hangglider
Moderator
I'm surprised about this outcome. An idiot kid in a car or truck trying to steal something from a neighbor does not rise to the level of clear and imminent danger of serious injury or death. Things are just things.
Merry Christmas, The Police Just Left My House
- Thread starter Joe_Pike
- Start date
Double Naught Spy
New member
LOL, the law does not favor the criminal. I am not sure why you thought it was obvious that the drunk was trying to get inside. All you know is that he broke your window and that he was milling about around your car. You said it yourself that you had no indication that the guy was trying to open the door.
I failed to see anywhere that TexasJustice7's statement included anything about firing blindly or without identifying the target.
There are also cases where a person's own child has broken in for the purpose of doing harm to a parent or where a neighbor kids have broken in to do harm to the occupants. Just because the intruder is family or from the neighborhood does not mean that the intruder is there with good intentions.
DNS, he said he would fire without warning. How would he "identify" a neighbor he hasn't met yet?
I know people who have had drunks show up at the wrong house. I know a guy who dropped a drunk off at a wrong house - a third party gave him a dyslexic address. I know diabetics who get lost and act very strange when low blood sugar strikes.
You would be amazed at how rapidly my mother-in-law has those come on. She no longer drives... Complete disorientation.
TexasJustice7 would not visually "identify" any of these. Shooting without warning could lead to some nasty nightmares. At least in his Vietnam Nam example, people were actually trying to harm him.
It is entirely possible he has a checklist of things he would look for, to help him decide whether to shoot. He hasn't described such, though - he has just said he can shoot, because he is in Texas...
I know people who have had drunks show up at the wrong house. I know a guy who dropped a drunk off at a wrong house - a third party gave him a dyslexic address. I know diabetics who get lost and act very strange when low blood sugar strikes.
You would be amazed at how rapidly my mother-in-law has those come on. She no longer drives... Complete disorientation.
TexasJustice7 would not visually "identify" any of these. Shooting without warning could lead to some nasty nightmares. At least in his Vietnam Nam example, people were actually trying to harm him.
It is entirely possible he has a checklist of things he would look for, to help him decide whether to shoot. He hasn't described such, though - he has just said he can shoot, because he is in Texas...
TexasJustice7
New member
The difference between us is that I live in an fairly dangerous area and in an apartment complex. I know people in law enforcement who say to let go when the door starts to heave. I at least would wait till I saw what I was shooting at. I have no check list. It takes a lot of force to come in my door, there is one way in and one way out, no back door. I will not go thru a checklist, administer a breathalizer test to determine if the intruder is drunk nor an IQ test, nor an age questionaire. While I was doing any of those the criminal might be shooting me. Once they get by me my blind disabled daughter has no defense, and is like a three year old and might be their victim. I will not become a victim to satisfy your sense of fairness with dealing with an intruder, who breaks in my door. I don't fight fair. Thats like saying I would pick up a pipe if the guy has a knife. When I got my permit, I made the decision then if I were ever confronted by an intruder, carjacker, homeinvader, or jihadist, that I would use deadly force to defend myself or my daughter. I don't care what others think or do in that respect. Some would say that one ought to retreat in the home as far as possible. There is no duty to retreat in Texas, so I will stop the bull at the point of entry, not after he breaks in and roams around. As I said in other posts, lots of people do not approve of our laws in Texas. I do and I abide by them. If someone has a teenager that is tempted to break into homes they need to raise him in some other State that is more tolerant of criminals. Someone breaking down my solid door locked with deadbolt locks, is not some drunk who just wondered up to my door and kicks it in. I am no different in this respect than most of the people who live in the area where I live. So as I said, I respectfully disagree on this issue, but you can defend your home however you like. This is the way I will defend mine if someone
comes through my heavy deadbolted door.
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TexasJustice7, for the past several years I lived in FL and then GA. Full Castle Doctrine, Stand Your Ground states. Laws are fairly similar to Texas law, with some exceptions - I would not advise shooting to recover property, for example.
