minimum distance for a .22lr shooting lane

simonrichter

New member
Since I have a relatively long, unused room in our basement, I was thinking about converting it into a shooting lane for my 22lr mouse gun. Thus, what do you suppose is the minimum range you need (given that good ventilation and a non-ricochet target area is provided for)?
 
Define "good ventilation" first - a fan in a window does not qualify

25 yards is nice but most do not go that far unless you breach a wall and out in a tunnel ( a friend did just that)
 
Ventilation is going to be a very key issue. You can make a range almost anywhere. As a kid, I've shot in one 22 "range" at a relatives, that was in the standard sized garage. Guessing it was ~ 20-25 feet long. Way to short.
There are some backstops you can make / buy that will absorb errant shots, but there is something comforting in having anything that can be ricocheted off of further away.

Good luck, be safe.
 
For an indoor range...

Get a good air rifle instead. It works better inside (safer), no ventilation issues and you can spend as much or as little as you like.

I can't imaging trying to sell a house with lead contamination in the basement from a shooting range.
 
There was a post a while back about lead contamination for shooters. A few people had lead tests done and shared the results or shared past results. Not a lot of data, but maybe the most data available on the subject anywhere.
People who shot indoors regularly, even at commercial ranges, seemed to have problems. Reloaders and those shooting pellet guns did not. You can buy lead test kits at some hardware store. Take one to acommercial range and wipe it on any surface.


That being said, I don't imagine you NEED anything over ten feet.
I have 15 yards across my basement diagonally for shooting my pellet gun. Even so, I don't use it often. I think I would WANT ten meters at minimum and 25 would be better, with 50 being best.

At somepoint I will buy a PCP gun and then I probably will shoot it inside.
 
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As others have said, airborne lead contamination will be a huge issue unless you have crazy amounts of ventilation; if you do, then it will just be a small issue, but it will still be an issue.

Please, don't even think about doing this if there are any kids in the house or any pregnant women or women who might be pregnant in the future.

Ask anyone who shoots .22 suppressors how much lead collects in them. That's only a partial amount of the lead that comes out of the gun; lead that will end up in your basement. If you have industrial-quality ventilation some of that lead won't stay in your basement, but a lot will. And I doubt you have industrial-quality ventilation.

I took a .22 Sparrow suppressor apart the other day that had about a 1000 rounds through it. Powdered lead showered all over the place and there was plenty of lead caked on the internals. That's all lead that would have come out of the gun if there hadn't been a suppressor attached.
 
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Seeing as the NRA has a 50 foot small bore target, I'd say 50 feet is close to minimum. Allowing for wiggle room and a safe bullet stop, 20 yards is a good choice.
 
Thanks for pointing out the lead issue, I wasn't quite aware that this is such a big deal...

In the meantime, I'll convert the measures you have provided into metrical ones :)
 
Lead is a very real issue in indoor ranges. Apparently, most of the airborne lead comes from the lead styphnate priming compound rather than the projectiles, hence the move (at a glacial pace, but moving nonetheless) to non-lead primers. For your own health, you can reduce the hazard by wearing a half-face respirator with P100 pancake filters while shooting, as I and most of the shooters on my pistol team do. I've sampled surfaces in indoor ranges and the lead accumulation is, in the ranges I've sampled anyway, not as bad as one might think - but it's not zero either. The recommendation to shoot an air pistol in your home basement instead is a good one, and that's what I do. No hearing protection needed either.

In terms of distance, I see you're in Austria so official NRA targets are perhaps not particularly important for you, but the shortest-range NRA competition target is for 50 feet (just over 15 m) and there are training/qualification targets available that are scaled for 25 ft (7.6 m). Air pistol targets are for 10 m. In terms of safety, when I was younger and didn't know about lead issues I used to shoot into a standard commercial .22 bullet trap like this one at 25 ft and had no problems. I use the same trap now for my air pistol and it works fine, with an occasional bounce-back from time to time, which is no problem if you're wearing (as you should) safety glasses.
 
With the steady improvement of realistic airguns, that shoot very much like .22s, there's really no reason to shoot .22s at home.
I used to have a 10 yard .22 range in our basement, but long ago, switched to airguns.
No measurable difference for home practice.
Much safer and cleaner all around, too.
Here's a few to review:

The PX4 blowback pellet pistol - http://www.pyramydair.com/video-details/275

PPK blowback bb - http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Walther_PPK_S_Black_BB_gun/120

1911 blowback airsoft - http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Colt_1911_CO2_Blowback_Airsoft_Pistol_Full_Metal/2537

For rifles, the break barrel or side cocking spring powerd pellet rifles have center fire recoil and terrific accuracy.
I use mine at 10 yds with tiny targets, like 1/2 inch diameter or smaller.
 
Thanks, especially FlyFish, for the interesting input. Just one more question concerning lead: Of which quantities of shooting do we speak here? Is there a significant amount of lead expectable after 50 or 100 shots or are we talking something in the ranks of 1.000+ shots after this becomes a real issue?
 
