.

Brian Pfleuger said:
The trouble is not in calling a firearm something besides a weapon. In fact, I'm not sure I ever use the word weapon in that context. The trouble is in claiming that a firearm ISN'T a weapon.

You can call it a gun, firearm, piece, roscoe, peacemaker, revolver, pistol, handgun... uhg, even platform, I suppose, probably quite a few other names too but whatever name you use, it's STILL...

a weapon.
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Its like those trying to claim a firearm is a tool and not a weapon. They are partially right, all firearms are tools, however tool is synonymous with weapon. Saying a firearm is not a tool, would be just as erroneous as saying a firearm isn't a weapon.

If an individual does not want to use the term weapon to describe firearms, thats their perogative and I support they're right not to. However, if someone tries to insist that ALL firearms are not weapons, they are just plain wrong, mistaken, incorrect, off track, misguided, misinformed and they are barking up the wrong tree.
 
It might be better to call them arms, as in SAAMI (Sporting Arms, etc.), and that's the closest word that means the same thing as weapon. But I guess they could be a tool, too.

Remember the old B-westerns (if you're old enough) when the sheriff was nailing the wanted poster to a tree by pounding it with the butt of his revolver. Those were real Colt revolvers, too.

Mustard and custard!

It's still a firearm even when unloaded and it's not empty if there are still cartridges in the magazine--whether or not the chamber is loaded. If you don't think so, well, tell it to the judge.

But things do change. There is a fairly well known German purveyor of arms and outdoor goods, rather like Cabellas, Franconia, used to be called Waffen Franconia, or I think they were. Wonder if they thought the word Waffen (arms) was bad or, more likely, too narrow.
 
I suppose things will pay out in the courts of public opinion.

In the meantime, know I AM on the side of the 2nd Amendment. I just want us to speak in terms and cultivate an image that encourages others to support our rights (including defense, not just sport/hunting) as well.

-Out.
 
No PC For Me

Some of my firearms are weapons, some are hunting firearms, and orther are target pistols. I name them according to their original design or my intended use.

'nuff said :cool:
 
Some of my firearms are weapons, some are hunting firearms, and orther are target pistols. I name them according to their original design or my intended use.
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*cough* A hunting firearm, by definition, must be a weapon.

I do want to make myself clear. I rarely call my guns, weapons. I'm not saying that weapon is the proper term to use. But, guns are weapons, and no manner of semantic shenanigans will every change that. If you wish to use the term, fine, go for it. If you don't want to use the term, that's fine too. BUT, we all much agree that guns are weapons...anything else is disingenuous.
 
Pizza is not food until you eat it. It could be a hat or a seat cushion.

Give me a break.

If you know psych literature (moi), the appearance of firearms engenders aggressive ideation. Pizza probably doesn't.

I again say that avoiding the purpose of firearms is surrendering the right to have to antis. They postulate that they are aprior evil instruments and necessarily detrimental to society.
 
I suppose things will pay out in the courts of public opinion.

In the meantime, know I AM on the side of the 2nd Amendment. I just want us to speak in terms and cultivate an image that encourages others to support our rights (including defense, not just sport/hunting) as well.

-Out.
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BC while I have been very clear in my disagreement with your assertion that weapons is a word to be avoided when discussing firearms, I do respect your desire for all of us to be good ambassadors representing the gun community. We can disagree on how that is best done, but it is an important topic worthy of discussion. Peace.
 
Pizza is not food until you eat it. It could be a hat or a seat cushion.
Give me a break
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:D

Wow, this thread just keeps on going and going. I myself agree with Glenn et al that avoiding the use of the term is pandering to the anti-gun forces. Call it what it is... a device with the potential for being used to inflict damage/death on the recipient. That doesn't mean that the use of the device is always intended to harm, but it could be.
 
Just to put a little more spin on this thread, if you read the Supreme Court's Miller decision, "weapons" are much more constitutionally protected than other types of guns (assuming that some guns are not really weapons.) Be careful what points you concede. The "sporting use" clause in GCA'68 is a trap.
 
To reiterate. Guns are weapons. Is this true or false? If an anti-gunner asked if you carried a weapon, would you lie and tell him no? These are pertinent to the topic. Not FPS Russia and his vendetta against watermelons. If you'd like to discuss that, I'd suggest starting a new thread with that as the topic.
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No. But I don't carry a BB gun, a Hammerli, or an Anschutz. Those are not designed to be used as weapons.

And honestly there are cases where I will not use the term "weapon" even when it is a gun designed for use as a weapon.

The number one reason is it's usually it's not specific enough- that goes without saying- weapon could 100 different things. "My Remington model 11" is more specific- although my son referred to it as an A-5 last week.