What the law allows and what the conscience will tolerate are not always aligned.
You just said you had no checklist, but then you said your only point of entry was a heavily (by which I assume you mean multiple locks) deadbolted door. That is a checklist of sorts: is this person using brute force on what is obviously the wrong door?
You then added another factor - you have a disabled child behind you, so a safe retreat may not be feasible.
So whether you realized it or not, you have been checking a list.
What the law allows and what the conscience will tolerate are not always aligned.
You just said you had no checklist, but then you said your only point of entry was a heavily (by which I assume you mean multiple locks) deadbolted door. That is a checklist of sorts: is this person using brute force on what is obviously the wrong door?
You then added another factor - you have a disabled child behind you, so a safe retreat may not be feasible.
So whether you realized it or not, you have been checking a list.
TexasJustice7
New member
There is a reason that management put those multiple locked deadbolted doors in. I do think the laws in Florida and Texas are similar, although I have not studied Florida laws. Too confusing to study all of them unless I plan to go there. I am probably one of the few old vietnam veterans taking care of a disabled daughter, who was premature at birth with many problems.
I cannot retreat from a carjacker if she is in the vehicle as if she were left in a hot parking lot she would not know to get out of the vehicle. Likewise at home if the intruder gets past me, she is defenseless. Thought about buying a home where I live, but as a disabled veteran with health problems I am fearful that I cannot sell the property if I had to move closer to a VA hospital.
Laws vary between Lousiana and Texas as well on deadly force with regard to the castle doctrine. In Lousiana one must be inside the vehicle to use deadly force against a carjacker, but not in Texas. I assume that this is still the case in Lousiana.
My apartment is an advantage with only one door, and entry through a window would be fairly difficult. That means the best place for me to stop an intruder is when he kicks the door down. If there were a fire, however, it is the only reasonable way out. Some people have dogs, so I don't need a dog
to warn me, as they will bark if there is some unusal activity. It would be cheaper to buy than to rent an apartment in this area. While I don't have
a burglar alarm I sleep in front of the deadbolt door with three handguns within reach. I don't think a BG can get past me, but I worry more about
the parking lot. That is one reason I began pocket carry of a 38 in a pocket holster. Can be ready without drawing. One of my brothers, a police officer originally advised me against pocket carry but it works for me. Biggest problem here is not gang activity as much as drug heads, meth labs etc. I do keep a police scanner on, which helps, (originally I got it to listen for police calls one of my two brothers in law enforcement was involved in). Several nights ago one of my police friends I have coffe with in the mornings was called to a location because a man pointed a shotgun at someone outside the store. At the store I meet with my police friend several months ago there was an unsuccesfull robbery. And the apartment complex management has improved things, but at one time this area had lots of
problems with drug activity, prostitution etc. Fortunately there is an onsite
manager, otherwise I would move.
Laugh out loud all you care to. It was extremely obvious to me he was trying to enter the house. You don't break a door window with dead bolt access next to it just for fun. You don't rip the mail box off of the house next to the front door without being agitated that you can't get in the front door because it's locked. Opening the breaker box door just reeks of someone that is funloving and out for a good time. I SAID I WAS ASLEEP AND DIDN'T HEAR THE DOOR KNOB RATTLE!! That doesn't mean it didn't and I believe any reasonable person would assume the same thing I did and that the guy was trying to get in.
The cop told me himself that it was a "book and release". Nothing will ever come of it. You can't force them to pay for the damage, so, how does he not come out a little better than I do? I'm the one with the clean-up and repair. I'm the one that had to deal with the adrenaline overload and lost sleep. He spends the night in the pokey and goes home the next day. Poor kid.
Justice06RR
New member
Good to hear it was nothing crazy and you reacted appropriately!
good thing you were collected during this. I wouldn't have even bothered with clothes personally. He can see me naked for all I care if it makes him stop trying to get in the house. Drunk is drunk, they will do stupid things.
