Mitt in MI

Glenn E. Meyer

New member
When I see Mitt yakking about how he is a business man and that's what we need, I think - Hey, isn't he a businessman of the class that sent our jobs overseas and had their head up their butts to produce crappy cars. So, why is that a plus for him? Rich little boy saying anything to win his next toy - the Presidency. Changes position on fundamental issues to cater to the electorate.

Then, I see GWB marching around with a sword and holding hands with a Saudi Prince. Probably trying to set up his job after he goes out of office. Begs the Saudi to lower prices. Well, Bush - you were president for two terms and did nothing to start a Manhattan project or Moon Landing endeavour to get us off our knees to these folks (who contributed most of the 9/11 attackers). King Cheney's company is moving its HQ to Dhubai.

Then, I read this what's below. From the NYTimes (I know) but how can one vote for this shill of the economic conservatives dedicated to their own stock portfolios over the body of the core of American values and work. Rant off.

January 16, 2008
Blue-Collar Jobs Disappear, Taking Families’ Way of Life Along
By ERIK ECKHOLM
JACKSON, Ohio — After 30 years at a factory making truck parts, Jeffrey Evans was earning $14.55 an hour in what he called “one of the better-paying jobs in the area.”

Wearing a Harley-Davidson cap, a bittersweet reminder of crushed dreams, he recently described how astonished and betrayed he felt when the plant was shut down in August after a labor dispute. Despite sporadic construction work, Mr. Evans has seen his income reduced by half.

So he was astonished yet again to find himself, at age 49, selling off his cherished Harley and most of his apartment furniture and moving in with his mother.

Middle-aged men moving in with parents, wives taking two jobs, veteran workers taking overnight shifts at half their former pay, families moving West — these are signs of the turmoil and stresses emerging in the little towns and backwoods mobile homes of southeast Ohio, where dozens of factories and several coal mines have closed over the last decade, and small businesses are giving way to big-box retailers and fast-food outlets.

Here, where the northern swells of the Appalachians lap the southern fringe of the Rust Belt, thousands of people who long had tough but sustainable lives are being wrenched into the working poor.

The region presents an acute example of trends affecting many parts of Ohio, Michigan and other pockets of the Midwest.

Slammed by the continued decline in the automobile and steel businesses, Ohio never recovered from the recession of 2001-2, and blue-collar families who had made it partway up the economic ladder find themselves slipping back, with chaotic effects on families and dreams.

Throughout the state, the percentage of families living below the poverty line — just over $20,000 for a family of four last year — rose slightly from 14 percent in 2005 to 16 percent in 2007, one study found. But equally striking is the rise in younger working families struggling above that line. The numbers are more dismal in the southeastern Appalachian part of the state, where 32 percent of families lived below the poverty line in 2007, according to the study, and 56 percent lived with incomes less than $40,000 for a family of four.

“These younger workers should be the backbone of the economy,” said Shiloh Turner, study director for the Health Foundation of Greater Cincinnati, which conducted the surveys. But in parts of Ohio, Ms. Turner said, half or more “are barely making ends meet.”

One consequence is an upending of the traditional pattern, in which middle-aged children take in an elderly parent. As $15-an-hour factory jobs are replaced by $7- or $8-an-hour retail jobs, more men in their 30s and 40s are moving in with their parents or grandparents, said Cheryl Thiessen, the director of Jackson/Vinton Community Action, which runs medical, fuel and other aid programs in Jackson and Vinton Counties.

Other unemployed or low-wage workers, some with families, find themselves staying with one relative after another, Ms. Thiessen said, serially wearing out their welcome.

“A lot of major employers have left, and the town is drying up,” Ms. Thiessen said of Jackson. “We’re starting to lose small shops, too — Hallmark, the jewelry and shoe stores, the movie theater and most of the grocery stores.”

Shari Joos, 45, a married mother of four boys in nearby Wellston, said, “If you don’t work at Wal-Mart, the only job you can get around here is in fast food.”