The second reason is I don't feel "weapon" is a suitable term for what boy scouts and cub scouts are training with. Or any other children for that matter. Their mommies will away with their precious little babies in tow. And their babies will stay that way until we see them in an Occupy Wall Street rally, where they have developed into big babies.

IMO, the only way the fight for the Second Amendment will be won is to bring as many people as possible into shooting, not in logical debates with "anti-gunners". In that case, the "W" word turns a lot of people away, and just isn't necessary.
 
No. But I don't carry a BB gun, a Hammerli, or an Anschutz. Those are not designed to be used as weapons.

And honestly there are cases where I will not use the term "weapon" even when it is a gun designed for use as a weapon.

The number one reason is it's usually it's not specific enough- that goes without saying- weapon could 100 different things. "My Remington model 11" is more specific- although my son referred to it as an A-5 last week.

The second reason is I don't feel "weapon" is a suitable term for what boy scouts and cub scouts are training with. Or any other children for that matter. Their mommies will away with their precious little babies in tow. And their babies will stay that way until we see them in an Occupy Wall Street rally, where they have developed into big babies.

IMO, the only way the fight for the Second Amendment will be won is to bring as many people as possible into shooting, not in logical debates with "anti-gunners". In that case, the "W" word turns a lot of people away, and just isn't necessary.
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This is still pandering the the uninformed. I'm not advocating only used the term, or using it all. All I'm trying to say is, a gun is a weapon. The handgun you carry on your hip, is a weapon. All guns (regardless of their actual designed use) have their roots in other guns that were used as weapons.

Again, I don't really use the term when referring to guns of any kind usually, but it still doesn't change the fact that guns are weapons. To say they are not weapons (not saying you're saying this, mainly for the OP who wants to change the term) is a big fat lie.
 
wayeninFL said:
The second reason is I don't feel "weapon" is a suitable term for what boy scouts and cub scouts are training with. Or any other children for that matter. Their mommies will away with their precious little babies in tow. And their babies will stay that way until we see them in an Occupy Wall Street rally, where they have developed into big babies.
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As previously stated, the word weapon is specifically prohibited on BSA ranges per NCS/NRA requirements. Woe be unto the poor instructor who calls a rifle a weapon in front of some of the mothers from som Atlanta troops. Bad day all around for everybody. The kid, the instuctor, the BSA, and the shooting community as a whole.
 
When will all the pc crap end.
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Exactly!

At the risk of sounding redundant, mainly because I'm too lazy to read all the pages, I'll just quote Bruce Campbell, "This is my BOOM stick!". I'm sure the news media would love that. Lol
 
English is both a precise and imprecise language, at the same time

And so are all the other languages I am familiar with. CONTEXT is vital.

Firearms are weapons, as a class, but are also only weapons when used as such.

A given firearms actual use over it's individual life or at any specific moment is irrelevant.
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This, I disagree with. Simply because it is too broad.

Is a butterknife a weapon? After all, its just a small sword....

It is a weapon, when used as such, and people have been killed with them, BUT, we don't generally consider it a weapon, except when used as such.

Guns, as a class, can be fairly called weapons, but to me, any individual gun is only a weapon when used that way.

And note the language used in the 2nd Amendment..not guns, not weapons, ARMS. This, of course, includes guns, but it also includes other things as well.

A bow and arrow is a weapon too, right? but today, we seldom think of it as such. Its not just about semantics, but about the perception specific words engender.

Personally, while, under certain circumstances I have no issue with the term "weapon", I dislike hearing people use the terms "platform" and "operator" and such, and the word "tactical" has been so misused as to almost lose all meaning.
 
SPEMack618 said:
As previously stated, the word weapon is specifically prohibited on BSA ranges per NCS/NRA requirements. Woe be unto the poor instructor who calls a rifle a weapon in front of some of the mothers from some Atlanta troops. Bad day all around for everybody. The kid, the instuctor, the BSA, and the shooting community as a whole.
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This brings up the point I made earlier. I simply can't imagine why you'd be using that word in the context of a typical conversation anyway.

I'm imagining teaching a group of Boy Scouts to shoot. Teaching the four rules, etc.

Where would the word "weapon" come into this?

I don't think I've ever met a person who refers to firearms as "weapons" in ordinary conversation. Not that they AREN'T weapons, it's just not a word we use.

No one says "Keep your weapon pointed down range.", "Put down your weapons." The word would be "muzzle" and "guns". I wouldn't say "Unload your weapons." It would be "guns".

If I'm in hunting camp and a guy walks in, don't say "Put your weapon in the rack, there.", I say "Set your gun down over there."

While in a technical sense, I believe that all guns are always weapons, I also feel that it's a word that simply isn't used in typical conversation. It fits right in with the Mall-Ninja feel of "Platform" and "Operator".

"Alright Operators! Pick up your weapons! We're going to discuss the tactical attachments available for this particular platform!" says the Mall-Ninja.
 
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