My doorbell rings at 2:00 am

Were they cut or pulled?
It isn't impossible for a youth to decide to break something fragile while bored in the middle of the night.

I'd still take it more seriously.

I know this isn't the first thread in which I have taken a stand against double key deadbolts, but...
Building code is quite clear on this issue. All means of egress (ways to get out of the house), such as windows and doors, must be operable from the inside without the use of special knowledge or tools. This is not an arbitrary code, or a code designed to make manufacturers money. This code is written in blood.
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https://www.angieslist.com/articles/are-double-keyed-deadbolt-locks-safe.htm
People really do die in fires because of double key dead bolts. It could just as easily be the owner bleeding out on the lawn because he/she couldn't get the door open and had to climb through the broke window. In a forum where it is generally accepted flicking off a safety is a fine motor movement that will be more difficult in a high stress situation...

Not pretty:
https://www.amazon.com/Doorricade-107250-Door-Bar/dp/B007R6CALC
Much more attractive:
https://www.banggood.com/Home-Gate-...eel-Bolt-Lock-p-1005080.html?cur_warehouse=CN

You would be surprised at how much more difficult kicking a door in becomes those little pins make at top and bottom of door. Having three point is a huge advantage. There are other systems where top and bottom pins are linked in one piece and operated from mid door. The round pins slide easily into a drilled hole. The square ones take some mortise work for no extra benefit.
 
T. O'Heir said:
The phone lines being ripped from the building does suggest more than a prankster. More like some punk looking for an empty house to break into.
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Maybe. Maybe not.

Petty vandalism, such as pulling off the easily seen external phone line, might be to let them annoy the resident without police being called on them.

In other words, not a stupid child prank, but a stupid older/young person prank. Like removing someone's tire valve stems.
 
it does not cost anything to err on the side of seeing this behavior as likely being a prelude to a larger crime. Sure.. it may not be but what do you lose by being vigilant?

Its a little different story if this is in fact a prelude to a more involved crime and its simply shrugged off as childish hijinks.

I know that I said don't over think it but even a cursory consideration would suggest that a knock prank at 2am is counter productive to what a knock prank is. You want a response... you don't want to sit around for 30 minutes waiting for someone to respond to the knock. You also don't want someone calling the cops which only compounds the likelihood that you will get caught. A knock prank does not usually involve ripping of phone lines.

.. I don't think this was a hijinks.
 
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You can call me sick but I would get my Mossberg Mariner and take a seat where I could cover the door from inside the house, then unlock the door and wait. You have to get them in the house before shooting.
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I did something similar when I was 22. I grew up and got a lot smarter since then.
 
I think that good fences make for good neighbors.

I have our home completely fenced and the driveway gated. So anyone at my front door that I didn't let in is trespassing.

I have an intercom at the driveway gate. Push the button and the house landline rings and we can talk, like civilized human beings.
 
People really do die in fires because of double key dead bolts. It could just as easily be the owner bleeding out on the lawn because he/she couldn't get the door open and had to climb through the broke window. In a forum where it is generally accepted flicking off a safety is a fine motor movement that will be more difficult in a high stress situation...

I recall a similar argument against the new seat belt law. Put in two deadbolts, one regular and one double, and get into the habit of unlocking the double when you're home. It's really not that hard of a habit to develop, maybe too hard for Angie's List users though. :p

joed,

When my house was targeted I considered what you are suggesting. But there was this.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/montana-man-charged-with-shooting-teen-in-his-garage/

Now what this guy did was much more than just sitting in one's house and waiting. It's terrible that the country is in this drug epidemic, it's not like it used to be and my local sheriff's department told me so. To use that detective's words "it's everywhere, every county, all over the state."

A few years ago but just before local houses began to be broken into, I was woke up by a loud banging on my back door. I couldn't figure out if it was a dream or not but I picked up the 1911 and flashlight, and made a check of all the doors and windows. In case any members are wondering :p I did not go outside, I know better than that.

It happened again around 5 AM but I was too lazy to check that time. It wasn't long after, a house two doors down had a door kicked in. I went that day and put EZ Armor into my back door jamb. I now have that on all doors and I plan it for all my rental properties also. At some point, all owners will rent to a lady escaping from her violent X.
 
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I have pea gravel around the house as a walkway - you CANNOT walk on that without making sounds; thorny bushes under windows discourages entry there; a LOUD nasty-sounding dog also acts as a great deterrent......
 
Yeh - I have a little VERY barky terrier. People would laugh at it.

The Pinscher / Cattle Dog mix - she is a very quiet dog... AND FAST
 
The story from Montana? Planned, deliberate homicide. Firing four rounds of (buckshot?) Into a confined space with full knowledge that a person was inside that confined space. He may believe that randomly shooting into a dark place with no absolute knowledge of where his target was makes it okay. The thing that makes it bad was that he purposely set the entire scenario up, and couldn't even be certain that he caught the right rat in the trap.

That was a revenge murder imo and that is almost certainly what the prosecution is going use.
 
At some point, all owners will rent to a lady escaping from her violent X.
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Yes, it's incredible the frequency.