Between her husband’s factory job and her intermittent work, they made $30,000 a year in the best of times, Mrs. Joos said. Since last fall, when her husband was laid off by the Merillat cabinet factory, which downsized to one shift a day from three, keeping anywhere near that income required Mrs. Joos to take a second job. She works at a school cafeteria each weekday from 9:30 a.m. to 1 p.m and then drives to Wal-Mart, where she relaxes in her car before starting her 2-to-10 p.m. shift at the deli counter.

Her 20-year-old son went to college for two years, earning an associate degree in information science, but cannot find any jobs nearby. He still works at McDonald’s and lives at home as he ponders whether to move to a distant city, as most local college graduates must. Her 22-year-old son works at Burger King and lives with his grandparents — “that was his way of moving out,” Mrs. Joos said.

In late December her husband landed a new job, driving a fork lift at a Wal-Mart distribution center, a shift that ends at 2:30 a.m. It pays a little less than he used to make and is an hour’s drive away, so gasoline soaks up a painful share of his wages.

“We never see each other,” Mrs. Joos, 45, said on a recent morning as she packed a roast beef and cheese sandwich for her evening meal. “We never even think of taking a vacation.”

Luckily they had paid off their mobile home and an addition they built.

As experienced men in this corner of Ohio have found themselves working for lower wages, others feel they must move.

“I’m ain’t going to work for no $8 an hour!” said Lindsey Webb, 52, who, like Mr. Evans, was one of hundreds laid off when Meridian Automotive Systems closed its local plant. On a recent night, Mr. Webb was helping out in a trailer in front of the old factory, a vigil by the United Steelworkers Union to remind the company of its obligations to former workers.

Mr. Webb, who worked at the plant for 33 years, made more than $16 an hour doing machine maintenance. Now he is thinking of moving to Arizona, taking along his elderly father, whom he helps care for.

Darrel McKenzie, 44, was also a maintenance man at Meridian and grossed more than $60,000 a year. Now he has restarted at the bottom as a union pipe-fitting apprentice and expects to make $20,000 this year. His family just “does less,” Mr. McKenzie said.

Mr. Evans said that moving back into the home where he grew up, after decades of independence, was a stinging reminder that “I lost everything I worked for all my life.”

His mother, Shirley Sheline, 73, had worked 28 years at the same auto parts plant, and shares his dismay. “Can you believe it, a grown man forced to move back with his mother,” she said.

Seeing his desperation last year, she added a room to her house with a separate door.

“I don’t know what I’d have done without my mom,” Mr. Evans said. “At least I can help her, or if I get back on my feet, she can rent it out.”

By contrast, selling his Harley, which he would have paid off this year, was pure torture. He had owned a Harley since he was 20, and weekend cruising with pals was his favorite recreation.

“The buyer said he wanted to take it away in the back of a trailer,” Mr. Evans recalled, “and I said, ‘That won’t happen.’ ”

“Instead I drove it to his house, threw him the keys, came home and got drunk.”
 
how can one vote for this shill of the economic conservatives dedicated to their own stock portfolios over the body of the core of American values and work. Rant off.

Perhaps I missed something here, but what does Mr. Romney have to do with the current state of the US automobile industry, and by proxy, US auto parts manufacturers?
 
He rants about his business experience being the determinant for voting for him - esp. how he understood MI. I don't see how most American big business executives have the moral standing to claim that they will help bring jobs back to the little guy.
 
He rants about his business experience being the determinant for voting for him - esp. how he understood MI. I don't see how most American big business executives have the moral standing to claim that they will help bring jobs back to the little guy.

He is a very successful businessman. What does being a big business executive have to do with "moral standing"? If not "big business", exactly who does provide jobs for the little guy?
 
So are you asserting the Romney has caused jobs to move outside of the US? If so, how has Romney specifically done this? How many jobs is Romney responsible for eliminating in the US?

Please, let us know the specifics, because it sounds like you are basing your opinion about Romney causing job losses on the fact that:

1. Romney is a successful businessman; and

2. Romney is "rich."

If those are the only bases for your opinion, then I think that it's a real stretch.
 
