MEXICO suing US firearms manufacturers

[Lima Oscar 7]

Be sure of this: Should the Mexicans be successful, other American industries and businesses will be ripe for the picking. There are many levels and intents with this litigation and none are beneficial to average Americans. I won’t veer off topic or bore you with the details except to submit one word: Sovereignty.

 

[zukiphile]

Dale, while international courts may tend to not be fond of America, suing a manufacturer in a nation where a product they manufactured causes harm in another nation after being ILLEGALLY imported is probably a bright line sticking point of “not going anywhere.” The more appropriate target of that suit would be the individuals who introduce the item in the country.

Commenting on a case just from a MSN blurb is fraught with peril, but I think you've identified one problem with the complaint.

This appears to a be a suit for money damages. How was the Mexican government harmed? is there any part of their alleged harm that wasn't most proximately cause by a criminal act of people under its governance or who were actually agents of the Mexican government?

If every factual allegation in the complaint were indisputably true, would Mexico still lose this on the law?

 

[101combatvet]

Maybe Mexico needs to build a wall to keep our guns out?

 

[44 AMP]

If every factual allegation in the complaint were indisputably true, would Mexico still lose this on the law?

Based on the limited (and likely flawed) reporting of the case, I don't see how their allegations can be true, in actual fact. But that doesn't stop people from believing they are true. OR acting on that belief.

What frightens me most, is that too many otherwise sane, rational seeming adults accept the concept that things cause evil, and therefore the makers of such things are responsible for the harm resulting from that evil.

Wasn't that concept essentially discredited and disproven with the ending of the Dark Ages? I know those in power kept it alive in their legal systems, you can find its current manifestation in our seizure laws. "Evil" things were forfeit to the Crown (or the Church) and both local and higher officials profited by that, in the past. And while current US law is aimed at preventing the individuals enforcing our laws from making a personal monetary profit, there are other kinds of profit, more subtle in nature.

I notice that in recent years the tactic often being used to demonstrate gun maker's "responsibility" for third party criminal acts is to blame the gun makers advertising.

How can someone claim to uphold the concepts of free speech, and particularly FREE WILL and yet somehow refuse to accept that we have free will when it comes to guns "forcing us" to commit criminal acts? That the guns themselves, NOT the people pulling the triggers in violation of law, are the cause??

So, 11 (or so) American gun makers are supposed to be the cause of Mexico's violence and murders?

Are they going to try and sell us a bridge next??

 

[Aguila Blanca]

¡En oferta ahora! El puente de Brooklyn. ¡Cómpralo pronto!

 

[LeverGunFan]

Are they going to try and sell us a bridge next??

Bridges? We don't need no stinkin' bridges!

With all due apologies to the "Treasure of the Sierra Madre", the dialog of which is often misquoted.

Sadly, whether this suit makes it to court will likely depend on the judge and his/her political views, rather than the merits of the case.

 

[Lima Oscar 7]

Totalitarian regimes since the beginning of time have used critical theory to study all of the different groups within a society. Then those groups are pitted against each other via the use of specific tactics such as Hegel’s dialectics whereby the government creates a problem and their solution always results in the people losing more freedom. The process continues with other issues until there no freedom.

The Deep State is getting a double whammy with this law-fare by pitting pro-gun against anti-gun and anti-immigration against pro-immigration. Thus, this lawsuit is part of much larger effort. Thesis: Guns are bad - Anti-Thesis - Promote and implement Lawlessness to create fear so great the public will clamor for a solution. Synthesis - Enact laws exchanging perceived freedom for perceived security.

The whole gun issue is a carefully devised wedge to divide and conquer America. The Mexican suit is just one tactic in the grand plan. It’s imperative that no matter how much we disagree with our fellow Americans that we love each other.

 

[101combatvet]

Totalitarian regimes since the beginning of time have used critical theory to study all of the different groups within a society. Then those groups are pitted against each other via the use of specific tactics such as Hegel’s dialectics whereby the government creates a problem and their solution always results in the people losing more freedom. The process continues with other issues until there no freedom.