I read an article I think that was posted on here about some guy who tried to break in the door of a couple, he kept trying until he got shot after multiple warnings. he thought it was his own house and ended up dying from the wounds. natural selection works.
in your situation that guy is lucky he didn't get in your house. very lucky to be alive
I read an article I think that was posted on here about some guy who tried to break in the door of a couple, he kept trying until he got shot after multiple warnings. he thought it was his own house and ended up dying from the wounds. natural selection works.
in your situation that guy is lucky he didn't get in your house. very lucky to be alive
checkmyswag
New member
Clothes?
Judo Gi?
Go no gi next time, harder for the potential intruder to grapple with you.
In all seriousness, cool. Things that go bump in the night are often nothing, but always good to be prepared.
I recently bought a small Streamlight with strobe function. 130 lumens or so? Definitely a good option to have at night indoors/up close, temporarily blind someone so you can retreat, attack or hip toss.
Judo Gi?
Go no gi next time, harder for the potential intruder to grapple with you.
In all seriousness, cool. Things that go bump in the night are often nothing, but always good to be prepared.
I recently bought a small Streamlight with strobe function. 130 lumens or so? Definitely a good option to have at night indoors/up close, temporarily blind someone so you can retreat, attack or hip toss.
With regard to clothing... if I had time, I'd put on a pair of pants and sneakers. This has nothing to do with vanity or shyness, and everything to do with utility.
First, my spare tire does not hold spare magazines very well. I might want one of those... or a light... or a cell phone... or a spare gun. You get the idea.
Second, I can move faster, more surely, etc on my trail-runners; I'd rather have something on my feet, if surprised at close quarters.
Third, the police might be a bit unsettled by a naked man with a gun, when they arrive.
Again, this assumes that there is time. Since I usually have a pair of pants near the bed, and since my trail-runners have quick zip kevlar closures, that means the time required is pretty short.
First, my spare tire does not hold spare magazines very well. I might want one of those... or a light... or a cell phone... or a spare gun. You get the idea.
Second, I can move faster, more surely, etc on my trail-runners; I'd rather have something on my feet, if surprised at close quarters.
Third, the police might be a bit unsettled by a naked man with a gun, when they arrive.
Again, this assumes that there is time. Since I usually have a pair of pants near the bed, and since my trail-runners have quick zip kevlar closures, that means the time required is pretty short.
)Reminds me of a quote from one of Jim Cirillo's books. He was questioned by a lieutenant after a shooting as to whether he had identified himself as a police officer. "Yes, but I don't think they heard me over all the shooting."
Sometimes things happen fast. When it's time to shoot, don't talk. Shoot. Otherwise, you might end up like that guy in the Burger King in Miami a couple of years ago. Or worse.
You can train yourself to talk while drawing - a few words might keep you from having to shoot. Of course this is 'situational' - IF you have the time to talk.
Then there is a school of thought (centered on the East Coast) that if you shoot and then shout, the onlookers, conditioned by TV, will all swear you shouted first. But today, with cell phones cameras everwhere, I would not try it. Allways tell the truth, it amazes your friends and confounds your enemies.
Then there is a school of thought (centered on the East Coast) that if you shoot and then shout, the onlookers, conditioned by TV, will all swear you shouted first. But today, with cell phones cameras everwhere, I would not try it. Allways tell the truth, it amazes your friends and confounds your enemies.
In some situations, you might as well. In other situations, you might want to keep your mouth shut and avoid drawing attention to yourself.
For example, if someone is walking through my home at night with a weapon in his hand, (more akin to the situation at hand) he's not going to know what hit him. If someone confronts me on the street with a knife or baseball bat 20 feet away, I might yell "drop your weapon" as I'm drawing.
I don't put much stock in people flappin' about I'd have done this and I'd have done that. Unless they've been in a similar situation before most people don't know what they will really do until it's THIER turn. That being said I love the idea that you had a gun and you went and got a BIGGER gun.