I claim in my rant that he comes from a social and business class that contributed to the problems of the working man. Being a successful business man lately usually comes out of the hide of the working man for the benefit of the stock holder.

His sincerity on the gun issue, gays, abortion and the like suggest to me that he is less than an upright person.

But vote for him if you must. I don't think being a successful big business man counts for crap.
 
I claim in my rant that he comes from a social and business class that contributed to the problems of the working man

Right. Again........exactly where does this "working man" get his job if not for big businessmen? The tooth fairy?
 
Right. Again, how is Romney specifically responsible for job losses in the United States?

Someone might not like rich, successful businessmen like Romney, but that certainly doesn't justify the assertion that Romney is responsible for job losses in the United States.

I must be missing something here. :confused:

Edited to add: Glenn, I'm not trying to be a jerk, so sorry if I'm confused.
 
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If you want to find the source of the plight of the US auto industry look no further than the UAW. I have no problem with the concept of unions and keeping workers from being exploited. But,I remember quite well making $10 dollars an hour, trying to buy a car, and the UAW striking over a $40 an hour contract. Seems they will finally manage to destroy the US automobile industry. If they were going to make those premium wages seems like they could have at least made cars as well as the Japanese.
 
Heres Mark Steyns take on job loss

This week's issue of The Economist has a heartrending vignette from one of the most ruthlessly capitalist industries on the planet:

"In 2006 EMI, the world's fourth-biggest recorded-music company, invited some teenagers into its headquarters in London to talk to its top managers about their listening habits. At the end of the session the EMI bosses thanked them for their comments and told them to help themselves to a big pile of CDs sitting on a table. But none of the teens took any of the CDs, even though they were free."

"That was the moment we realized the game was completely up," an EMI exec told the magazine. In the US, album sales for 2007 were 19% down on 2006. Don't blame me. I still buy plenty of CDs. But that's because I like Doris Day, and every time I try to insert one of these newfangled MP3s into my fax machine it doesn't seem to play. But if you're not Mister Squaresville and you dig whatever caterwauling beat combo those London hep cats are digging on their iPods, chances are you find the local record store about as groovy as the Elks Lodge.

Now there are generally two reactions to the above story. If you're like me, you're reminded yet again why you love capitalism. It's dynamic. And the more capitalist your economy, the more dynamic it is. Every great success story is vulnerable to the next great success story — which is why teenagers aren't picking their CDs from the Sears-Roebuck catalogue. There's a word for this. Now let me see. What was it again?

Oh, yeah: "change." Innovation drives change, the market drives change. Government "change" just drives things away: you could ask many of the New Hampshire primary voters formerly resident in Massachusetts. Nevertheless, between Iowa and New Hampshire, almost every presidential contender found himself lapsing into boilerplate assertions that he was the "candidate of change" – or even, as both McCain and Hillary put it, an "agent of change", which sounds far more exotic, as if they're James Bond and Pussy Galore covertly driving the Aston Martin across some international frontier, pressing the ejector button and dropping a ton of government regulation on some hapless foreigners.

But it's capitalism that's the real "agent of change." Politicians, on the whole, prefer stasis, at least on everything for which they already have responsibility. That's the lesson King Canute was trying to teach his courtiers when he took them down to the beach and let the tide roll in: Government has its limits. In most of the western world, the tide is rolling in on demographically and economically unsustainable entitlements, but that doesn't stop politicians getting out their beach chairs and promising to create even more. That's government "change."