The Deep State is getting a double whammy with this law-fare by pitting pro-gun against anti-gun and anti-immigration against pro-immigration. Thus, this lawsuit is part of much larger effort. Thesis: Guns are bad - Anti-Thesis - Promote and implement Lawlessness to create fear so great the public will clamor for a solution. Synthesis - Enact laws exchanging perceived freedom for perceived security.

The whole gun issue is a carefully devised wedge to divide and conquer America. The Mexican suit is just one tactic in the grand plan. It’s imperative that no matter how much we disagree with our fellow Americans that we love each other.

You can; I can't! I consider anyone that is against American traditions as the enemy.

 

[Lima Oscar 7]

For sure this is not a good deal and it is being used by sone evil people with nefarious intents to bring our Republic down. It appears that the venue has been hand picked for the desired outcome. Or, it could be a bluff to see if the gun makers will settle. I hope Sig understands if this plays out in Mexico’s favor, it won’t be the end of such law-fare and they will be in the legal crosshairs down the road. I have always thought the manufacturers should have avoided capitulating to all of the Anti-Gun States and Cities that mandated conditions ergo the myriad of tyranny in CA. I feel it will come back to bite them.

Off-topic material removed by staff

 

[44 AMP]

I consider anyone that is against American traditions as the enemy.

I agree, PROVIDED you include in those American traditions, the right to free will, to make your own choices, to disagree with "mainstream" thought and
traditions" and the right to be wrong, about it.

The real enemy of America are those people who say "you have to do it my way or you're the enemy"...and who use their power to force compliance in one way, or another.

I'm not arguing for anarchy only against forced compliance with what is today's version of "group think", where it seems we often go way beyond overboard.

 

[Metal god]

Lol

Removed off topic by staff while staff post an intire post that is off topic haha .

Anyway I'll post this again because nobody commented on it , maybe it was missed or deemed unworthy of comment . If this case goes to discovery , can the gun manufacturers bring up fast and furious . Resulting in the ability to circumvent the executive privilege order by the Obama admin and opening up those fast and furious records for discovery ?

 

[Shane Tuttle]

Removed off topic by staff while staff post an intire post that is off topic haha .

That happens about 99% of the time.


Oh, not because your claim the thread is off-topic. It's because the failure of comprehending the difference between discussing L&CR with a focus on firearms from focus on political idealologies (sp).

Since it appears you, and a few others, have completely missed the mark, here's what I would HIGHLY recommend doing.

1. Refrain from publicly criticizing Staff on enforcing the rules that YOU SPECIFICALLY AGREED to follow. You have a problem with us? Take it to PM or email and offer an intelligent/thoughtful conversation with a proposed solution to the problem you have. Wanna be snarky? I would just move on. We all have full time jobs on top of trying to provide fair moderation on our free time with zero compensation. The last thing we honestly want to do is deal with unreasonable comments that does nothing to make TFL a better place. We spend enough time as it is to read through comments with far more noise than signal, clean them up, and deal with those that refuse to read/follow TFL's rules. You may not think it's a big deal. Over the years, I've received compliments from members that appreciate us keeping threads on-topic so they don't waste their time trying to separate the wheat from the chaff. And THAT'S a big deal to me...making sure members that come on here aren't wasting THEIR time.

2. Reread post #24 in this thread. Reread, as in, read and comprehend the proper context of the content.

3 Reread this Sticky Post in the same manner as item #2: https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=313714

Al Norris didn't author L&CR to be a loose ship for a reason. If anyone STILL doesn't get it after reading L&CR's rules, then take into deep consideration to not post in it at all....just as the rules stated.

 

[Metal god]

Well I guess I don't have anything more to say on that but maybe my signature line can help people understand where I was coming from and this is the reason it's there .

 

[Mulebuk Mojo]

If this case goes to discovery , can the gun manufacturers bring up fast and furious .

Only if the court a.k.a. Judge allows it and apparently from what I read in this thread the puppet masters shopped a court in Boston so good luck with all that. If it goes to court and as someone else mention here it will be what side of the isle they lean politically and in Boston, well you get the drift I'm sure.

Of course if the gun manufactures as well as the ammo manufactures cared enough the nonsense could all end tomorrow when they announce no more guns and ammo for the cops and the military.

But like the NRA, they are as full of do-do as all the rest of them. And only work for Wall-Street.

 

[Frank Ettin]

Enough