A very bad case happened here. Woman in trailer home with son. Spurned man comes, she calls, guy kicks down door, and he follows her to the bedroom. She shot him when he broke down the bedroom door. 911 was still online when she fired.

Interesting part of the story was what the news reported.
the district attorney does not plan to file charges.
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We have a liberal castle law, yet the press thought that she was open to prosecution.
 
I used to live in a fairly high drama neighborhood.Twice that I can recall I got the late night frantic banging on the door.
I guess the fact I had a phone in service was locally unusual at the time.Once it was my neighbor to the north,once it was from two doors south.
One was a daughter saying "Dad's beating Mom" the other was "He's got a knife and my kids are in there"
I let them in and showed them the phone. Then both of them got around to noticing I was holding a shotgun.That how I answered the door.

Then both of them asked "What is that for?"
I told them it was for if he came through my door. They did not seem to like that idea.
With one of those ,later,there was another knock.I had a little glass window up high in the door. I saw it was a LEO. I put my palms on the glass and told the officer I had handgun on me and a Win 97 at the couch.
He said "Good idea.Not a problem.I just want to ask you about....."
 
Bratty children my my neighborhood have a fondness for ding dong ditch. Ripped out phone lines suggests something else entirely. That's pretty frightening.

Sounds like you handled it pretty well, but it's still troubling.

They might have been hoping for an unoccupied house, hence the second ring and moving on when they saw lights. But with cars in the driveway, who knows? It's not good, regardless.

Don't forget to talk to the wife/kids and your neighbors. Now they know the police response time, and 10 minutes is probably enough time to cause some trouble. It would be a shame if someone just opened the door for them.
 
Time to play pretend detective:

"Your wife hired a hitman to take you out! She has an alibi for being at her parents house. The professional knew about your existing landline, the box location, and the motion sensor light. All that was left to do was lure you out and take the shot. Pull her bank statements and follow the money!"

Now on a serious note: It sounds like it might have just have been a dumb attempt at a burglary. Thinking your alarm system was connected to the landline, it was cut. You turning on the light most likely sent them packing.
 
briandg said:
I did something similar when I was 22. I grew up and got a lot smarter since then.
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Remember, The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

By doing nothing you are enabling these criminals.
 
Remember, The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

By doing nothing you are enabling these criminals.
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Your conclusion does not follow your premise and is made of straw. Unlocking your door and lying in wait to ambush and kill the intruder is certainly doing something. I agree with with briandg, that it would be the act of an immature and unknowing person though. Good men don't stop evil by doing stupid things.
 
OK, ringing the doorbell at the wee hours of the morning to see if there are lights turned on is a common tactic for burglaries. If the house is occupied they generally move on. Cars in the driveway would indicate the house is occupied but it's not a sure sign. I've seen numerous B&Es where this exact tactic was used. When the homeowner ignored the doorbell and the house appeared unoccupied, they frequently had their door kicked in. Turning the lights on in an unoccupied room was smart. Ripping the phone lines out was probably directly related to security system signs (some of them still depend solely on a land-line, though that is less and less frequent).

My guess is they rang the doorbell, saw no sign of anyone home, went and ripped the phone lines, went back to the door and rang the bell one more time just to be sure. You hit the lights in one unoccupied room (VERY smart move), they saw that and moved on down the street. Granted it could be stupid kids doing stupid kid stuff, but the phone lines being pulled out suggests otherwise IMO.

In all OP, I think you responded as well as you could have. Good job.

I think we err when we assume "right makes might" in a lot of these discussions. Underestimating those who wish you harm could be a major mistake.
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Fact. There's a saying among cops that "if criminals were smart, our jobs would be hard." Busting a crack head who does something stupid out of desperation for drug money is not hard. Those aren't the only criminals, they're just the ones easily caught. There are professional thieves and burglars who are not stupid. They treat their criminal activities like a business, use risk mitigation strategies (like ringing the doorbell to make sure no one is home), and are much more difficult to make a case on. There are more 30-something year olds with clean criminal records out there that have never had a real job and supported themselves with crime than most realize. Many of them have nice cars and own a home. Underestimating them is dangerous business.
 
joe, the situation was a couple guys feeling up my doorknob. quietl sliding the dead bolt aside to let them in was on my mind. it may be that they were lost, someone yelled 'its over here' and they moved on. it took three minutes or less and i dont know if the cops ever came.

yep, i thought about luring two guys into my house and killing them. that would be a bad thing to do.
 
Here is another great reason why you don't want to be involved in a shooting if you don't have to.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptqyKH6-whM
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This fellow's advice is valid if you intend to deny that you shot anyone, and want to avoid making it easier for the state to prove that you did.

But if you have ever used force of any kind in self defense, you will not be able to do that, nor would you want to try. You will admit to having done the deed, you will want to claim that you did so lawfully, and you will have to present evidence supporting your claim.

The advice in the video will not only prove absolutely unhelpful to you, it may well work against you.

See this:

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/what-to-do-after-a-self-defense-encounter.589272/
 
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