What's the second reaction to that EMI story? Perhaps even now John Edwards is rallying the crowd at the last CD mill in America's declining rap belt, comforting the nine-year-old coatless daughter of a laid-off mill worker who started there in 1904 making wax cylinders of the Columbia Male Quartet singing "Sweet Adeline," and later pressed million of 78s of Ukulele Ike singing "Who Takes Care Of The Caretaker's Daughter While The Caretaker's Busy Taking Care?" and millions of 45s of the Swinging Blue Jeans singing "The Hippy Hippy Shake," and millions of CDs of Three 6 Mafia singing "Hit A Motherf-----," only to be cut down in his prime and thrown on the scrapheap because Americans have outsourced their record collection to the computer. "I will never stop fighting for you," Edwards will be telling them. "No matter how they try to stop me. I feel the spirit of Al Jolson speaking through me. He's saying climb upon my knee, Sonny Boy, though you're 53, Sonny Boy, I'll never stop condescending to you…."

Heigh-ho. "They" can try to stop Edwards, and if by "they" you mean primary voters in New Hampshire, they're doing a pretty good job of it. But what's going on over on the Republican side? John McCain demonizes Big Pharma — i.e., the private pharmaceutical companies that create, develop and manufacture the drugs that all these socialized health care systems in every corner of the planet are utterly dependent on. He voted for Sarbanes-Oxley, a quintessential Congressional overreaction (to Enron) that buries American companies in wasteful paperwork and hands huge advantages to stock exchanges in London, Hong Kong and elsewhere. But why stop there? McCain is also gung ho for all the most economically disruptive Big Government solutions to "climate change." Apparently, that's the only change these candidates aren't in favor of. When it comes to the climate, McCain and Hillary are agents of non-change. John McCain has an almost Edwardsian contempt for capitalism, for the people whose wit and innovation generate the revenues that pay for your average small-state Senator's Gulf Emir-sized retinue of staffers.

As for Mike Huckabee, last seen comparing his success in Iowa to the miracle of the loaves and fishes (New Hampshire, alas, was loaves-and-fishes in reverse: he took his Iowa catch and turned it into one rotting fishhead in Lake Winnipesaukee), in Thursday night's debate he was attacked for raising taxes in Arkansas. "What I raised," riposted the Huckster, "was hope."

Terrific. In a Huckabee Administration, nothing is certain but hope and taxes. Did he poll-test the line? Was it originally "What I didn't raise was tobacco?" Or did he misread the line? Did he mean to say "hogs?" Is there any correlation between taxes and hope? If you cut taxes by 20 per cent, does hope nosedive off the cliff? Not for those of us who were hoping for a tax cut. And is there any evidence that he "raised hope"? Hope of what? Huck's line is a degradation of FDR: We have nothing to hope for but hope itself.

Barack Obama, of course, called it "the audacity of hope." I'll say. Those London music-biz execs must look at primary season and marvel. In what other industry can you clean up with such insipid bromides?

"So what you selling today?"

"Well, we got two products. Over here, on this bare shelf, we've got 'Hope.' And over here, in this entirely empty display cabinet, we've got 'Change.' Or you could go for one of our two-for-one packages, 'The Hope Of Change,' or 'A Change Of Hope.'"

In the midst of the world's lousiest Presidents' Day sale, let us give thanks to the Democratic voters of New Hampshire who took a cooler look at Barack Obama and decided that the audacity of hope was perhaps less audacious than shameless. Senator Obama seems a perfectly pleasant fellow, if somewhat cravenly in thrall to every cobwebbed Democratic piety. However, his platform is platitude piled upon platitude. As Barack floats off to the gaseous uplands of soft-focus abstract buzzwords, it would be nice if Republicans could have their feet planted on something firmer than Huckabee's big-government mush. Like those teenagers surveying the table of EMI CDs, grown-up voters should look at the display of anachronistic freebies peddled by politicians singing the same old songs, and coolly walk on by,.

http://www.nysun.com/article/69436

While Mitt isnt mentioned by name, his pandering to the auto industry in Mich fits right in, yes.

In this election, it will come donw, as far as I am concerned, to selecting the candidate who will pander least.

WildandthatsgonnabetoughAlaska ™
 
And what does that have to do with pandering?

It doesn't. Your insinuation was that he would be on your list because he
would be the candidate who will pander least.

He wouldn't be on my list for the above three reasons.
 
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