Mexico asks UN to stop Arizona ranchers

Oatka

New member
A nice "unbiased" article via the AP.

"When the state can not or will not defend it's citizens, then the citizens will do it themselves" (paraphrased) California Vigilante 1850.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/051800/mexico_migrants.sml

Vigilante Violence in Border Areas
Main Topic of Mexico-U.S. Meeting
Updated 8:19 p.m. ET (0019 GMT) May 18, 2000

Vigilante ranchers in Arizona have been hunting down and even shooting at illegal Mexican immigrants who cross the border onto their property, the Mexican government complained to the United States Thursday.

The issue — which has aroused passions south of the border and may lead to a lawsuit by Mexico against the ranchers — dominated Thursday's bilateral meeting between U.S. and Mexican officials in Washington.

In recent weeks, Mexico has accused ranchers living in the border area near Douglas, Ariz., of hunting Mexicans in a vigilante campaign to make citizens' arrests of immigrants who trespass on their land. In the last year, two migrants have been killed in that area and seven others wounded, according to Mexico.

Mexican Foreign Minister Rosario Green said her country would do everything it could to ensure that violations of the rights of Mexican migrants are investigated and punished. Green had said late Tuesday that the law firm Zuckerman and Associates had been contracted to put together a case against the ranchers.

Ranchers Claim Damage to Property

Ranchers say their immigrant roundups are in response to the lack of action by the U.S. Border Patrol and accuse the illegal immigrants of damaging their property, leaving garbage in their trail and of defecating on their land.

Over the weekend, a group calling itself the Concerned Citizens of Cochise County, Ariz., and the California-based American Patrol, a citizens' group that also seeks to stop illegal immigration, announced plans for a "Shadow Border Patrol" that would "keep track" of the U.S. Border Patrol's actions.

Roger Barnett, a Cochise rancher who has participated in illegal immigrant roundups, said there were no other options. "It's just out of control," he said in an interview.
"The U.S. government is not protecting its citizens."

Doris Meissner, commissioner of the Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS), told reporters outside the commission meeting that the ranchers had legitimate concerns.

"A senior person from the Arizona U.S. Attorney's Office is here at this meeting. We will discuss this today to see if any law was broken in that case. If there was a law broken, we will do whatever we can to ensure that there is the proper action taken in the county," Meissner added.

Mexico Calling on the U.N.

Around 9 million Mexicans, often looking for a better life and better-paid jobs, live in the United States. Many of them do not have resident permits and enter illegally through the desert and inhospitable mountain ranges that lie along the 2,100-mile border.

Green told The News of Mexico City there had been 32 vigilante incidents since January 1994, 27 of them in Arizona, 15 allegedly involving one family of ranchers near Douglas.

Fair treatment of its citizens has long been a demand of Mexico City, while critics north of the border argue Mexico alone must carry the blame for the fact that hundreds of its citizens try to sneak across the frontier every day in search of jobs and livelihoods.

Illegal immigrant abuses are extremely hard to prosecute because in most cases the only witnesses are the undocumented aliens themselves, who are usually unwilling to testify in court because of their illegal status in the United States.

The Mexican foreign minister said a United Nations special envoy for immigration issues would visit the U.S.-Mexico border to look into the accusations that the ranchers were abusing and mistreating Mexicans crossing the border illegally.

— Adrienne Bard in Mexico and Reuters contributed to this report

© Associated Press.



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The New World Order has a Third Reich odor.
 
Oatka, I'm with you on this one. What's confusing is that both demos (Clinton) and repubs (Bush) have laid down on the issue.
 
If there have only been 32 vigilante incidents since January, those people need some help. Was talkin to border patrol friend bout a month ago and he said that as many as 400 invaders come across in the Douglass area PER NIGHT !

Also, let us not forget that some of the illegals are citizens of countries other than Mexico. Just a handy border to cross for many nationalities.

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Sam I am, grn egs n packin

Nikita Khrushchev predicted confidently in a speech in Bucharest, Rumania on June 19, 1962 that: " The United States will eventually fly the Communist Red Flag...the American people will hoist it themselves."
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Shin-Tao:
If that isn't a sign of a dying Empire I don't know what is.[/quote]

Which Empire are we talking about Shin-Tao?

Best Regards,
Don



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The most foolish mistake we could make would be to allow the subjected people to carry arms; history shows that all conquerers who have allowed their subjected people to carry arms have prepared their own fall.
Adolf Hitler
 
You have two choices. Out of the two, wich one would most likely be considered an empire, or dying?
Mexico-same political and economic situation it has had for decades.
The United States-Declining superpower with porous borders, inadequate military, and morbidly apathetic population rife with obtuse techies.




[This message has been edited by Shin-Tao (edited May 18, 2000).]
 