50 feet equals approximately 15 meters. This is not a "minimum" for anything. The NRA has a set of 50-foot targets because that is the distance at which formal, indoor bullseye competitions are shot. You can certainly get a lot of good practice at shorter distances.

I shoot at an indoor range. The targets are on electrically-powered overhead cables, so they can be stopped at any distance out to the maximum available, which is 75 feet (23 meters). However, the range has three rows of lights, which are set at distances of 25, 50, and 75 feet. I would guess that probably 75 percent of shooters never shoot at targets farther away than 25 feet (7.62 meters). If you can get even 5 meters (16 feet), that is far enough to be useful for practice. Just use targets with smaller bullseyes. ("Aim small, miss small.")

However, do not minimize the concerns already expressed about lead. I am an Army veteran. I use the Veterans Hospital for health care, and my annual physical exam includes having blood drawn and analyzed. A few years ago, my doctor informed me that the level of lead in my blood was alarmingly high. I realized that I had been doing a LOT of shooting at the indoor range. I restricted my shooting by a very large amount, which included terminating my participation in competitions at that range, and six months later my blood lead lever was back down to below the alarm threshold. It has remained at a safe level since, but I am shooting a lot less than I used to, and a lot less than I am happy about.

This is a commercial range that is set up with HUGE exhaust fans at the far end, and a duct behind the shooting positions that provides fresh air directly behind each shooter in order to ensure that lead and other contaminants are carried down-range, away from the shooters. Even that wasn't enough. I have spoken to at least one other frequent shooter who had a similar experience.

My house has a crawlspace under one end. This does not have enough height for ever a short person to stand up, and so it is mostly unused. I once thought it would be a nice idea to set up a bullet trap and shoot .22 firearms down there. After the scare with the blood lead levels, I abandoned the idea.
 
Thanks, especially FlyFish, for the interesting input. Just one more question concerning lead: Of which quantities of shooting do we speak here? Is there a significant amount of lead expectable after 50 or 100 shots or are we talking something in the ranks of 1.000+ shots after this becomes a real issue?

That's a tough one, Simon, and I don't have a straight answer for you but perhaps I can give you some idea of the amount of shooting that can result in problematical exposure to airborne lead.

The amount of shooting necessary to increase airborne lead to levels that can result in elevated serum (blood) concentrations high enough to be a health risk (10 micrograms per deciliter [mcg/dl] is the generally accepted "safe" upper limit for adults here in the US) depends on a number of factors, such as: centerfire vs. rimfire (and based on both your original post and my personal experience, what we'll be talking about is .22LR), the amount (volume) of air in the range, and the effectiveness of any ventilation.

Most of my data comes from a very poorly ventilated range - essentially one box window fan in the wall - with 10 lanes (maybe 12 meters wide?) and about 3 m ceiling height, with a length of about 20 m. My pistol team either competed (in season) or practiced (in off season) once per week, with about 7 shooters shooting perhaps 100 rounds each per session.

That amount of exposure was enough to raise the serum lead of our team captain, who probably had shot in that range for several years at the time, to 62 mcg/dl, which is dangerously high by any standard. My own serum lead was at 26 mcg/dl, which in Massachusetts, where I was at that time, is sufficiently high that it has to be reported to the state Department of Public Health, who then issues you a letter discussing occupational exposure and your rights as an employee, obviously of no particular value in this case.

We both started wearing half-face respirators with the pink P100 pancake filters - exactly like this one, but otherwise didn't change our shooting habits. In my case I also took particular care to wash my hands well after shooting because ingestion is another source of exposure, but I'd pretty much been doing that all along anyway. After one year, his serum lead was down to something in the 20s (can't quite remember exactly) and my own had come down to about 12 mcg/dl. I relocated at around that time, so I know nothing of his history after that. In my case, after two more years I was tested again and was down to 7.6 mcg/dl and I've remained under 10 since then.

I'm shooting in a range with somewhat better ventilation now, but I still wear the respirator, as do most of the other shooters on my pistol team. For me, it's simply a part of my protective equipment, no different from my ear muffs and glasses, and I'd feel naked without it.

I also did "wipe" samples of surfaces in the range and found, much to my surprise frankly, that they were only slightly elevated for lead and well within applicable guidelines. We also sampled the air when the range was not active, and there were no problems there either. So, from all of that I concluded that the issue is really airborne lead rather than particulate lead on the floor and other horizontal surfaces, though I'm sure enough shooting can result in problems with that as well. Our range was a multipurpose room that was only used as a range the one night each week that we were there, so that may be why we didn't see problems on surfaces.

My guess is that if you can get some good ventilation going - the NRA guideline is a minimum flow of 1 foot-per-second downrange - and limit your basement shooting to a few rounds every now and again you're probably going to be OK. I wanted to shoot a bit more than that in my own basement, primarily as practice for competition, so I went the air gun route and now I can shoot as much as I want without worrying about any of it. It's also relatively simple, here at least, to add lead to the list of analytes for your annual physical so you can check on things and get some early warning if you're getting too much exposure, then make adjustments as necessary.
 
Lead poisoning, Massad Ayoob...

Lead, toxic substances, fumes, odors, etc can be a big problem in indoor gun ranges.
Some places are better than others.
You can now buy improved lead-free training rounds in common handgun calibers; .45acp 9x19mm .40S&W .357sig etc.
It's a growing part of the shooting sports industry in 2013.

As for a indoor gun range, be careful. Several years ago Massad Ayoob, a top use of force trainer & sworn LE officer wrote a gun press item about how a LE agency firearms instructor died of lung cancer. :eek:
The cop was 34 & a non-tobacco product user. He worked mostly on a indoor range doing police re-quals for a large agency.
Ayoob said he wore a mask on some indoor ranges to filter out the lead particles & toxins.

Clyde
 
Lead issues aside, and to the point of te OP, why not 21 feet, or seven yards (plus backstop, and shooting line space)?
That is the common distance for CCW training, and qualification in most states.
 
How about lead contamination on our clothes and shoes?
What is the risk of bringing it into our cars and homes, after returning from the range?
 
Based on FlyFish's statement that his test of surfaces at the range showed relatively small concentrations of lead, it would seem that the primary concern isn't what settles out on to surfaces (including your clothes and the floor--to be transferred to your shoes).
 
Thanks Flyfish, and other random thoughts

Thanks for the link to the mask. I decided to order one. I found one from amazon for about $14 with free shipping after I included another needed item to my order :)

I've worn an N95 mask a couple times at my local indoor range. I remember one of the employees making fun of me a little. I ended up giving up on the idea I guess.:rolleyes: My range is only a couple years old and claims to have a great top dollar state of the art ventilation system. However in the pistol side of the range I've noticed when shooting some of my .22lr handguns (buckmark or single six for example) I'll get a pretty decent cloud of "smoke" from the 6-10 shots I just fired. The cloud will pool up and swirl around, frequently back into my face before it finally thins out and is carried down range.

I've also noticed that the air coming from behind seams to turn on and off, rather than a constant flow of air.

I figure from this point on, I'll go ahead and wear a mask at least when I'm shooting .22's at the indoor range, and maybe with all handguns just to be safe. But when it comes to rifles, you can bet I'll be leaving the mask at home or in the range bag.

As for shooting inside your house in the basement. I think lead contamination is a real serious thing to consider. I've just read up on Radon levels the last couple years, and tested my basement, and found it to be a level of "11" and the highest "safe" level is something less than "4" if I remember. I actually know a guy who has lung cancer now and had previously spent a long time living in a basement, he's pretty sure it was the Radon... He's only in his mid to late 30's. Radon is the second leading cause of lung cancer, right behind smoking.

I'd love a shooting range in the basement... In fact there are quite a few of us who are guilty of popping off a few rounds of .22 in a basement at one time or another. But for me personally, already having high Radon levels, the last thing I'd want to do is start adding lead to the problem. As things are right now, when I spend any amount of time in the basement, I have two windows open, one with a fan blowing air out so that it sucks fresh air in from the other, then I have a couple more fans circulating all the air around though the whole basement.

For any of you who dont know what Radon is. It is a type of gas that comes from the breakdown of uranium in soil and rocks. It is literally everywhere. The average outdoor level is 0.4 pCi/L. Warmer air inside your house rises and creates a vacuum as well as other vents and fans creating a negative pressure, which in turn sucks the radon gas in to the house through cracks in the foundation, crawl spaces, and many other areas. If your Radon levels are 4.0 pCi/L or above it might be worth taking action, especially if you spend much time in the basement. Also, the Radon from your basement will likely be circulating through the rest of your house through your homes HVAC system. This can be of more concern during winter months when we all have our houses sealed up tight.

As for distance on an indoor shooting range, I'd say anything goes. Any distance of shooting is worth practicing so long as it's done safely. But obviously the longer the better because it gives you more options. I shoot as close as 3 yards at my indoor range every great once in a while just because I can... and it's fun to see if you can put all your shots through the same hole as your first shot without making it any bigger. Heck you could practice at only 1 yard if you really wanted too, and I know that a lot of people do, but they are usually outside shooting at paper with a dirt backstop a few yards behind their target.

My apologies for the Radon rant... Did my best to stay on topic :)
 
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Based on FlyFish's statement that his test of surfaces at the range showed relatively small concentrations of lead, it would seem that the primary concern isn't what settles out on to surfaces (including your clothes and the floor--to be transferred to your shoes).

I'd just like to clarify that I agree with that statement but the important word is "primary." My data regarding surface contamination, which I'm confident are valid because I do this sort of thing for a living, are nonetheless limited to one, perhaps atypical, range. Also, children are much more susceptible to lead than adults, so someone who has rug rats at home may very well want to be concerned with bringing lead home on clothes and shoes.
 
I think it depends on what and where you swabbed. I suspect a lot of any lead precipitating out of the air will be a few feet in front of the muzzle, on the floor. I know when they mop down the concrete floor at the range where I shoot, they wet it down first to prevent stirring up lead dust on the floor. I don't know how effective that is, but that's what they do.
 
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