This has been in the AZ Republic for about a week now.Updates every day.Possible solution?
Charge the Mexico goverment the cost of returning every illegal we catch and ship back.Cost will depend on where they are caught.If they will not pay we take some land from them or oil!!!!!!!!!!!
If cash it can be used to update the border patrol and hire more officers.

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beemerb
We have a criminal jury system which is superior to any in the world;
and its efficiency is only marred by the difficulty of finding twelve men
every day who don't know anything and can't read.
-Mark Twain
 
Was talkin to border patrol friend bout a month ago and he said that as many as 400 invaders come across in the Douglass area PER NIGHT !

I don't think people illegally crossing into the country automatically qualifies them as invaders. Invaders implies they are trying to take over or subjugate the population. In this case, they are trying to find better paying jobs than are available on their side of the border. Kindof funny how our government is doing its best to make it easier for capital to flow across borders while denying people the same opportunities.
 
Have there not been reports of the Mexican army crossing the border and shooting at the US Border Patrol? THAT IS INVASION. There are parts of the border where narco gangs have taken over ranches and farms to allow better access of their "goods" by the use of force. THAT IS INVASION.

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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
 
Annexation is the solution.

Should have been dun during the Mexican War but …



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“This is my rifle, there many like it but this one is mine …”
 
Scott, annex Mexico? You've GOT to be kidding. How about we keep the food and Dos Equis and throw the rest back?

UN in AZ... yeah, I'd like to see that.
 
First, if a person is on your property without your permission, they are trespassing. Citizen arrest is certainly valid, and you have the right to enlist the aid of others in executing such a lawful arrest.

Second, the Sovs have admitted that they infiltrated spies and even Spetznaz (special forces) troops through the Mexican/American border so I think treating them ALL as potential invaders is legit.
 
I am tired of the typical newspaper style sheet use of the word "vigilante" to describe ranchers protecting their property or women stopping muggings.

Let's all go to the dictionary and look up the word:

Vigilance Committee -- a volunteer committee of citizens organized to suppress and PUNISH crime summarily."

The ranchers are not lynching the illegals. They are holding them for the Border Patrol. You might also want to look up the word "Summarily."

Rick
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>UN in AZ... yeah, I'd like to see that.
[/quote]

Just wait until some of those ranchers have their property "appropriated" for use by the UN peacekeeping troops. Oooooh, that would be ugly!
 
Even though Fox News didn't write the article, I pointed out the perils of blindly using a release from the notably anti-gun AP.

I also sent them the following definintions (bold italics mine). I think it would be good to keep handy to remind others:

Hotmail dictionary -
Main Entry: vig.i.lan.te
Pronunciation: "vi-j&-'lan-tE
Function: noun
Etymology: Spanish, watchman, guard, from
vigilante vigilant, from Latin vigilant-, vigilans
Date: 1865: a member of a volunteer committee organized to suppress and punish crime summarily (as when the processes of law appear inadequate); broadly : a self-appointed doer of justice

Microsoft Word '97 Thesaurus - "Vigilante"
guard, patrol,sentinel, protector, defender, paladin (like that one - Oatka), guardian



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The New World Order has a Third Reich odor.
 
Those folks from Aridzona have got some stones. I know. I married one. She keeps mine in her purse and lets me borrow them on occassion.

Back in the 1930's the Arizona Governor dispatched the Nation Guard with orders to shoot it out with federal troops during a dispute over a proposed damm on the Colorado River. The feds backed down and the state had a say in the construction of Hoover Dam.

My dad cowboyed for a big ranch in New Mexico. He spent some in a line-shack in the Animas Valley, which is a natural land route to cross the border with Mexico. He would drag a clump of brush along the ranch boundry in the morning and at noon would head back toward the cabin. Any cows that crossed his drag marks he would run down and herd back across the border. He told me that many times he would come home and find that Mexicans had come through and stopped at his shack while he was chasing cows. He said they never stole and if they ate anything from his supplies he would find the shack swept, his bed made, wood split and stacked, and sometimes a fresh stack of tortillas under a damp dishtowel on the counter.

Good and bad in all folks. But, times do seem to have changed.

I planted strawberrys beside Mexican field workers, one summer. The hardest $17.50 a day I ever earned in my life.

William
 
I would like to recommend Remarque's "Floatsome" and "Arch of Triumph" for a different perspective on migrants. Seeing as I got lucky and just flew into this country (11th anniversary coming up next week...and I still have the TFL gift for the tenth anniversary on my belt
_folded.jpg
)...some people have to walk.

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Oleg "peacemonger" Volk

http://dd-b.net/RKBA
 
folkbabe ouote:
"I don't think people illegally crossing into the country automatically qualifies them as invaders. Invaders implies they are trying to
take over or subjugate the population."

Maybe you would not feel that way if you lived in Southern Kalifornia like I do.

The correct term is indeed...INVADERS.

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"Lead, follow or get the HELL out of the way."
 
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